My setup Ok or Should I change things before I buy

[snafer100]

Hey guys, ok first I wanna say that my expectations for this car. I have a 93 AWD 5spd. I am shooting for around 350whp. I have many questions on the tuning part and sizing of injectors and turbo.

JDM 4g63
Balance Shafts Removed
2.5 in Down Pipe
3 in Thermal Cat Back (no cat)
Hahn S 20 G turbo (already have this, and dont want to change it)
S-AFC 2
Data logger
JRC 8 inch Intercooler
INJECTORS this is where i need your help 550's to small or not?
AFPR (not sure where i should set the pressure)
ACT 2600
TRE performance rebuild tranny
Also not sure I heard it is better running stock intake over the cyclone intake???
edit... also using a 2 G MAS

I am really confusing myself wondering about some of this stuff. I wanna run around 16-18 psi, on 93 octane. But I am also looking at my HP goal and wondering if i would get there or not. My engine is and I dont want to realize I did something wrong b4 i get the engine back in.
I am also looking for an experienced person in PA that can tune these and show me the basic principal's on tuning these engines.

 

[mitsuclipsegsx]

Hey guys, ok first I wanna say that my expectations for this car. I have a 93 AWD 5spd. I am shooting for around 350whp. I have many questions on the tuning part and sizing of injectors and turbo.

JDM 4g63
Balance Shafts Removed
2.5 in Down Pipe
3 in Thermal Cat Back (no cat)
Hahn S 20 G turbo (already have this, and dont want to change it)
S-AFC 2
Data logger
JRC 8 inch Intercooler
INJECTORS this is where i need your help 550's to small or not?
AFPR (not sure where i should set the pressure)
ACT 2600
TRE performance rebuild tranny
Also not sure I heard it is better running stock intake over the cyclone intake???


I am really confusing myself wondering about some of this stuff. I wanna run around 16-18 psi, on 93 octane. But I am also looking at my HP goal and wondering if i would get there or not. My engine is and I dont want to realize I did something wrong b4 i get the engine back in.
I am also looking for an experienced person in PA that can tune these and show me the basic principal's on tuning these engines.

I might be wrong but it think if you want to have 350whp you are gonna have to up the boost more then 18, and i would deff use big injectors then 550 get 650's

 

[azonic]

You can do it with 550's but you most likely need to up the fuel pressure on the afpr. Or, you could do it with 650's and have a bit more room to work with. My experience with a SAFC on my 2G is ditch it and get DSMlink. I found it much easier to work with and use to tune myself(but that is just my opinion). I run around 17psi on my T28 with 92 octane so I'm guessing 18 with a 20G and 93 octane shouldn't be a issue with proper tuning. Its all about the tuning. Good luck.

 

[snafer100]

I might be wrong but it think if you want to have 350whp you are gonna have to up the boost more then 18, and i would deff use big injectors then 550 get 650's

Now for my understanding it is not completely how much boost you run, it is how much flow you have. Am i right about that? I may be wrong.?.?

 

[pneumo]

Now for my understanding it is not completely how much boost you run, it is how much flow you have. Am i right about that?

You're right, it depends on flow, and based on the parts you have and how well they typically flow, your setup might not get you to 350hp at 18 psi. If you want to keep the boost at 18 you'll have to get more mods. But why limit yourself to just 18psi? Get some 660 injectors and tune it, and you might be able to run around 20-22 psi daily with the mods you already have.

 

[beatshack]

I don't see a fuel pump on your list of mods. You're not planning to flow bigger injectors with a stock fuel pump are you?

And yes, you're right about airflow. Eg. a 14b will flow more cfm at 15psi than a T25 will flow at 15psi, etc, etc.

 

[dalatinromeo]

2.5 in Down Pipe

S-AFC 2
Data logger
INJECTORS this is where i need your help 550's to small or not?

I would change all these up here ^^^^. First would get 3 in all the way. Next thing I would change are your fuel mods. I would get a walbro fuel pump 255, afpr, and at least 650's just in case you ever want to up the boost. And definitly DSMLINK.

Also not sure I heard it is better running stock intake over the cyclone intake???

I have heard mixed reviews, but I have read more people like the cyclone over the 1g stock. But if your going to upgrade your intake mani get a magnus smim.

Stay boostin

 

[GVR4592]

550's aren't going to cut it, and neither is the 8" intercooler.

 

[snafer100]

im not changing all that stuff to a dsmlink, atleast not for the near future. I think I will trailer the car to SBR and have them work with it. only 160 miles . Ok im hearing alot about getting 650's, there is a 255lph fuel pump already in the car. And the 8 inch intercooler?? When I check profiles and part lists i am not normally seeing people with to aweful much bigger IC's then this, and I see some with smaller pushing more horsepower then what my goal is.

I figure i got one answer out of this forum, 550's are to small. Well see what it has on a dyno after tuning.

 

[XakEp]

im not changing all that stuff to a dsmlink, atleast not for the near future. I think I will trailer the car to SBR and have them work with it. only 160 miles . Ok im hearing alot about getting 650's, there is a 255lph fuel pump already in the car. And the 8 inch intercooler?? When I check profiles and part lists i am not normally seeing people with to aweful much bigger IC's then this, and I see some with smaller pushing more horsepower then what my goal is.

