I Need 12's!!!

[1badTalon]

I was wondering what a good way to get my car into the mid-12 second range (hoping for low 12's), as in what turbo, intercooler, and other supporting mods would be required. My father knows someone who knows his stuff with tuning, so I'm all set there.

 

[Quasimondo]

This guide would be a good starting point.

 

[EvolvingGST]

well I will make this the simplist most cost efficient way for you.

SAFC
Manual Boost Controller
Fuel Pump 190 LPH
550cc injectors
FMIC (you can use the Ebay one, its a quality piece. Only thing I have ever got from Ebay but be prepared to cut with a hacksaw or recipricol saw)
1G BOV (aftermarket bov but the 1G and greddy are direct fit to that kit.)
intake pipe and get a recirc tube.
and Evo 16g (you will need to buy a J-pipe to the FMIC) or a T28

This should get you well within the 12s with good driving.

However this is if you are using race gas and you want to do it the cheapest way possible. You might want something larger so please give us long term goals instead of short term goals. Because those injectors, fuel management, fuel pump, turbos are really only good for those numbers. And I assume that he will be using a wideband for you when tuning so that you wont need a data logger.

I would also suggest doing a boost leak test and a compression test to know where you are from the start.

 

[IslandTSI]

He will need a logger setup in addition to that list, even with a wideband its something that is very helpful.

 

[snox135]

Since you have a 95 you probably have a eprom ecu. If you do just get DSMLink instead of SAFC. It's a much better method of tuning and you don't need to buy a seperate logger.

 

[IslandTSI]

And more than $400 more expensive. DSMlink is a great tool but the safc and logger can work well on a budget setup.

 

[unlmtdndeavor]

things to consider:

1. maintenance first
2. do things right once (don't go cheap, pick a long term goal like stated above)
3. budget

if you want a low 12 second car, build for an 11 second car, that way you have some leg room

now for me, a nice 12 second daily driven car would be about 300awhp on a mustang dyno:

- 50trim or 30r
- matching exhaust manifold for the turbo choice
- extreme psi fmic
- tial 50mm bov
- 880cc injectors
- walbro 255lph hp fuel pump
- turbo back exhaust
- dsmlink
- progressive methanol injection
- act 2900 with disk of choice
- wb02
- map sensor
- a knowledgeable tuner experienced with dsm (trust me, these cars can be finicky)
- good tires

 

[IslandTSI]

Add a fpr to that list as well

 

[ziggys95tsi]

possibly have the valves oversized with valve springs and camshafts too. that will make it easier to reach 11's too.

 

[420a-t]

I dont want to bench race, but I am also wanting to get 12's this year. I'm not sure if I should invest in a bigger turbo or not for that. (s16g) Any suggestions?

 

[unlmtdndeavor]

Add a fpr to that list as well

not necessary. 400whp on a mustang w/o it. my friend as well...just tune it out with dsmlink

 

[unlmtdndeavor]

possibly have the valves oversized with valve springs and camshafts too. that will make it easier to reach 11's too.

cams maybe, but no headwork necessary. if you plan to do oversized valves, do the full porting on a 2g head as well. but thats way overkill

 

[unlmtdndeavor]

I dont want to bench race, but I am also wanting to get 12's this year. I'm not sure if I should invest in a bigger turbo or not for that. (s16g) Any suggestions?

high 12's is possible on that turbo. just make sure you have a good tune on the link. and if you want to run race gas...it's easily obtainable

 

[400awhpgsx]

not necessary. 400whp on a mustang w/o it. my friend as well...just tune it out with dsmlink

It all depends on the setup. A walbro 255 will overpower the stock fuel pressure regulator if it is being used aggressively with larger injectors. You can always check out the time slips on the board and look at peoples setups. That's what I did. People are usually glad to answer any questions about their setups and how they achieved their goals via pms.

