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Anyone recently prepped a 1G, for Rally or Rallycross?
I'm looking to get back into the sport and my 1G is on the top of the list. It's a AWD, so I have a great start on the setup. As far as the costs, I've done this before many years ago in a different country and with different cars, so I know what I'm getting into price wise.
This is my first 1G and have become very familiar with the tuning capability of the 1G and it's a very cheap entry car. I figured it'll be easy to get to Rally cross performance, but Rally is another matter right now, BUT, the prep' isn't all that much different.
So I'm looking for anyone who has some experience with the 1G in this sport and is willing to pass on some ideas as to what worked and what didn't, where you bought some of the aftermarket parts for this brutal sport. It's brutal, but the most fun you can have while driving with your clothes on
Thanks for the info'.
____________________________
Roger.
1990 Talon TSi AWD.
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Prep for rallycross and stage rally are night and day difference. You can rallycross with a rental car... however, Rally America has one of the toughest tech inspection and safety inspections of any sanctioning organization.
Also, please note, you can NOT run Rally America events in ANY AWD Turbo car without first earning credentials by running in a 2WD non turbo car.
Why does everybody assume you have to have an AWD turbo car to rally?
Also, visibility in these cars are terrible. Absolutely garbage. They were designed with looks and aesthetics in mind, not performance, and as such, suffer from the overall chassis design.
In terms of drivetrain, suspension, etc, yes, the 1G is an excellent choice. Regardless of what most people think, these cars handle quite well with proper weight transfer and braking techniques.
However, you may as well state your goals.... if you want to be competitive in Rallyx, this chassis is very capable in all 3 classes, stock, prep, and modified. However, in stage rally, you're pretty much going to have to run Open, and try your luck against high dollar STis etc.
I love these cars though. They are a very pure feeling AWD car, and I love it. If you can get over the lack of "jdm fanboy status", the lack of "rally heritage", and learn to ignore DSM owners who think DSMs are poor handling, you'll thoroughly enjoy rallying these cars... as long as youre not over 6'1 or so, anyhow.
Gee Thanks for the insight. As I stated I was interested in information as to what others have done with 1G's, not whether they are qualified to be Rally America entrants.
I basically stated, that I have an AWD, and know that is an advantage in this kind of sport. I am interested in getting a 1G running in Rallycross events and YES you can prep a car for Rallycross the same as full bore Rally, without the need to enter Rally America. The prep' will allow the car to withstand some harsh punishment and survive. I don't have the budget or the need to go to the Rally America circuit and never intended on entering a nearly 20 year old vehicle in an event that has high dollar budgets. There are lots of clubman level rallies around the country, that don't have to conform with Rally America spec's and people contend in these with this and other types of cars.
I am looking for a fun car and if anyone had done anything like this before. If you have, what suspension set up did you use, what other mods did you find useful ( above the obvious safety mod's). What did you find were weaknesses.
P.S. I'm 6'1" and fit in my Talon very well. Viz', who cares!! You only need to see the trees out the front, not behind you!
____________________________
Roger.
1990 Talon TSi AWD.
Again, my point remains... in Rallyx, as with all sanctioned events, the winner is typically the guy who best knows how to use the rules to his favor. If you just "build" a car with all sorts of cool mods, lightbars, skidplates etc, you're going to end up in a class you have no business being in. Its the sad face of the truth. Luckily, no rules prevent you from having fun at an event.
My opinion? Take the car out as is and get in as many rallyx event as possible... if you like it, then take allll that money you saved up, and BUY somebodys old rally car. Buying a car is SO much cheaper than building one in rally.
My opinion? Take the car out as is and get in as many rallyx event as possible... if you like it, then take allll that money you saved up, and BUY somebodys old rally car. Buying a car is SO much cheaper than building one in rally.
thats like sayin go and run your car on the local drag stripi and if you like it buy someone elses dsm to run cause it's cheaper that way. Half the fun of racing a car is building it up to that point. Just because he isnt on the strip or street doesn't mean the kind of racing he wants to do can't be done in his car. Apparently he's done this before in a different location. I doubt he would put something on the car without checking to see if it was permitted by the class he wants to be in. Same with autocross and drag racing.
thats like sayin go and run your car on the local drag stripi and if you like it buy someone elses dsm to run cause it's cheaper that way. Half the fun of racing a car is building it up to that point. Just because he isnt on the strip or street doesn't mean the kind of racing he wants to do can't be done in his car. Apparently he's done this before in a different location. I doubt he would put something on the car without checking to see if it was permitted by the class he wants to be in. Same with autocross and drag racing.
Thanks. Someone actually reading my post. You picked up on it. I am not looking to build a Group A or even a Group N competitor. I wanted someone who has used a Talon in Rally or Rally Cross to tell me their opinion and what and where they got some of their parts.
