6 bolt swap

[travunder]

No , i was just wondering if all the wiring consists of just the CAS or what, cause vfaq just says all the wiring is CAS and some motor stuff that im not worried about at all. Thanks guys

 

[r1991_4g63t]

woulld be a good idea to wire in ALL of the sensors and senders....

 

[travunder]

woulld be a good idea to wire in ALL of the sensors and senders....

Yeah, thanks which other ones besides the CAS do i wire up is what im asking,thanks

 

[icer412]

So I am looking to try this engine swap out. So I have time to work on it. But here is what I will be trying to do.... Put a 6 bolt 4g63 block with aftermarket internals into a stock automatic tranny 1997 AWD eclipse. I am planning on keeping everything 2g except the block. I have read the magnus and the road race engineering "how too" manuals as well as the dsmtuner walk through, but I still have a few question that I hope someone can help me with.

1. Will my setup work with few troubles? if not what should I do to make it more easy.

2. I bought the bare 6 bolt block already, and I noticed that it does not have a hole in the front of the block (under the thermostat and main water line and close to the tranny) where the 7 bolt block does. This hole in the 7 bolt block takes water from the block and directs it into a line that goes into the turbo as the turbo coolent line. The 6 bolt that I bought doesnt have this in that spot. Is this a problem and what should I do about it?

3. I noticed that the tranny bell housing isnt a perfect fit. The main 4 bolts line up, but the 7 bolt block seems to have an extra thread at the front of the block and the 2g tranny has a bolt that fits into it. The 6 bolt however didnt have this and seems as though the fly wheel might stick out some if it even bolts on. Any ideas about this ?

4. Is there any problems trying to line up the 6 bolt witha 2g auto tranny?

5. I noticed the 6 bolt does not have a crank sensor, but the 7 bolt does, what should I do about this?

6. Since I want to use my stock 2g head is there anything I need to change? I don't see why I would have to change the CAS, but if there is anything at all you guys can tell about this, please I want to hear everything.

7. lastly, Do all the 2g engine parts, like the water pump, oil pump fit onto a 6 bolt? Or will I have to make some changes? If so, what should I buy to make everythign match.


I want to thank you for your help!!! And I look forward to your comments!

 

[icer412]

bump. please help.

 

[6-bolt]

I can't answer any automatic tranny questions. Do not know the subject. But I can answer the last three.

5. I noticed the 6 bolt does not have a crank sensor, but the 7 bolt does, what should I do about this?

You need to get a 1G CAS and re-wire it. The 1G CAS has both edges. In a 2G, the CAS has one edge, while the crank sensor has the other. More of a 1G vs a 2G, then a 6-bolt vs. a 7-bolt.

6. Since I want to use my stock 2g head is there anything I need to change? I don't see why I would have to change the CAS, but if there is anything at all you guys can tell about this, please I want to hear everything.

You need to get the head bolt holes drilled out by a mm. The 7-bolt has 11mm holes, while the 6-bolt has bigger 12mm holes. As I mention above, you have to get a 1G CAS.

7. lastly, Do all the 2g engine parts, like the water pump, oil pump fit onto a 6 bolt? Or will I have to make some changes? If so, what should I buy to make everythign match.

Nope, the water pump, timing belt components, and front case (includes oil pump) and so on are different. Get an bottom end OEM gasket set for the 6-Bolt then buy the rest of the 2G top end gaskets. Even can upgrade the head & exhaust gaskets.

Darren
6Bolt

 

[icer412]

You need to get a 1G CAS and re-wire it. The 1G CAS has both edges. In a 2G, the CAS has one edge, while the crank sensor has the other. More of a 1G vs a 2G, then a 6-bolt vs. a 7-bolt.

so you are saying that I have to get a 1g CAS and put it into my 7 bolt head and the re wire it or get a wire harness ? Are there any major differences between the 90-92 and the 93 - 94 CAS ??? Do they both work for this application? Which would be better?

You need to get the head bolt holes drilled out by a mm. The 7-bolt has 11mm holes, while the 6-bolt has bigger 12mm holes. As I mention above, you have to get a 1G CAS.

So just a simple trip to the shop and get them to thread 12mm holes instead of the 11mm ?

Nope, the water pump, timing belt components, and front case (includes oil pump) and so on are different. Get an bottom end OEM gasket set for the 6-Bolt then buy the rest of the 2G top end gaskets. Even can upgrade the head & exhaust gaskets.

