99 gsx runs like crap/ rich after evo 16g

[KrazyRob]

I have a 99 GSX with 55k miles on it and it runs like crap now ..

Ok where do I start..

I bought this GSX earlier this year here in CA and it had a bunch of illegal mods on the motor and a blown head gasket, So of course it would not pass Smog so I could get my 2012 tags.. I am a auto/equipment mechanic so I did the head gasket/ timing belt job and changed it back over to make it legal/ or some what legal to pass smog.. The main problem was the visual of my car when you open the hood, it had a Chrome Header with external waste gate, a GM MAF AND MAF TRANSLATER, ALSO HAD A GIANT SHINY 50 TRIM TURBO on it, chrome piping and large Blitz BOV.. it had large 680cc injectors.. and FMIC..

Ok so I got rid of the 50Trim turbo and installed a rebuilt HMI EVO 3 16g turbo, as it looks more stock than the Giant chrome 50 trim but now I have a J-Pipe .. anyway I put back the stock exhaust manifold and got rid of the chrome piping, installed the stock maf and stock injectors back in the car. I tapped a nipple from the J pipe to the new internal wastegate and ran a short vacuum hose.. The car looks alot more stock when you open the hood, but it has alot less power now..

I have been driving the car the way it is for about 4 months now and it gets from point A to Point B but you can tell it is not tuned..

The problems I am having are..

Runs Rich (you can smell the exhaust) I dont have a wideband or boost gauge
Dies out some times when the throttle is let off (possible boost leak)
Horrible on Gas MPG
Gets fuel cut around 6500 RPM
Takes a while to spool, almost like there is too much fuel or timing is retarded (dont have that instant power that I had before)..

This car has always run on stock boost, but it was tuned before at a shop to run optimal with the components it had as far as A/F.. Now I have mix matched components some stock some after market and its just not running right.. Its almost like I want to put back the GM MAF, MAF Translator, big injectors ect and see how it runs with that 16g..

I also have a new Wally 265 fuel pump that I have not installed yet.. I want this car to be a "sleeper" and look stock but be fast as hell.. I also need to decide how far I want to go with the mods because every 2 years I will have to put it back stock for a smog check.. Any where in Nor Cal /Central Valley where I could get this car tuned?


Also off the subject but... how are these AWD cars in the snow? I was thinking about taking it up to Lake Tahoe this weekend and its snowing... It never snows where I live ..

 

[PrimerPLus]

Ok, so first, before you started murdering your car, I mean replacing with stock parts, did it run fine?
If it did not then you have a tuning issue. If it did then you have messed with the tune and it needs to be retuned. I am assuming all the parts you have put on were in good working order.
You are running rich and I would accompany that with your bigger fuel injectors, do you have an AFPR? If How was your car previously tuned? Chip, ecmlink, safc, flashed.
Make sure to get an Wideband, and someway to tune with. I would highly recommend ecmlink. But there are other ways. It is not good to run rich all the time.

As far as in the snow, it handles really great, I should know..< Alaska

 

[KrazyRob]

Ok, so first, before you started murdering your car, I mean replacing with stock parts, did it run fine?
If it did not then you have a tuning issue. If it did then you have messed with the tune and it needs to be retuned. I am assuming all the parts you have put on were in good working order.
You are running rich and I would accompany that with your bigger fuel injectors, do you have an AFPR? If How was your car previously tuned? Chip, ecmlink, safc, flashed.
Make sure to get an Wideband, and someway to tune with. I would highly recommend ecmlink. But there are other ways. It is not good to run rich all the time.

As far as in the snow, it handles really great, I should know..< Alaska

Ha yeah it ran great and FAST before, but I have a different Turbo now so i would imagine it will need to be tuned again.. I HATE CA SMOG!!! .. This means if I put back the large injectors and GM MAF and MAF translator and then pay to have it tuned, I will have to take it all off again for smog in a year and a half and go through this all again .. I bought the car already tuned but I beleive it was tuned at a shop using the adjustments inside the MAF Translator box.. Ecmlink and gauges are alittle out of reach for me now financially.. Yeah I need to be able to tune it myself so I can set it up for smog and then change it back after .. What is the easiest and least expensive way to tune? safc?

