Ebay coil overs+tokiko blues...need help on coil over sleeve
I got some tokiko blue (non adjustable) shocks and a set of ebay coil overs. I want to use them , and hopefully they work out okay for me. (i've heard ALL the bad storries). My problem is what way do the allen wrench screws in the sleeves face? DO they go to the bottom near the stock spring perch or up towards the dust boot?
They seem to "mis-align" from a lip that's on the shock because the set screws land on the weld right there and tend to want to slide up and off of it, so that way 3 little allen screws would be holding the entire weight fo that corner. Doesn't sound right, but there's no screws long enough to secure it on the dust boot end.
Several sizes of O-rings came with teh kit, but from all my searching i found that most of the time you put one under each sleeve to avoid rattling. DO these screws need to be tight, or are they just "rattle revention" as well? I wouls assume they need to at least hold the sleeve in place. I have also seen an o-ring used where teh sleeve rests on teh spring perch on the shock and has one to stop it from rattling.
THE SPRINGS SEEM WAY TOO SHORT , but maybe it's just the lowering .
the parts are lais out how they were in teh box ( well, only the soring, sleeve and top cap)
also the spanner nut that has teh collar on it for centering the sring would be pointing down if i were to install them with teh set screwes towards the factory perch.
The brand is "pro spec", please look at this pics and give me any advice you can. I've always avoided these types of "coil overs" for lots of reasons, but now is got some and need some help
Last edited by turboglenn; 12-25-2007 at 11:51 PM.
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I bought my car with a set of those installed on it. I was on the interstate and the strut rod broke in half (brand new KYB GR2's) and took out my brand new tire. I think you and your girl might be safer on stock springs.
Well, it looks like i'll be the guinea pig and if all else fails, state farm can foot the repair or total it so i can buy a 1 g AWD and slap this motor and management in it and go even faster.
BUt my goal is to get them on the car correct as i can. I need all the help you guys that have hadthem can provide as far as my first few questions.
Im sorry but my experience with those tells me that the manufacturer needs to be jailed for ripping people off and selling a dangerous product. The spring perch is made of cheap aluminum or pot metal, and only held in place by an oring and 3 hex screws. Not me. Id never put that on my car.
Mmm, hard to tell by just looking at them, but I would maybe buy different springs at least. From the looks of it, those springs probably have a very high spring rate otherwise you'd be hitting your bump stops all the time. And i dont think those sturts are going to provide enough dampening for those super high spring rate. May just order some new springs that are longer with a softer spring rate.
____________________________
Andy
06 STi
03 Evo, Sold
97 TSI AWD, sold
The spring perch is made of cheap aluminum or pot metal, and only held in place by an oring and 3 hex screws.
The "perch" is welded onto the strut. The "threaded sleeve" is made of cheap aluminum.
turboglenn - I purchased that exact same coilover kit earlier this year. I only bought it for the threaded sleeves though. DO NOT use those springs. They are junk and will sag or break in no time. Not to mention they are a few inches too short. If you're going to use that kit, buy a set of 7"or 8" Hypercoil springs to use with it.
For my set-up, I didn't use the set screws. I figured they would rattle loose and fall out pretty fast anyway, so I didn't even bother with installing them. Just slide the sleeve over the strut body and let it set on the perch. Then determine which o-ring you need to install between the sleeve and the shock body to keep the sleeve tight. After that, it goes in order the same way you have it laid out.
I ended up not liking this set-up though. I ran it for a week or two and sold it to buy a true coilover set-up (threaded body aluminum shock). I didn't like using this set-up with the OE upper plates and because everything fits together so loose, I was constantly having problems with the upper nut coming loose on the rears, and then I'd hear it "clank" around corners. IMO, this isn't the worst set-up, but also definitely not the best either.
____________________________
-Paul Volk-
'99 GSX
'91 TSI
99gst_racer, any Idea where i can get those springs you're talking about? This was a christmass gift from my woman and it ruined her day that i didn't think they would work, and it got even worse when i told her the kind of replies i've been getting. Now she's hardly speaking.
I would like to put them on just so she'll be a bit happier, but i can't see the uni-body even being off the ground with these short springs. How bad did yours sit with these springs?
99gst_racer, any Idea where i can get those springs you're talking about? This was a christmass gift from my woman and it ruined her day that i didn't think they would work, and it got even worse when i told her the kind of replies i've been getting. Now she's hardly speaking.
I would like to put them on just so she'll be a bit happier, but i can't see the uni-body even being off the ground with these short springs. How bad did yours sit with these springs?
