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Hydraulic Release Bearing

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MIdsm

15+ Year Contributor
134
10
Oct 8, 2003
SW MI, Michigan
Is anyone using a hydraulic release bearing?

I was on Tilton's web site a while ago and read HRB install manuals and two of them caught my eye - primarily Honda HRB and MR2 HRB install manuals (98-1115 and 98-1116 respectively). The instructions for Honda mention that the HRB should be seated on the transmission and the MR2 HRB gets secured using rubber rings on the pilot sleeve. It appears that some HRBs don't have to be bolted to the transmission to function properly.

Is anyone aware of an off the shelf HRB that could be used on DSMs (Tilton, QM, Howe, etc.)?

Although the transmission removal would be a little bit more complicated without some sort of sealed quick-connect fitting, I would assume that the elimination of the stock slave, fork and fulcrum would lead to a more consistent pedal engagement.

I'm currently away from my "spare" parts so I can't make any measurements.

Thanks.
 
I run a tilton CC with HRB.

Works great, i do have a quick connect fitting for intall and removal of the tranny. The HRB is not bolted to the tranny, only rubber o-rings.
 
Cool. Thank you. Would you know the part number or the HRB series by any chance?

Thanks again.
 
I was on PTT's website looking up clutches and found HRB but they didn't have any descriptions about them so I wasn't too interested but correct me if im wrong, this eliminates the need for a fork and slave cylinder?

PTT Tri-MAX Hydraulic Release Bearing
 
____Kurt____ said:
I was on PTT's website looking up clutches and found HRB but they didn't have any descriptions about them so I wasn't too interested but correct me if im wrong, this eliminates the need for a fork and slave cylinder?

PTT Tri-MAX Hydraulic Release Bearing
Click to expand...

yea, no ned for fork and pivot ball or the OEM slave.... i wonder more if these work with normal clutches or if they only apply on twin units??
 
I need a new fork and slave..... I wonder if its worth just upgrading to HBR instead of replacing some parts. I'm going to call PTT tomorrow.
 
____Kurt____ said:
I need a new fork and slave..... I wonder if its worth just upgrading to HBR instead of replacing some parts. I'm going to call PTT tomorrow.
Click to expand...

My only concern is this.. With the heavy pressure plate i run (2600)n and lots of daily driving i usually replace the slave and master's every 2-3 years tops (not OEM mitsu but free replacements under lifetime warranty) ANd if the HRB wears out like the others do, i'd hate to have to pull the trans to service the bearing..

I don't believe there's much of a performance advantage or we'd have heard about it and the times/shifts or whatever it would improve. But i am always interested in experimenting and learning new things :D
 
I'm not certain about longevity but I was looking for simplicity and consistancy. The stock system has too many points of failure. With an HRB it either works or it doesn't, while the stock system has many parts that may fail. My original plan was to drill a couple of holes on the in the bell housing for a line from master and a bleed line, install a quick release fitting and a short line straight to the master thus eliminating the vary long steel line and the short flex hose. The HRB bleeding should be simpler as well as the stock line goes meanders too much. One of Tilton's HRBs (700 series?) works like a break caliper - when pedal is up the bearing retreats till it's just off the pressure fingers supposedly keeping the clutch engagement consistent even as the clutch wears.

Good luck,

Stevan
 
It's all doable, it just costs money. There will be case modification involved so the trans would need to be torn down to do the work.
 
I am dead set on trying a HRB with act 2600. I am convinced it would make a world of difference. less pedal effort and far better shifting. PP will release quicker allowing more time for syncros to work. heres a comment from curt brown when he switched to HRB with a carbonetics evo clutch.

The key to making this one work is the included Quartermaster hydrolic slave and STM SS line directly to the master cylinder. with the supplied "contraption" Carbonetic supplied it did not release the clutch quick and clean enough causing it to slip, the QM system fixes that and also has less pedal pressure.
 
cant find one that will work. there isnt much room. callopsed lengnth needs to be 1.5 inches. tilton 800 series are 1.44. but the tob contact diameter is 44mm. will work for 7.25 twins. stock clutches will need 52mm contact bearing. shortest for those is over 2 inches collapsed. so no go for stock pressure plates with HRB .
 
