First build

[1g-3g]

first off let me say this site is full of great info. I am doing my first build and starting with a block that can hold pretty much what I throw at it. Teh block will be either ross pistons & scat rod's or eagle rods & wiseco or arias pistons. I have not found where one is prefferd over the other. Now for my? From what I have read I can't decide between ecu+ or a full Aem ems. I want to do it the best way the first time. I would like any feedback on witch way to go for teh ECU. I also have a laptop for the programming. I would like to be around teh 400 to 500 hp range.

 

[dsmmike50t]

For 400-500 I wouldn't bother doing up the engine. I have a stock 6 bolt and I made 330whp, thats 400 at the crank. Dsmlink showed estimates around 340 when I made that much and I didn't spend much time tuning and just the other day after tuning for a while I'm getting estimates around 404whp so thats close to 500 at the crank give or take a couple because its only an estimate.

Your new here so I suggest you go with something more user friendly like dsmlink with aem you'll end up paying someone a boatload of money to get it tuned, you can make 400-500 easy with the link. Don't worry about the engine a guy on another forum is running a stock 6 bolt at 30psi with his dbb 3575.

Worry only about what you need for know

Fuel
big injectors 750 or more
fuel pump 190 rewired or 255
aeromotive if your using the 255

Engine
arp studs and headgasket if you plan to run over 20psi
b/s removal
t-belt

Driveline
new fluids
act 2600 if you like launching

Turbo
50 trim 60 trim or 20g should be sufficient

Electronics
dsmlink
egt
wideband

You want to improve flow so get a 3" exhaust system, bigger intake or maft, port stock mani, tubular or fp race and bigger piping and intercooler. You'll make 4-500hp with these mods for sure, but I know guys that make more with less mods and on a e3 16g. How many mods have you done?

 

[1g-3g]

Thanks for the input. I already have the block apart so why not go ahead and build it with good stuff. I have had the car for about 5 years now. drove it for about 5 min then transfer case went out. I pulled the motor and trans and let it set in my dads shop ever since. now that I have no wife to support I can build my car. I have a 3g that is daily driven and like my talon more and it isnt even running.

My plans are
Block
pistons, rods .02 over since I already have motor apart. No 100.00 set
From what I have read the stock crank is tough so no change.
B.S. eliminator
arp studs

head
ss valves. Do I need 1mm over?
ti. springs and retainers
bronze guides
new seals and all that stuff
I am a machinist so I will port and polish to match gasket
800-1000cc injectors ?
272 cams
C.O.P.
I am shaving my valve cover
new intake looking at magnus

turbo
still looking. I like the gt35?
tubular mani
wastegate is still up for grabs depends on turbo.
FMIC
3.5" gm maf and vent

3" turbo back exaust.

255 fuel pump
new lines
F.P.R.

No aem from what I here. since no tuners around here that I know.
"I live in a honda infested town"
dsm link or ecu+
"so far from what i have read other than injector size I like ecu+"

 

[Tarascan79]

You should go with dsmlink or ecu+, AEM costs way too much. If your going to replace your internals you should look into a 2.3 stroker kit. More tourqe for not alot more. Go with eagle and weisco.

 

[laserspeeddemon]

How you build your engine depends ALOT about your goals. Do you want High HP vs High TQ. Drag Race, Autocross, Road Race or Rally?

No one can REALLY give you sound advice, without knowing what you want. They would be just shooting the dark with generalizations.

So lets start with what you want to do with the car...

 

[hereitcomes]

Eagle/Wiseco is the most popular for DSM upgraded motors. They are priceworthy for most peoples budgets in the market for a rebuild. MAKE SURE you use ARP studs and assembly hardware as well as a multi-layered Head Gasket (Mitsubishi works fantastic). Have all of your supporting mods like fuel and such and you shall be good to go. Good luck buddy.

 

[dsmmike50t]

2.3 stroker kit. More tourqe for not alot more. Go with eagle and weisco.

Than you might as well go with the 2.3 faster spool up from what I hear. Atleast you'll have the peace of mind that you'll never blow the engine, but wait then there's the tranny but It should last as long as you take it easy.

 

[1g-3g]

I added my list of plans. but forgot the drive line.
I just bought a xfer case from a guy that had it for sale here.
local shop to build tranny
2600 clutch and lightweight flywheel
I saw a vid of a guy here running in the 9 sec range with stock axels. so they are good?

my gaol is to wax my ex stepdads stingray that runs in the high 8 sec range on 1/8 mile track. so there will be a few drag runs. no 1/4 mile track close and daily road killer.
and i want a sound block that i dont have to worrie about

 

[Tarascan79]

Slowboy and CMI havea 2.3 stroker kit that is priced about $1300 with a remand crank, weisco pistons and eagle rods. The rods will hold up to 600hp so that is good for your goals. If you want more power you will want crower rods. I especialy recomend the 2.3 because you want a street car and you have awd so you want the extra tourqe.