 

[Its_MyGsx]

http://dsmtuners.com/forums/timeslips.php?&do=12seccars

Try looking at some of the people who have allready achieved this point and take into consideration there modifications, but all in all you will need a more effiecient turbo and intercooler with higher boost levels and the fuel to match it so,

evo 3 16g - good for 400 whp ( pm me if you want a used one for cheap. )

ebay fmic kit - cheap and good , with many great reviews to back it.
315$ish

650-850cc injectors - i would get a little larger then needed to keep the duty cycle nice and low
260-300$ depending on the size.

walbro 255 - or a 190 to avoid having to buy a FPR and the 190 is rated to nearly 400hp
90$

manual boost controller- which i run. could probably get away with 20-25psi if you add a splash or race fuel.
ebay sells some for less then 10$

maf translator- very cheap, easy instalation ,and a very useful tuning tool, set your injector size ,relocate your mafs, so most boost leaks dont hurt your tune and you can properly vent your bov with no ill effects ,and tune your low, mid, and wot.
200$ ish depending on where you get the gm mafs


hope i helped.

 

[unlmtdndeavor]

It all depends on the setup. A walbro 255 will overpower the stock fuel pressure regulator if it is being used aggressively with larger injectors. You can always check out the time slips on the board and look at peoples setups. That's what I did. People are usually glad to answer any questions about their setups and how they achieved their goals via pms.

is 1000cc injectors with a fp3052 at 28psi aggressive? or a 2.3 stroker with 1000cc injectors and a gt35r at 25psi.

 

[blcknspo0ln]

http://dsmtuners.com/forums/timeslips.php?&do=12seccars

Try looking at some of the people who have allready achieved this point and take into consideration there modifications, but all in all you will need a more effiecient turbo and intercooler with higher boost levels and the fuel to match it so,

evo 3 16g - good for 400 whp ( pm me if you want a used one for cheap. )

ebay fmic kit - cheap and good , with many great reviews to back it.
315$ish

650-850cc injectors - i would get a little larger then needed to keep the duty cycle nice and low
260-300$ depending on the size.

walbro 255 - or a 190 to avoid having to buy a FPR and the 190 is rated to nearly 400hp
90$

manual boost controller- which i run. could probably get away with 20-25psi if you add a splash or race fuel.
ebay sells some for less then 10$

maf translator- very cheap, easy instalation ,and a very useful tuning tool, set your injector size ,relocate your mafs, so most boost leaks dont hurt your tune and you can properly vent your bov with no ill effects ,and tune your low, mid, and wot.
200$ ish depending on where you get the gm mafs


hope i helped.

I won't go nuts flaming you because you tried, but there is a lot of misinformation. An e316G or any 16G variant WILL NOT get you to 400 whp, period. Unless you're SBR on a fully built motor running a sick amount of boost, you will NEVER see 400 whp.

ebay kit - DEFINITELY. I have one and it's awesome.

550's is pretty much the norm for a 16G. IDC will shoot up at around 85-90% depending on the boost level. I wouldn't go past 660's for a 16G, however.

Do it right, do it once. Walbro 255 and aeromotive FPR. Set your base fuel pressure and forget about it forever. TRUST ME, i battled with a 190 for 3 years before wising up.

MAF-T; That would opinion, I guess. I've never seen a MAF-T serve more than a venting unit. In most cases it does the same job as a stock 2g MAF except you don't get the cool venting sound.

SAFC: I like the SAFC much more (I like Link even better!) You can tune your lo/mid with these.

Oh yea, just to give you an example. A MAF-T and/or an SAFC will only tune out 50% air. On a 50 trim, 24 psi, I was leaning out the SAFC -41% on 660's. This gave me stupid high timing and ultimately didn't do too much. My suggestion? 550's with methanol injection and an SAFC2. If you have the funds, 750's with DSMLink.

I could go on for days, but searching is much easier.

 

[MyÜberFastGSX]

Save your money and do it all at once.

 

[mygsx2120]

First, to the op, please search. This site has very clear upgrade paths. You guys have been giving great advice to the op, but is spoon feeding him really the best idea?

Secondly, don't try to go from 15's to 12's all at once. If you were to save and install everything at once and then there were problems, you would have idea where to start looking because you have new turbo, tuning, fuel setup, etc. Even if you save and buy everything at once, only install one part at a time, or in pairs, such as fuel pump and AFPR. That way if you run into problems along the way (which every build does) you will know what new part is causing it. Good Luck

 

[endlessMyk]

Completely OT, but that's 2 threads within the past day that have been about hitting 12s...

Anyway. Good luck with your build. I wouldn't go with a 16g, if you hit your goal, you're going to be maxing out that turbo, which will just be asking for problems. Like someone else said, build it up for more.