I was a little lost with this one. can you explain what you are saying? Do I buy all the components that came from the 1g , except the the 2g head compents? If I am required to change the CAS would it be easier to just change to a 1g head?




Sorry for so many questions. But, THANK YOU for the help!

 

[super20jay]

Was the six bolt a auto or a stick.

 

[super20jay]

Do you have the Flexplate for the Six bolt ?

 

[6-bolt]

so you are saying that I have to get a 1g CAS and put it into my 7 bolt head and the re wire it or get a wire harness ? Are there any major differences between the 90-92 and the 93 - 94 CAS ??? Do they both work for this application? Which would be better?

Yep, the easiest solution would be to get a 1G CAS, and wire it to the CAS and Crank sensor plugs.

There are three different 1G CASs. The first would be a 90s Green Top, which uses light. The 90 CAS has long wires. The second was the 91-92 CAS, which was the same a the 90s, but had a plug, instead of the wires. The last is a 93-94 Black Top, which uses the Hal effect. Basically magnets with a current sensor. The Black Top is the best, since the Hal effect is a little more accurate then using light. RRE has a good write up.

RRE Instructions

So just a simple trip to the shop and get them to thread 12mm holes instead of the 11mm ?

It is just expanding the bolt holes in the head. So if you take a 6-Bolt head bolt, and tried to fit it through the 7-bolt head, it would not fit. The bolt would be to big for the head. Can have a machine shop do it pretty cheap.

I was a little lost with this one. can you explain what you are saying? Do I buy all the components that came from the 1g , except the the 2g head compents? If I am required to change the CAS would it be easier to just change to a 1g head?

The 6-bolt uses different gaskets. For example the 6-bolt's front case gasket is different then the 7-bolts. Then there is the water pump, oil housing and so on. Should be able to buy all the gaskets for the bottom end in a kit. Please note, you would only need this if you are rebuilding the bottom end of the engine.

The top end, there are not to many gaskets. Basically the head, intake, exhaust, thermostat, and o-rings for the CAS and water pipe. Can buy these for a 2G. Also can upgrade, like a copper exhaust gasket, and a MLS head gasket.

There are some advantages to going to a 1G. The first and biggest is that the throttle body is bigger on the 1G. But the tb can be put on a 2G intake manifold, just have to due a little fab.

Also the 1G has bigger intake ports then 2G, however this might not help too much. Depends on how much air is flowing.

Also you have to modify the front engine mount. The 1G water pump will hit the 2G mount.

Hope this helps.

Darren
6Bolt

 

[icer412]

Do you have the Flexplate for the Six bolt ?

yes, my gsx is an auto tranny. I read about a IPT Kiggy kit, if that is what your talking about. I plan on buying that. Not sure if i need anything else to make this work with auto. any advice?

 

[icer412]

The 6-bolt uses different gaskets. For example the 6-bolt's front case gasket is different then the 7-bolts. Then there is the water pump, oil housing and so on. Should be able to buy all the gaskets for the bottom end in a kit. Please note, you would only need this if you are rebuilding the bottom end of the engine.

The top end, there are not to many gaskets. Basically the head, intake, exhaust, thermostat, and o-rings for the CAS and water pipe. Can buy these for a 2G. Also can upgrade, like a copper exhaust gasket, and a MLS head gasket.

There are some advantages to going to a 1G. The first and biggest is that the throttle body is bigger on the 1G. But the tb can be put on a 2G intake manifold, just have to due a little fab.

Also the 1G has bigger intake ports then 2G, however this might not help too much. Depends on how much air is flowing.

Also you have to modify the front engine mount. The 1G water pump will hit the 2G mount.

Hope this helps.

Wow thank you for the explanation. I appreciate the help. I am sold on the 1g head

Question though, since i will go with the 1g head and plan to buy the CAS with hall effect 94 year ish, will I just buy all the compents as 1g?

 

[6-bolt]

If you are going with a 1G, get a 1G 6-Bolt head. Then you don't have to worry about the bolt hole size. Then you can just buy a complete gasket set for a 6-bolt.

Another thing to think about is the oil housing. The 1990 used an air/oil cooler to cool the oil, like an intercooler. The 1990 oil housing has two ports for hook-up. From 1991 and on, a water/oil was used to cool the oil, which was hooked up between the filter and oil housing. This is why the water pipe and thermostat has extra nipples on the 1991 and later. One thing to think about what set-up you want to use. However I seen many people just ditch the oil cooler when they have no plans for high horsepower. This comes into play on what parts you want to buy. For example, the 1990 and 1991 water pipes are different.