Ok so say I buy a used safc set up and reinstall the 680cc injectors back in the car.. Can i use my stock MAF and still get some good power?

Or should I get safc and install my 680cc injectors AND GM MAF and MAF translator back? I remember with that MAF you could hear the massive amount of air being sucked into the throttle body when you would rev the car by hand . But if I ever have to pop my hood from a CHP officer it would be a dead give away with all that shit on there ... I kind of like the "sleeper" idea ...

I have a new manual boost controller that I have not installed yet but I will need to purchase a wideband and AF gauge i would imagine before I start tweeking my 50k mile GSX.. I dont want to mess up the motor having improper settings from lack of experience tuning ..

Also do you think Im getting fuel cut now from using the stock injectors with that Evo 16g? As far as i know my internal wastegate is working properly..

Im trying to find a way for this car to be versatile. It would be nice to keep the stock appearance but be able to tune, while also being able to switch back quickly to stock settings for smog with out a major overhaul.. It would great to put out around 350-400 hp as a sleeper daily driver! ..

 

[c2ypt1c]

What is the easiest and least expensive way to tune? safc?

The choice is obvious: ecuflash, hands down...

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/tun...first-flashed-dsm-ecu-98-99-flashing-faq.html

 

[KrazyRob]

The choice is obvious: ecuflash, hands down...

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/tun...first-flashed-dsm-ecu-98-99-flashing-faq.html

Still seems alittle more complicated than I would like.. Not sure if I want to alter the ecu settings completely. I was hoping to just be able to temporarily modify the A/F ratio so I could add boost and not run lean or rich.. I have never tuned so maybe this is not possible .. This is my daily driver, so it won't be a full on race car that I want to modify. Also I got to keep in mind that the CA smog tech plugs his smog machine into my ECU port and i believe it checks factory settings but not sure.

Also do I need to flash a 99 ECU?

 

[mike96]

Still seems alittle more complicated than I would like.. Not sure if I want to alter the ecu settings completely. I was hoping to just be able to temporarily modify the A/F ratio so I could add boost and not run lean or rich.. I have never tuned so maybe this is not possible .. This is my daily driver, so it won't be a full on race car that I want to modify. Also I got to keep in mind that the CA smog tech plugs his smog machine into my ECU port and i believe it checks factory settings but not sure.

Also do I need to flash a 99 ECU?

Word on the street is that the ECUflash option is CA pass-able just as ECMlink is.

Flashing the ECU is a lot easier than you would think. Just read up on as much as you can and take it one step at a time. There are a couple of nice How-tos on the internet to include a couple of YouTube videos on using ECUflash on an EVO as well as Merlin's EVO tuning guide... Yea they are geared toward EVOs but the basic concept is the same.

 

[H@xtGSX]

ECU Flash is about as complicated as wiping your ass with your left hand (if you're right handed)... I use it, and it's not "simple" but it doesn't take long to figure out, and there's SOOOOO much more you can do with it... and it's cheap, yet just as powerful as any other tuning solution. Plus, if you look reeeal hard, there's an "emissions" XML done for exactly your situation. I have it, but where I live, there's no need for me to use it. We don't have inspections here. It's not too hard to find though. If you're desperate and can't find it, PM me, and I'll go dig it up (because it isn't on my computer here at home).

 

[Junfan]

Your car needs to be retuned. Changing the turbo like that is a big thing so get a tuning solution and figure it out or have someone else do it before you mess up your car.

Also, get a wideband and boost gauge please your car will thank you later when you don't run bad AFRs and overboost or surge causing you to blow your e316g.

 

[KrazyRob]

Im new to the (tune world) .. So by flashing my ecu what does that do exactly? How do I actually change A/F settings? is there like a hand held device I plug in?, or do I hook up my laptop to my ecu some how?

Once I flash my ECU does it erase all my factory settings incase I want to go back to stock?