 

[JayRolla]

Look into the Garrett T67 TO4E. Very nice and strong turbos. Make very good power.

 

[1g-3g]

Thanks for the input. I am looking and concidering the stroker now. I know CMI from the
3g forum they host i am a member over there also as I have a fat slow 3g.

 

[Talesin]

If I could redo my rebuild, I'd go with the stroker setup. 2.0 is fine for the FWD side of things (less wheelspin), but the extra torque from the 2.3 stroke apparently REALLY helps the car get out of its own way on the AWD side. Lower redline, sure. But that doesn't matter as much when you have a turbo and don't NEED to run high-RPM to flow more through an engine with only a certain amount of displacement.

 

[dsmmike50t]

head
ss valves. Do I need 1mm over?
ti. springs and retainers

1mm over isn't really a must have but If you have the cash why not you'll need it when you decide to make some serious power and your a machinist so there's most of the cost when getting it working. I've seen setups without 1mm over ssvalves make nice power. The gt35r is a nice turbo they make nice power even at low boost I've seen this turbo making close to 400whp on 18psi. With your setup I bet you'll make close to 400 at 18-20. I don't know much on ecu plus but having spark is a plus, ecu+ has alot of things, I say go for it and I think its even cheaper than the link but can't remember.

 

[Tarascan79]

And sense you are a machinist you should check this out and save $400 and be proud of something you did http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=273139 i know im going to give it my best try. Oh and dont forget the BBK 75mm throttle body.If you decide to do the stroker build you will want to get 280s instead of 272s. Check out the DKS brand if you want to save some money without sacrificing to much quality.

 

[dsmmike50t]

^^^
Nice link

 

[Tarascan79]

Here is a link to the cams i wa talking about. They are knock off HKS cams
http://www.ffwdconnection.com/cams.shtml I plan on buying some when i do a stroker.

 

[1g-3g]

That intake looks to be no problem to build. I have been doing cnc machine work for 10 year's now. Should have all the supplies in shop, and better yet since I have moved up to be lead man over the cnc dept. I have a key to teh plant and can go in on weekends to work on it. Saddly I have already bought teh scat rods so dont think I will be doing a stroker.

 

[Tarascan79]

Well if you allready have the rods all you need is the 2.4 crank and stroker weisco pistons.
http://www.slowboyracing.com/estore/product.php?productid=1715&cat=4531&page=1:)

 

[1g-3g]

wow! I thought the rod length was different. thanks alot. I will look when I get home i'm at work now

 

[1g-3g]

Thanks for the help in the recomendation of a stroker. after my reading an research that is the way I am going. I have my rods bought already. will buy my arp studs, and misc. stuff this week. And next week I get the pistons and crank. Also I have decided on the link since I will probly need larger than 750cc injectors, so I printed the manual to start reading. I am not smart enough to go in debt or spend all my savings to build this project car so it is going to take awhile. but that gives plenty of time to read and learn more so I dont look stupid when I ask a question. I am also going to start shaving my valve cover and write a program to engrave 2300 stroker on top. or would 2.3 stroker be more acurate. I think that would look better than the normal DOHC 2000. I will also be building the diy intake. The runners look like a good spot for direct port nitrous injection. That was another reason I chose the link.

 

[Tarascan79]

Well im glad i talked you into going stroker.I cant wait to build one myself. In my opinion it should say 2.3 stroker or just stroker. Well just keep posting any questions you have and good luck. Make sure to get your Balance shaft eliminator kit also.

 

[1g-3g]

I have my rods.
just order a 2.4 crank and stroker pistons should be here by next weekend.
I have read the manuals for both ecu+ and the link and sofar they both are missing something i would want. ecu+ does not support larg enough injectors. the link does not have built in maft. I hope that by the time I get ready for it one or the other will have all I want.

 

[Tarascan79]

Well since youj are going big I think you should go with the new dsmlink. I have no idea when they are planing to bring out the version 3 but I dont know when you plan on having the car runing either. Congrats on ordering your crank though. I cant wait to get my car car jan. hopefully NANOKPSI wont be dicking me around with my money around with my money by then. Good luck with the trades on here.

 

[1g-3g]

I didnt spend the 100 bucks to get the crank balanced. how important is it? should I let the shop do it when they bore the block? Or wait and get the whole rotating assembly balanced? I know that I will not be turning 10000 rpm and will probly set the rev limit around 6000 to 7000 to be safe.

 

[Tarascan79]

Man i cant stress how important it is to get your intire rotating asembley balanced. The way i see it is your dont your might as well tell him to install your $450 scatt rod stick out the side of your block. I just had my entire bottom end assembled by a 20 year proven shop for less than 450.You should get it balanced all at the same time.What rpms did you say you plan on taking your stroker to? 10,000? If so you definatly need dual valve springs along with your cams.