Thanks for all the help everyone.
I never even installed these springs because I knew they would be too short. I bought the kit just for the sleeve assembly.
EDIT: Should i order ground controls or just straight eibachs and not even bother? I know the tokikos are good, i just wanted coil overs BAD, so i could weightt the front at the strip and lower it in the summer and raise it for the winter. I'm bummed!
The first thing i thought when opening the box was "damn, these springs seem a little short!"
Also, can you tell me what diameter and what spring rate to order?
EDIT: Should i order ground controls or just straight eibachs and not even bother? I know the tokikos are good, i just wanted coil overs BAD, so i could weightt the front at the strip and lower it in the summer and raise it for the winter. I'm bummed!
The first thing i thought when opening the box was "damn, these springs seem a little short!"
Also, can you tell me what diameter and what spring rate to order?
The eibachs springs even tend to sag after a year or two and lose their spring-rate. Stay with Hypercoil springs, they are proven to be the best!
____________________________
Andy
06 STi
03 Evo, Sold
97 TSI AWD, sold
2.5" diameter, 7" or 8" tall.
Search these forums to figure out what rate will work best for your application. There is a decent amount of spring rate talk here.
I second what talonTSIDriver says about Hyperco/Eibach.
____________________________
-Paul Volk-
'99 GSX
'91 TSI
Cool, thanks, I guess i'll do some searching nad see if i can find a proper spring rate. I almost want to just put them on to make her happy, but i don't want to end up dead from a roll over because a strut broke either. So that leaeves me wondering if they'd last till i got some hyperco's and if the car would even be off the ground enough to move with those springs. If i do install them i plan on putting the set screws towards the bottom since they tend to actually touch something there. God this is frustrating, nothing worse than telling a loved one that you HAVE to return or can't use what they gave you for christmass when they thought they got you exactly what you wanted
Okay, i found this info in one of your posts (99gst_racer). Now my question is. With a full weight , DD car that sees teh strip abotu 1-3 times a year just to see where i'm at, which of the following will give me an aggresive bit of handling on teh streets but not beat me to death? I only want to lower it about 1.75 - 2 inches , or about the same as the car in your avatar. I've heard that 2G cars need to have teh rear stiifeneed a LOT before they sstart to handle well so i was thinking about the H&R or Megan rates in a 7 inch spring from Hyperco ( or would that be too stiff for a DD?). How's that sound as far as a decent setup? or what would you recomend since you've been in my EXACT shoes in this scenario.
H&R (Race spring) (FWD and AWD share the same rates)
2.0"F, 1.75"R lowering
Front: 430 #
Rear: 260 #
H&R (Sport spring)
1.7"F, 1.4"R lowering
They would not disclose spring rates for these. They explained that there are too many variables to accurately use spring rates. I'm assuming these are comparable to the Sprints.
Sprint
2.0” or 1.5” lowering (optional)
They would not disclose spring rate information in fear of other manufacturer spin offs. They informed me that they are typically 20-30% stiffer than stock.
Last edited by 99gst_racer; 12-26-2007 at 12:57 PM.
Okay, i found this info in one of your posts (99gst_racer). Now my question is. With a full weight , DD car that sees teh strip abotu 1-3 times a year just to see where i'm at, which of the following will give me an aggresive bit of handling on teh streets but not beat me to death? I only want to lower it about 1.75 - 2 inches , or about the same as the car in your avatar. I've heard that 2G cars need to have teh rear stiifeneed a LOT before they sstart to handle well so i was thinking about the H&R or Megan rates in a 7 inch spring from Hyperco ( or would that be too stiff for a DD?). How's that sound as far as a decent setup? or what would you recomend since you've been in my EXACT shoes in this scenario.
HAHA, I forgot that I posted that info here. It's amazing how much old information you forget you knew, as you keep learning the new stuff.
The spring rate information in the quote above is for lowering springs, not coilover springs. Most of those are rated to be comfortable for a street car. Most people that run coilovers run a higher rate for performance. It's completely up to you as to which rate you choose.
IMO, many lowering springs manufacturers offer lower rates, and sacrifice performance for comfortable ride. I'm not an expert at choosing a perfect rate, and you're really only guessing unless you have printouts of the corner weights of your car. But I would guess that you would want somewhere around a 250# rear and a 350# front.
____________________________
-Paul Volk-
'99 GSX
'91 TSI
350/250 is what i was thinking as well. So that way it wouldn't be too stiff in the front, but the back would be nearly double stock spring rates giving it the stiffness the rears of these cars supposedly need to handle well.