I have found that the more you modify your car it is like a snow ball effect, constantly changing and adjusting things to make other things work .. Mitsubishi did alot of testing to come up with reliable components and settings that match each other.. I like to be able to just get in my car and drive 8 hours one way with out having to worry about mods and adjustments and A/F mixture and HP.. So i guess what im saying is that Im already in too deep by changing the turbo and now I threw everything out of wack, so im hoping to atleast get things running right and optimal the way they sit and just leave it alone and drive the car.. Not really into tweeking settings all the time to make 3 more hp ..

Also in your guys's opinion what should I do next, im kinda broke .. Should I not even worry about putting the GM MAF and MAF TRANSLATOR back in the car and just use the stock maf? I guess I could just drive the car the way it is and slowly start buying the parts I need to upgrade, SAFC or ECU FLASH, gauges ect.. What happens if I install those 680cc injectors and wally 265 fuel pump now? Im guessing it might run even more rich by doing that .. Need to change something soon though ...

 

[idkiliketurbos]

When you flash your ecu you can save a stock tune on your computer to use in the future if need be. I'm first starting with flash tuning as well, but I'm learning a ton just from reading on the forums and the evo forums.

 

[97-TSi-Hx35]

Ha yeah it ran great and FAST before, but I have a different Turbo now so i would imagine it will need to be tuned again.. I HATE CA SMOG!!! .. This means if I put back the large injectors and GM MAF and MAF translator and then pay to have it tuned, I will have to take it all off again for smog in a year and a half and go through this all again .. I bought the car already tuned but I beleive it was tuned at a shop using the adjustments inside the MAF Translator box.. Ecmlink and gauges are alittle out of reach for me now financially.. Yeah I need to be able to tune it myself so I can set it up for smog and then change it back after .. What is the easiest and least expensive way to tune? safc?

Ok so say I buy a used safc set up and reinstall the 680cc injectors back in the car.. Can i use my stock MAF and still get some good power?

Or should I get safc and install my 680cc injectors AND GM MAF and MAF translator back? I remember with that MAF you could hear the massive amount of air being sucked into the throttle body when you would rev the car by hand . But if I ever have to pop my hood from a CHP officer it would be a dead give away with all that shit on there ... I kind of like the "sleeper" idea ...


I have a new manual boost controller that I have not installed yet but I will need to purchase a wideband and AF gauge i would imagine before I start tweeking my 50k mile GSX.. I dont want to mess up the motor having improper settings from lack of experience tuning ..

Also do you think Im getting fuel cut now from using the stock injectors with that Evo 16g? As far as i know my internal wastegate is working properly..

Im trying to find a way for this car to be versatile. It would be nice to keep the stock appearance but be able to tune, while also being able to switch back quickly to stock settings for smog with out a major overhaul.. It would great to put out around 350-400 hp as a sleeper daily driver! ..

I cant even read what you are saying, every sentence ends with ... you sound like a giggling school girl!

 

[KrazyRob]

The choice is obvious: ecuflash, hands down...

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/tun...first-flashed-dsm-ecu-98-99-flashing-faq.html

I see that was a 2009 Thread, guess this ecu reflashing has been going on for a while..

I cant even read what you are saying, every sentence ends with ... you sound like a giggling school girl!

ooooooooooooooolool... Thanks for the helpful info douche bag...

Anyway I was reading up on ecu flash and it sounds pretty awesome.. Think I might try it out.. Need to get a Wideband soon though..

 

[c2ypt1c]

I see that was a 2009 Thread, guess this ecu reflashing has been going on for a while..

Yup, here's another helpful link you should go over to get your feet wet:
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-tuning-ecu/407715-how-get-basic-tune-ecuflash.html

Anyway I was reading up on ecu flash and it sounds pretty awesome.. Think I might try it out.. Need to get a Wideband soon though..

Smart choice, you won't be disappointed. As stated earlier, you'll always have the option of re-flashing back to the OEM state. Also, "tuning" is not limited to just making horespower. Proper tuning ensures that your engine is operating efficiently and safely, which will extend it's life expectency. Being able to monitor and diagnose nearly all aspects of your dsm is, in my opinion, just one reason it should be everyone's first mod.

