valve hitting the piston timing is dead on

[92lazerturbors]

ok i just posted and all of my intake valves are hitting the pistons and that is why my rocker arms broke. the timing is dead on and i heard that the plate that goes behind the crank pully could be on backwords, how do you tell? I am sure that the timing is right the head was milled 4 millimeters and im running a felpro head gasket standerd thickness. i am getting new rockers and lifters and new cams and another set of valves i dont know what cams yet. im thinking of the crower 264/264 combo but the motor is stock but i plan to do a full build up as soon as i get out of college. so my question is what would make my intake valve hit my pistons even after i ground on the valve reliefs wtf.

 

[4g63Powered]

It almost sounds like one end is 180* off.

 

[redyute1]

had that once the machinist took too much off the head,or it could be that the head had been machined before and you did not know so now the second machining was too much but then again the machinist should have known,but you can tell with the head off and the cams installed you can turn them to open the valves and see if they open past the deck line

 

[r1991_4g63t]

the valves are supposed to open far enough to hit the pistons, its an interference engine, the TB should shut them before the piston gets high enough. sounds like your timing slipped

 

[JusMX141]

I am sure that the timing is right the head was milled 4 millimeters and im running a felpro head gasket standerd thickness.

There's your problem!

Most shops trim 6-10 THOUSANDS of an inch from the head to level it out....4 millimeters is 157 thousandths!

 

[crimsondragon]

Lol, 4 millimeters...I'm surprised the shop did it without question. Time for a new head.

 

[Defiant]

Guessing your "4mm" is a typo, my bet's with you having a cam 180° out. Both dowel pins have to be up.

 

[1992awdlaser]

The intake cam being 180* out won't cause the valves to hit the pistons. It will only cause the car not to start. I hope 4mm is a typo.

 

[92lazerturbors]

no the 4 mm is not a typo so a i need a new head?

 

[JusMX141]

The machine shop owes you a new head, yes.

They honestly should've known better. A 4mm cut would literally allow the valves to hang into the cylinders.

 

[1992awdlaser]

That head is junk.

 

[92lazerturbors]

thank you guys that freaking sucks so should i try to get him to by me new cams since they got messed up when the valves hit the pistons? what about rockers to?

 

[r1991_4g63t]

they need to buy you whatever was broken from installing that head on your engine.

 

[1992awdlaser]

They should. But, they could say something like "It required to be decked that much to be flat. So, it was bad when you brought it to us." Then all you could do is say they should have known it would be bad and you want the cost of the labor back.

 

[r1991_4g63t]

if that was the case he should have been told when it was picked up

 

[Freerevving]

there is NO WAY the head was 4mm higher on one side... there is NO WAY to use a head that's been shaved 4mm... even a non-interference engine the valves might hit, but that would screw up the compression ratio ON ANY ENGINE rendering it useles except on jet fuel

They screwed up and charged you for it...
even if it did need 4mm, which isn't possible, they should have notified you ahead of time, or during, that the head was not useable

Demand your money back, and threaten to take them to small-claims court

It's very easy to file a case at small claims court and it costs about $30... if they don't respond to the threat, then file a claim... you'll get your money back, but you might have to take a day off from work on the court date. Very easy and worth it, IMO


btw NEVER use them again

 

[1992awdlaser]

if that was the case he should have been told when it was picked up

I doubt that was the case. I was simply saying that might be an excuse they come up with.

 

[kwheeler]

Is it possible the machine shop said they took 4 mil off not 4 millimeters?
If it was 4 mil that is really 4 thousanths of an inch or .004". This makes a lot more sense than 4 millimeters.
It would not explain the valves hitting the pistons but a machine shop that would take 4 millimeters or .157" off a head would not be in business very long.

kwheeler

 

[AlaskanDsm]

I would check out any and all paperwork you have from them to just double check everything they did and the costs they charged. Did they machine, rebuild, install it? If so then
1) they messed up on installing it if the cam is 180* off... owing you a new head.
2) If they only shaved 4MM off, I wonder how they are in business and who will be fired... and they owe you a head.
3) If they don't respond to you, I would take them to court for your losses.
But first, Check paperwork and if you have to call and double check with them, it might be best.

I would also check your pistons to make they didn't get gouged out.

 

[92lazerturbors]

Thanks guys it freakin sucks i hope i can get this fixed and just so i am clear where are the marks to measure on the head to see how much they took off. and what are the clearances and tolerances so i can check to see if i can get a new head
. Thanks robert

 

[bastarddsm]

post a picture of the chamber. Also do immeadiatly go down there and yell and scream. be polite and courtius, that will get you a lot farther with the shop thatn tweaking out right off the bat.

 

[92lazerturbors]

i cant post pics but some one was saying that there were "bullseyes" on the exhaust ports and one mark on the water pump. By the way how do you tell if the timing plate that goes on the crank is on backwards or not the one behind the timing belt

some one said that there are marks on the head you can use as a referance to see how much the machine shop took off. also how do you tell if the timing plate that goes behind the timing belt on the crankshaft is backwards/fliped?

 

[shibby1036]

Holy $hi^^. thats a hell of alot. 4... and I thought i had problems with .021 past AREA spec. yep time to get a fresher head and NEVER EVER take it back to that shop. i would of throw a sh!t fit and demanded the shop buy me a brand spankin new one from Mitsu. OUCH sorry about your luck bro

 

[jayson427]

post a picture of the chamber. Also do immeadiatly go down there and yell and scream. be polite and courtius, that will get you a lot farther with the shop thatn tweaking out right off the bat.

+1 I had a bad experience like this and being cool about it went a long way they fixed my problem with no issues. People do make mistakes.

 

[Kruger]

Take the head off and take a picture of the whole gasket surface. Im interested to see how the much they shaved. 4mm will result in the head bolt oil passage being almost deleted. Its a shallow passage that travels away from a corner head bolt hole. Im interested to see if it will even still be there after 4mm has been shaved off.