So what do i need to tell hyperco ( or their distributor) that i'm looking for? I know the springs will have to be shorter than stock since teh aftermarket sleeves put the perch up about 2 1/2 inches higher over the stock location, and do i get a progressive rate or linear?
I'm not too worried about riding like a caddilac, but i don't want to be knocking parts off teh car when hitting bumps either.
I ran 7's and it sat OK. But they don't do a 250# in a 7". If you go with an 8" spring, they will fit fine, you will get the performance that you're looking for, and there is many rates available, BUT you may not get the car to sit as low as you might want.
____________________________
-Paul Volk-
'99 GSX
'91 TSI
i just wanted to say that i am proud that no one told him to buy Megan Coilovers
There is nothing wrong with the megan coil-over kit. I ran those for a whole season and I was pleased. its a very nice and inexpensive out-of-the-box setup.
____________________________
Andy
06 STi
03 Evo, Sold
97 TSI AWD, sold
Okay, i know i need new springs, but can get away with the sleeves and other misc. hardware. I've picked a spring rate for teh front and rear, I'm going at about 335-350 front and 235-250 rear. But, since i don't know the length of the springs i'm going to need to get the heights i want at both ends of the travel ( high for winter and mounting my slicks with it still sitting higher in the rear, and low for the street) So i need to know, would it be safe to put them on the way they are and run them long enough to decide on a length to order, and while waiting on the shipping for the new springs? I don't mind the mechanical amount of work, I use to do it for a living so most of it's pretty easy for me. Or do you think that they will fall apart, and cause damage to my new tokikos or other parts of my car in only a few weeks. I've never heard of a set being as crappy as you guys are saying this one is, but i believe you so just in case i'm wanting an opinion on the safety of this product for say a 3 week maximum. And that's only if i can't get the new springs in short order due to the new years and all the shipping traffic.
Let me know, so i can swap these out if it will be cool, i'm going to have to mount at least one or two anyway to get the length of the new ones i have to order to fix the suspension.
Last edited by turboglenn; 12-26-2007 at 10:06 PM.
Also, anyone who's picked their own spring rates to let me know if what i've ggot outlined in the previous post sounds good for a street car that gets driven hard and hit the track now and then.
To start with, no one car is alike, to find the perfect spring rate sometimes trial and error come into play. If the car is driven often and yo would like a more comfortable ride, I'd say your 350front/250rear would be a very good start. I would not recommend driving on those springs that came with the coil-overs, could ruin the struts as those springs look like a VERY high spring rate.
____________________________
Andy
06 STi
03 Evo, Sold
97 TSI AWD, sold
To start with, no one car is alike, to find the perfect spring rate sometimes trial and error come into play. If the car is driven often and yo would like a more comfortable ride, I'd say your 350front/250rear would be a very good start. I would not recommend driving on those springs that came with the coil-overs, could ruin the struts as those springs look like a VERY high spring rate.
This is my DD, so i would like a halfway comfortable ride. A little stiffer just too compensate for the lowering and better dampened struts is all i'm looking for out of the spring rate. And i do expect them to be a little noisy or clank sometimes, but hopefully not too bad. I just want to get it to where it's dropped a little less than 2'' in the summer and then have the ability to raise it up to put my slicks on, and then use the rears to balance the front corner weights on the scales before going to the strip. Then i just have to be able to get it back to stock ride height for winter since she sees some snow duty as well. The springs that came with the kit are just about 5'' long, the reason i wanted to mount them is to get an idea on what length to order 7 or 8 since the sleeves will put the bottom perch up higher about 2'' to start with and i can go higher from there, but not lower because of the set screws. Unless i wanted to take them apart and flip the sleeves every summer/winter and that would make coil overs pointless.
What damage do you think they would do to the struts by being so stiff if it's only for a week or 2? The only reason i even question why they couldn't work, ifs that there has top be some kids who've ordered them, put them on and been fine for a little while at least. You'd think at least 6 months or so. But i could be wrong there too. I don't buy parts on ebay for that reason, it's hit or miss.
I have the same struts and skunk2 coilovers which arent much better but i do think my springs are a bit taller. I dont think you will be to happy with the way it rides if your used to the stock setup, its a bit bumpy and rough, but deff. not bouncy. These struts seem to do their job just fine, but its up to you. I would personally just trade em' up for a slightly taller set as 99 gst stated