With either Rally or Rally Cross, you can't take a street modded car and go off the tarmac and go play in the dirt. Suspension is all wrong and that's just to start. I know how to prep a rally car, I have built 2 before in the UK, which is where I'm originally from. I just wanted some tips as to the DSM world of this sport. I'm not going out to try and beat records or take titles in the sport. My Talon is about to become my weekend toy and not my daily driver. I would like to get some ideas as to what and where people have used DSM's in the offroad world.
____________________________
Roger.
1990 Talon TSi AWD.
Pr
Also, please note, you can NOT run Rally America events in ANY AWD Turbo car without first earning credentials by running in a 2WD non turbo car.
Why does everybody assume you have to have an AWD turbo car to rally?
However, in stage rally, you're pretty much going to have to run Open, and try your luck against high dollar STis etc.
.
Not so, RA regional events offer Open Light class, a NA AWD vehicle is permitted. Take off the turbo of your car.
Open Light, PGT, Open classes are your options. Coefficients are earned in various ways, NASA sanctioned rallys, O'Neil rally school. I believe it is 9 coeffecients must be earned before you can get your open rally license. You can check this out by downloading the RA rulebook.
High dollar SP class and Open car-----that is for you to decide. Drivers make the difference. The video on this page of Adam, he has succeeded quite well in last years National PGT and at Ojibwe in the SP class. Your goals, your decisions.
BTW, stock suspension can survive certain events if you drive accordingly.
I've been planning to do this since the first rallyx I spectated late last season. I've been photographing the events since, but don't have the money (or the space) to build a second DSM.
I'd run stock AWD until I got comfortable with the car in those conditions, then do a few mods and go up to prepared, namely 550s, a boost controller, and a 2G MAF with a turbo-back.
Interested to see if you get any additional relevant information. I picked up a pair of 90 Talons with the intent to rebuild one to run in a stock class RallyCross. Once running and reliable, I plan to build the other to be more competitive. Hoping to learn from one car, not only to plan the second car build but also to get better acquinted with the car.
I got the rally bug after using a track loaner, coincendently a 1G Laser and then came across a good deal on a pair of dsm's...
Sorry guys, I was out on the road for 10 days straight... didn't see the replies. Thanks for the input.
I'm going to keep this post alive, as I'm sure I'll get more looks and someone else has bound to have some experience and ideas for this project.
I have a few mods already done to the engine, which I'm sure is going to force me into an Open class of some sort. I don't mind that, it's the rest of the drive train and suspension I'm concerned with the most.
I currently have KYB-AGX with lowering springs from Eibach. I was thinking I might just go back to stock springs for the ride height and turn up the dials on the KYB's. I put a 92 4-bolt rear on it last year so I think other than a new clutch the drive should be strong enough.
So anyone who has gone and done this, chime in, we're interested.
____________________________
Roger.
1990 Talon TSi AWD.
Awesome to see more people interested in Rally on here! I'm doing it now, my first stage rally in the talon will be Sand Blast in Feb 2010.
I've been rallycrossing for years in Subarus, and picked up a 1g DSM already log booked for NASA and RallyAmerica. Like someone else has stated, if you want to get into stage rally, save yourself the cost and hassle and buy a car someone else has built. Even if you have the tools and experience to prep your own rally car, the amount of time spent on it isn't worth it considering how many great deals exist on pre-built cars.
For rallycross - I would keep it relatively stock. Tyres matter most, as with any racing. If you insist on modifying, do things that will get you as much low-end power as possible, the 2.0L turbo DSMs and Subarus get killed on tighter courses because of how slow they are out of boost. Don't lower it, you want to avoid hitting and breaking stuff. Stock springs + AGX shocks are what most people run.
For stage rally - Start with NASA, you can run any car you want. They are a lot more newbie friendly in general. Hotbits and DMS are the only *reputable* dedicated rally suspension manufacturers that I know of, expensive, but apparently worth it. I have DMS struts on the front of my Talon and they are amazing, the backs are currently blown, and I'm planning to run AGX's there for the first rally or so.
Oh, and get a skid plate. Nobody makes them, so they have to be custom made...
Like I said, I'm going through the process right now, so I can probably answer a lot of your questions... or at least we can find answers together lol.
I just noticed that you're only about 80 miles away from Sand Blast, come check it out (Feb 6th) -- Sandblast Rally 2010
Say hi, help out, I'm friendly
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--Dmitriy
TIM 1g DSM Rally Car
Last edited by kainam00; 11-19-2009 at 04:51 PM.
Reason: Auto-merged with previous post to prevent "bumping"
thats like sayin go and run your car on the local drag stripi and if you like it buy someone elses dsm to run cause it's cheaper that way. Half the fun of racing a car is building it up to that point. Just because he isnt on the strip or street doesn't mean the kind of racing he wants to do can't be done in his car. Apparently he's done this before in a different location. I doubt he would put something on the car without checking to see if it was permitted by the class he wants to be in. Same with autocross and drag racing.
Thanks. Someone actually reading my post. You picked up on it. I am not looking to build a Group A or even a Group N competitor. I wanted someone who has used a Talon in Rally or Rally Cross to tell me their opinion and what and where they got some of their parts.