I figure i got one answer out of this forum, 550's are to small. Well see what it has on a dyno after tuning.

Running 100% idc is a bad idea unless you have a spare motor.

 

[pneumo]

im not changing all that stuff to a dsmlink, atleast not for the near future.

You should be able to get a decent tune out of your setup. If you're looking to save a few bucks this is one area where you could put off DSMLink for a while. I think you'll still want it once you start tuning with the SAFC.

And the 8 inch intercooler?? When I check profiles and part lists i am not normally seeing people with to aweful much bigger IC's then this, and I see some with smaller pushing more horsepower then what my goal is.

I'm on the fence about that IC. The reason is because the JRC/JR IC are 2.75" thick. It would be different if it was a 3.5" thick core, or if it was 10x2.75". Again, I'd say stick with it for now, and if you don't reach your goals, upgrade. It would be easy since you already have the piping. You can also improve the efficiency of the IC by adding a switch to turn on the fans and get more cooling airflow past the core. The fans typically add about 5% effciency at low to medium speeds.
VFAQ.com has a writeup on the fan switch mod. Check out www.VFAQ.com/mods/wayback/1gcoolingfan.html

 

[snafer100]

sounds good, im looking at PTE 680cc injectors atm, XacEp, i meant ill use bigger injectors and see where i get from there.

If the IC isnt adequate, i will def be buying another down the road, and thx for that vfaq link, i got to slim fans now and was boggled on wireing them up.

 

[dalatinromeo]

sounds good, im looking at PTE 680cc injectors atm, XacEp, i meant ill use bigger injectors and see where i get from there.

If the IC isnt adequate, i will def be buying another down the road, and thx for that vfaq link, i got to slim fans now and was boggled on wireing them up.

Good choice on the 680's. I still think you should go the DSMLink route, but you can still tune with the s-afc w/ logger pretty good, but it can not beat DSMLink, and it has a whole bunch of other features NLTS and ANTILAG are just a few. I was merely saying to get DSMLINK, instead of tuning with s-afc then having to sell it; because you will eventually want to get DSMLink.

I think the pneumo brings up a good point about the IC choice too. But I heard some good reviews on their products so its not a bad choice, just one you might think over.

Keep us posted on the results and if you meet your goals. Hope this helps, stay boostin

 

[GVR4592]

Regarding the intercooler, you can't just look at the size of the intercooler and guess. You have to consider flow rates, presure drop, intercooler efficiency, end tank design, etc. An 8" tall intercooler isn't going to efficiently keep up with anything bigger than a 14b. T

The cooler your intake temps are, the more power you will be able to make on pump gas. With hot intake temps you will get knock a lot sooner and you won't be able to make as much power. You want to get an intercooler that is closely matched with your turbo set up.

I have an intake temperature sensor after my intercooler and before the throttle body, and I know for a fact that my 22x10x2.75" front mount can't even keep up with a big 16g.

 

[pneumo]

I have an intake temperature sensor after my intercooler and before the throttle body, and I know for a fact that my 22x10x2.75" front mount can't even keep up with a big 16g.

That's odd, I have a 24 x10 x2.75 core from Extreme Intercoolers ( similar to JR cores) and it seems to handle my 50 trim at 28psi just fine. My Talon went 123.7 mph in the 1/4, car weighed 3080 with me in it using ~97 octane unleaded. Maybe it's because I have complete ducting surrounding the core, plus the fan mod? I'm also able to push 25 psi daily with oh-so-wonderful 91 octane.

I'm curious, what temps are you seeing before and after the IC? I'm sure I could find the core efficiency using one of the online calculators at Stealth316.com

 

[GVR4592]

I've used 2 diferent intercoolers around the same size and they have been pretty much the same temps. At 25 psi with my PTE 60 trim temps are about 160-170 and I would get pretty bad knock. I stepped up to a slightly larger intercooler and the temps dropped about 15 degrees and the knock was pretty much gone. With the big 16g at 25 psi temps are about 150. This is with the outside air temperature around 60 degrees. I don't know how that compares with everybody else's temps, but in my opinion that's too damn hot.

 

[pneumo]

OK according to the calcs at www.stealth316.com/2-turbotemp.htm using a big 16G at 25 psi with 60 degree outside temps and 150 degree post IC temp, the IC core efficiency is around 60%, which ain't good. Most good cores have around 75-80% efficiency. I'm not saying you have a bad core, I'm saying that getting more cooling airflow through the core makes a big difference.
Also check out www.RoadRaceEngineering.com/eclipsetech/icflowcharts.htm to see how much of a difference airflow makes. Some of the charts are labeled with "5mph, 10mph, 20mph" etc and you can see how IC efficiency goes way up as airspeed goes up.

So I recomend adding ducting, do the fan switch mod, and keep the bugs out of the fins!

 

[dsm-onster]

Yea Corky Bell wrote a bit about ducting to the intercooler. It was a rule of thumb that you can raise your efficiency by 20% maximum (that takes a 60% efficient ic to 72%). And that you'll need to have to opening of the ducting to be at least 25% of the core area. He also recommends having the ducting walls angle wider as you get closer to the IC so that air is trapped and cannot "roll" out around the ducting.

But, he also said that it 'would be better that we never heard of water injection'. WTF ...Some secets he wants to keep to himself I guess...