 

[H@xtGSX]

I have been a flasher for a while now... just turned on the launch control and anti-lag yesterday (holy crap it's fast!!)....

Here's another link you will need, and when you decide how big you want to go, PAY FOR CEDDYMODS. The man deserves it, and his work is something 99% of us could never hope to have achieved. I use it, and it is worth every penny. I'd even donate more if he'd do a bit more development.

ceddy.us

Welcome to the world of DSM, where you will be trained as a mechanic more competent than most of the ones working in shops with "certification". Certs are great and all, but you'll seriously learn more about cars from your car than anything I have ever seen... I have been working on drag cars since I was 14, and my DSM taught me more in a year than I had learned in the previous 18 years before owning it. They are both wonderful and supreme pain in the ass pieces of crap at the same time, and that is why people like us love them.

Now your car is going to teach you the intricacies of fuel injection and how you can modify it to go faster... Learning ECU Flash will force you to learn the details of fuel injection and how they control the engine. Once you get into it, it becomes like reading a good novel... You can't put it down.

 

[mike96]

I have found that the more you modify your car it is like a snow ball effect, constantly changing and adjusting things to make other things work ..

Welcome to tuning...

Also in your guys's opinion what should I do next, im kinda broke .. Should I not even worry about putting the GM MAF and MAF TRANSLATOR back in the car and just use the stock maf? I guess I could just drive the car the way it is and slowly start buying the parts I need to upgrade, SAFC or ECU FLASH, gauges ect.. What happens if I install those 680cc injectors and wally 265 fuel pump now? Im guessing it might run even more rich by doing that .. Need to change something soon though ...

If you still have the MAFT and GM MAF that came with the car then you could install them back in and adjust it out so that the car is at least drivable but without having some way to monitor what the engine is doing (either with wideband and/or at least an older 2G dataloger/palm setup), it won’t be easy...

Or. You could not drive the car, sell the GM MAF and MAFT, and that should give you enough for the OP 2.0 (they should sell pretty quick). That way you can at least get the car running correctly on the stock 450s and stock boost settings. Then once you have a wideband throw in the 680s and make the appropriate changes.

I would vote option #2...

Also it is recommended that you get the cheaper cable for dataloging with so that you don’t burn out your $170 OP 2.0 cable with constant use however it isn’t an absolute necessity.

Tactrix Openport 2.0

Mitsubishi/Subaru/OBDII/CAN EvoScan Software

 

[dsmspick]

Just a curious question. Are there no shops that pass modified cars in CA. In Missouri if you know the right person and have 20 bucks they will pass almost anything.

 

[H@xtGSX]

Virginia was the same way... Nazi inspections could be passed with a $50 in the right shop.

 

[KrazyRob]

Yup, here's another helpful link you should go over to get your feet wet:
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-tuning-ecu/407715-how-get-basic-tune-ecuflash.html



Smart choice, you won't be disappointed. As stated earlier, you'll always have the option of re-flashing back to the OEM state. Also, "tuning" is not limited to just making horespower. Proper tuning ensures that your engine is operating efficiently and safely, which will extend it's life expectency. Being able to monitor and diagnose nearly all aspects of your dsm is, in my opinion, just one reason it should be everyone's first mod.

Cool.. Yeah i can tell it is not tuned right.. Might even have a boost leak too, i need to check for leaks with my boost leak tester again....... Also i just placed a bid on a Autometer cluster bezel to house my wideband and boost gauge. Dont have the gauges yet, but i guess one step at a time.. Hopefully in order it will go Bezel, gauges, ecu flash, then tune..

Welcome to tuning...



If you still have the MAFT and GM MAF that came with the car then you could install them back in and adjust it out so that the car is at least drivable but without having some way to monitor what the engine is doing (either with wideband and/or at least an older 2G dataloger/palm setup), it won’t be easy...

Or. You could not drive the car, sell the GM MAF and MAFT, and that should give you enough for the OP 2.0 (they should sell pretty quick). That way you can at least get the car running correctly on the stock 450s and stock boost settings. Then once you have a wideband throw in the 680s and make the appropriate changes.

I would vote option #2...