Bringing this one back. Does anybody have any more information on hydraulic throwout bearings? Which ones work on DSMs? Which ones require no transmission bell housing modification? What clutches can they be used with? Does it require significantly less effort to depress the clutch pedal with heavy clutches?
 
got the hydro bearing mod pretty much worked out. I found another bearing from mitsubishi eclipse 2006-2010 that gets very compact. all plastic its about 5 oz. lighter than the saab bearing. after much consideration I decided to give the saab bearing a go. the mitsu bearing cant be used without having to chop off the pilot on the bell housing. I dont want to have to modify the trans if I dont have to. the saab bearing can be made to work with no modifications to tranny.
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first step is to remove the seal and seal plate on back of bearing. these are not needed as the input shaft is sealed by the trans. this also makes the bearing sufficiently compact.
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once this is done the bearing slides right on the guide perfectly. and I mean perfect. like it was made for it. tighter fit that the bearing the trans comes with. the hard line will be run through the stock vent hole. no need to mod trans. the line will be enough to keep bearing base from rotation.
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next thing to consider is the face of bearing is made to work with a bent finger pressure plate. so I took apart a stock bearing and cut the contact ring off of it. this will be welded to the bearing to give it the correct face.
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the last mod to bearing will be shortening of the pilot. it sticks out too far and contacts the clutch disc. it needs to be shortening about 3/16 of an inch. this perhaps will be the trickiest part to do correctly. the bearing is held together by a small crimped on piece. it cant be uncrimped and needs to be cut off. then it will be need to be welded back on. gonna be tricky with the materials being so thin. and the clearance has to be precise.

testing the disengagement of the stock setup. it takes alot of force to compress the clutch. I gonna guess with the leverage ratios there is around 300-350 lbs actual pushing on the fingers. with the hydro bearing that force will be pushing right on the housing. I was a little worried at first but then realized if housing does flex it will only help shifting. if it flexes in will compress input bearing which will only help slow down input shaft . this will help the syncros do its job.
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finished the bearing mods. decided jb weld would be sufficient to hold clip in place. too small to weld.
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[URL=http://s51.photobucket.com/user/lancerman/media/blu%20tweaks%202/IMG_0863_zps0c34f2e1.jpg.html]
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Last edited:
just to update my progress. I have been driving on the saab bearing for a couple weeks now. The pictures above are of prototype modified bearing which did not work for two reasons. one with the added smaller contact ring the bearing was too thick. so it has to be used with the larger contact surface. second this bearing is designed to be bolted to the trans. so first time I checked the pedal the back of bearing popped apart. so prototype number two uses a plate bolted to back of bearing to hold it together. there is still no mods done to tranny for this to work.

so with no mods to stock system the pedal travel is reduced from stock 5.5 inches to 4 inches. in this configuration the pedal stiffness is about the same. with just 4 inches pedal travel rapid shifting is much improved. very sporty feel. but I didnt like it for daily use. the engagement window is too short.

so what I tried next was drill a second hole on the pedal assembly. this gave me about 6 inches of pedal travel. and an amazing 30-35% reduction in pedal pressure. now the car is incredibly smooth to drive.

ultimately i want to get travel in the 5.0-5.25 travel area. this will give me the best combo of good shift speed and reduced pedal effort. so i have to mod the pedal again.

took me four years but in short though, absolutely one of the best mods I have done to the car. well worth the effort.
 
update on this TOB. been using it for a year now. absolutely one the best mods I have done to the car. the final bearing that works looks something like this. I drilled and tapped ten 10/32 holes to hold the plate on the back.the first 1/4 inch plate didnt hold. started leaking on the longest throw after about two weeks.
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the reconfigure pedal ratio was done by filling original whole with brass. then redrilling. this was done twice to get to desired 5.25 inches of travel.
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Great mod and thanks for the write-up. How is it holding so far?
I am interested in trying one of yours...
 
A few years ago I saw a press release by a euro clutch maker, Sachs maybe, for a pressure plate mounted hrb. It was for a competition clutch, pull style. The non rotating part of the hrb needed a positive mechanical stop so hoses wouldn't get damaged. The whole point was that no matter how much pressure pp exerted onto the flywheel the thrust bearing wouldn't be affected at startup and at every shift. Since the hrb mounts to the pp and pp mounts to the flywheel and flywheel mounts to the crank there is no force acting on the crank.
 
That could potentially help with any crank walk related issues. I know we don't hear of them much anymore but relieving the crank bearings of any unneeded pressure sounds like a good thing. Has anyone kicked the idea around of making kits for these? I need a TOB right now and probably will just get another parts store one because it's available, cheap, and doesn't mean i have to do anything crazy to put it on. I'm interested in this idea however, it sounds like a great modification to make to the transmission.
 
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