Darren

 

[mitch26753]

Well i'm in the middle of my never ending swap. Had the motor in today and couldn't get the tranny to line up so we took motor out and were going to do it out of the car. The first thing i noticed was the starter plate must of been from a 1g, the holes for the started didn't line up. How much would it hurt if i didn't use one, because the car when i got it didn't have one on it? So i never had the 2g starter plate. This whole swap turned into a mess cause some how a bag of bolts got thrown away! Next questions is. You know how on the back part of the six bolt block, where the losest hole is to bolt on the tranny. That hole has a doewl in it, only problem is on the 7 bolt it's not threaded like it is on the six bolt. On the six bolt the bolt is made to be put in thru the tranny first and bolt to the six bolt block. Well on the 7 bolt tranny it's opposite. you slide the bolt thru the block first into the tranny. So know where stuck with a hole that has thread----doewl,----then threads on the tranny. So what did you guys do? Get a bolt that has threads on the whole bolt? Drill out the threads on the block and just use the threads on the tranny? Also what is the best place to just order bolts? JNZ? or directly from MItsu? Don't say the parts store i'm not dealing with that pain in the ass of finding the right bolt.

 

[mitch26753]

Any answers guys? I also need the half shaft and bracket that bolts to block that for the drivers side too if anyone has one!

 

[97fstclipse]

Hello there,

i got a check engine code, po125, any idea what that is?

i cannot seem to figure out my mbc, it has always boostd to high even with the old engine, if i have my foot barley on the gas maybe 1\4 of the way it boosts around 10 lbs, when i jump on it i can get to around 22 lbs, i know this is not safe, so i never hammer on it.

also sometimes around 15lbs of boost the car does kind of like a shutter kinda like the car shuts off for a second the boost drops all the way down and then i have to begin to build boost again.

also when the car is at idle what should my boost gauge read? im reading inbetwwen -10- -20 vacum. is that normal?

I dont have internet at home please emial me at [email protected]

Thank you,
Brian

 

[congonator]

I have a 97 eclipse GST and recently did a full 6 bolt swap...however, cylinders 2 and 3 aren't firing, the engine cranks but no fire...1 and 4 are working fine...I don't know whats going on...any help is greatly appreciated

Jake

 

[805DSM]

You should check out the MAGNUS 2g 6bolt swap guide , or go to Roadraceengineering.com ,

 

[805DSM]

did u use the 1g cam angle sensor ?

 

[olmytsi]

It's probably something with either the cas wiring or the plug wires. Did you try switching them (wires) around?

 

[clockworktoy]

+1 on the cas wiring, and if your using the coils from your 2g you shouldn't have to swap out your firing order.

 

[TALONTRAX]

yes you do need the plate between the block & tranny. I elongated 2 of the holes in the original 7 bolt plate to make it fit & it worked perfectly. As far as the tranny bolt-up issue, I know that the 6 bolt block has 1 less tranny mounting bolt(I forget which one) all you can do is leave it out. DO NOT put it back together without the starter plate, just modify/open-up the holes so it fits . . .

 

[Deadpool]

You can also take a grinder to the plate to make the starter fit. Each plate is different for different options like stick and auto, FWD and AWD and any other variant of those. If you are FWD 5 speed 2g then that's the plate and starter you are best off using.

 

[r1991_4g63t]

that lower bolt you talked about in the OP goes in thru the engine into the tranny, not in the tranny first

 

[silver bullit]

Questions about how to 6 bolt swap a 2g (just swapping the short blocks out) and other questions about body conversions from 2ga to 2gb talon/eclipse front and maybe sides/rear.

I just got a 2g and since i have a 6 bolt motor id like to just go ahead and switch out just the short blocks! Since this would allow me to keep the new 7 bolt head that i have and keep the intake mani and all the 2g sensors the same.

I need to know what i need to do about this. I suppose i use the 6 bolt short block and throw the 7 bolt head with 7 bolt head studs? Other than trimming the mount for it to clear is that it?


Also what is all needed to do the talon/eclipse 2ga to 2gb front and maybe sides/rear bumper conversion?

Also what do they mean on the magnus site that plugs 1 and 4 switch with 2 and 3?