 

[scottsee]

blcknspo0ln hit it on the head....

endlessMyk, Evo316g's max around 42-44lb/min. I hit 12.4 on 37lb/min @ 2200 feet on a shit tune... 12's on a 2g/evo316g = easy sauce..

 

[1badTalon]

Alright, guys, I really appreciate the help. I'd like to say that I'm not going to be buying any performance parts within 6 or 7 months, all I'm doing is trying to lay some foundations and start a plan.

Also, if you check out my pictures at this point, performance is not my priority just yet. The guy who had the car last thought he was an expert in a bodywork, so there's plenty of things to keep me busy, not to mention the tune-up its been long overdue for.

 

[Its_MyGsx]

I won't go nuts flaming you because you tried, but there is a lot of misinformation. An e316G or any 16G variant WILL NOT get you to 400 whp, period. Unless you're SBR on a fully built motor running a sick amount of boost, you will NEVER see 400 whp.



550's is pretty much the norm for a 16G. IDC will shoot up at around 85-90% depending on the boost level. I wouldn't go past 660's for a 16G, however.

Do it right, do it once. Walbro 255 and aeromotive FPR. Set your base fuel pressure and forget about it forever. TRUST ME, i battled with a 190 for 3 years before wising up.

MAF-T; That would opinion, I guess. I've never seen a MAF-T serve more than a venting unit. In most cases it does the same job as a stock 2g MAF except you don't get the cool venting sound.




Oh yea, just to give you an example. A MAF-T and/or an SAFC will only tune out 50% air. On a 50 trim, 24 psi, I was leaning out the SAFC -41% on 660's. This gave me stupid high timing and ultimately didn't do too much. My suggestion? 550's with methanol injection and an SAFC2. If you have the funds, 750's with DSMLink.

I could go on for days, but searching is much easier.

Well i have a feeling his funds will be insuffufficient for what you have suggested if funds werent a problem then i would have added and changed alot of things.

I have an evo 8 fuel pump that i purchased used for 25 dollars and it has allready gotten me into the low 12's. with high intentions and capabilites to accel even further.

the maf translator can not only set your injector size ( base ) but it can ALSO tune meaning you can richen or lean it out, and the maft v1.02 can be set up to 1030cc injectors without playing with any low mid or wot knobs i would say thats a little more then 50%

what about brute i think his name is with the gvr4 who is making over 400 whp
and if slowboyracing can do it why cant anyone else?

http://www.slowboyracing.com/downloads/dyno graphs/Evo-III-16G/E316G Tubular vs. Cast.JPG

it <b> obviously </b> flows enough air to yield over 400 whp and 459 ft lbs of torque .

 

[Its_MyGsx]

I won't go nuts flaming you because.

its against the rules... right?


<3 lisa

 

[unlmtdndeavor]

Well i have a feeling his funds will be insuffufficient for what you have suggested if funds werent a problem then i would have added and changed alot of things.

I have an evo 8 fuel pump that i purchased used for 25 dollars and it has allready gotten me into the low 12's. with high intentions and capabilites to accel even further.

the maf translator can not only set your injector size ( base ) but it can ALSO tune meaning you can richen or lean it out, and the maft v1.02 can be set up to 1030cc injectors without playing with any low mid or wot knobs i would say thats a little more then 50%

what about brute i think his name is with the gvr4 who is making over 400 whp
and if slowboyracing can do it why cant anyone else?

http://www.slowboyracing.com/downloads/dyno graphs/Evo-III-16G/E316G Tubular vs. Cast.JPG

it <b> obviously </b> flows enough air to yield over 400 whp and 459 ft lbs of torque .

then again, you have to take into consideration what dyno the numbers are coming from. inertia rollers will always show inflated numbers. in the case of the dynapack, already the numbers will be inflated due to being attached straight to the hubs. dynojet, its just a huge roller. id like to see someone push 400 on a mustang dyno. shit, its a pain to get that thing to 300whp on a stock block on a loaded dyno like the mustang or a dyno dynamics.

tell me, what are the rest of the mods on that 400whp slowboy car? what kinda boost levels etc. race gas? etc. a 400whp on a loaded dyno, e16g running pump gas and a stock block...HA...good luck