Also it is recommended that you get the cheaper cable for dataloging with so that you don’t burn out your $170 OP 2.0 cable with constant use however it isn’t an absolute necessity.

Tactrix Openport 2.0

Mitsubishi/Subaru/OBDII/CAN EvoScan Software

..
Is there a cheaper cable? How much are they and where would i get one? I went to the website and found that the software was free but the cable was like $170 and the mitsubishi adapter was $10

Just a curious question. Are there no shops that pass modified cars in CA. In Missouri if you know the right person and have 20 bucks they will pass almost anything.

There are a few illegal smog people i found here in CA but the starting price is $300 and up.. So i
just took a good 6 hours and put my car back stock and it passed smog great. And i sold a bunch of the other bolt on mods it had.. I think i still have a good set up.. Just need to tune it... HMI E3 16g rebuilt, fmic, blitz bov, greddy turbo timer, new head gasket and timing belts, 3" wide open custom exhaust, aem fuel pr gauge, wally 265 fp, delphi 680cc injectors oh man a tune would be amazing! ..

I sold a new 50 trim turbo, top of the line header and tial external WG, and some other shit that made this car go fast before haha.. Now its time to make it right again..

 

[mike96]

There is a cheaper cable... However, it is for datalogging only! To be able to flash to the Factory 98/99 Eclipse ECU you will need the $170 OpenPort 2.0 adapter. As far as I know no one has managed a cheaper solution than that yet. The software to flash the ECU is free. You might be able to find an old copy of the program everyone uses to datalog for free but the last time I looked the free copy I found was grossly outdated. Besides it is only $25 for the dataloging program, if you get it with the dataloging only cable then you do get a small discount.

EvoScan 1.3D USB OBDII/MUTIII/SSMII Datalogging Cable

Search EVOscan on here and I believe there is a "lesser cost" solution for datalogging ($15-$20 E-bay cable and EVOscan).

Like I mentioned before though. If you get the OP 2.0 you don't need the lesser expensive datalogging cable but it wouldn't be a bad a bad thing to keep from burning out the more expensive cable with datalogging. That and you can use it now to help tune in the MAFT so that your car is at least drivable, if that is what you decide to do.

 

[boost97gst]

I gotta say, besides cosmetics, what the hell are people running a GM MAF on a 2g for??? If they arent making over 500whp???? Senseless. Sorry, but i see so much of this going on for no reason, or the myth that its a "performance upgrade" Its not. It IS, however, If you surpass the airflow capabilities of the 2g maf, but thats not gonna happen on a 50trim.
Find a 2g maf, put it back in and youre gonna solve a great many problem right off the bat.

And damn, dude i feel bad for yall in CA, that sucks. Emissions nazis.... wtf. I live in IL, just 10 miles east of the "emissions line" or whatever you call it. Next town over to my east has emissions, im praying they dont start moving east but its been like this for atleast 5 years. I would be SCREWED.
Hey, when do they skip emissions on cars? Dont they have to be 15yrs old or more? It differs state to state. That wouldnt help you anyway but i was curious about CA

 

[H@xtGSX]

Because GM + MAFT = PSSSSSHHHTAAAH... That is the only other reason I can see... Though I am going speed density so I can put the intake just behind the front bumper, so I will be venting just because of the additional plumbing hassle. Plus, there is going to be a big water intercooler blocking the easy routing, unless I put the BOV right at the turbo outlet, and its a bit tight there already... But anyhow, nevermind me.
I know the 95's are exempt from OBD2 emissions scans in states that do inspections, but I believe you still have to pass the visual inspection... So our catless, ERG blocked, charcoal canister missing, rear O2 sensor cheating, non-purging, PCV venting cars would still fail instantly.

Once you have the Tactrix OP 2.0 and flash cable set up, there is an emissions xml file to change all the monitors to "ready" or "pass" or whatever the hell they are supposed to say. I downloaded it a while back, just in case, but have never needed to use it. It is for entertainment and educational purposes only, on off road vehicles, only at sanctioned tracks, with parental supervision and permission from the president of the DMV, with a helmet and a cup on, and extra insurance.... Of course.