ohms reading on CKS

[Wildflyer897]

wow its been a really long time since i have been on here. but i need some help. i had a ticking in the 4th cylinder so after some looking and stuff my mechanic tore everything apart and had the crank turned and the basic engine rebuilt. now she won't start. just turns and turns. i have had it in a couple of shops and nobody has a clue. we think its something electric but the diag. book tells us nothing because we already have done everything it tells us.. the only thing we aren't sure of is the crankshaft sensor.. my mechanic would like to know what the ohm's reading is on someone elses mitsu. i drive a 95 rs. thanks for looking..

 

[Talon ESI-T]

No offense Wild, but your mechanic should know better. There isnt an ohm reading on the Crank or cam sensor. They are both hall effect sensors and require the snap on vantage or equivelant graphing meter to test. He should know this unless he is an apprentice or frshly out of school. The hall effect type sensors have been around for 10+ years now.

If he doesnt have access to a graphing meter tell him to put the car on the snap on MT2500 scanner or the OTC genesys scanner and check for crank/cam signal when cranking. All shops should have some type of scanner, those two are the most popular. When testing each sensors unplug the other. In other words, with the scanner hooked up the the car, unplug the cam sensors and crank the car over. See if the scanner reports crank sensor is present. plug in the cam sensors and unplug the crank sensor. crank again and see if cam signal is present. On our cars, if one sensor is bad, it can confuse the ecu and make both sensors look bad.

Make sure the coil has 12+ from the ASD relay.

Do you have spark and Injector pulse?

You had a new motor put in, are you sure the cams are not 180 degrees out of time? When you remove the Valve cover, with the cylinder 1 at TDC, you will see a couple dowel hols in the cams between cylinder 1 and 2. Insert a 1/4" drive extension in each hole. The extension should be perfectly perpendicular to the valve cover gasket surface. If you dont see the holes, rotate the Crank 1 full turn. If those holes dont line up with cylinder 1 at TDC then you have a timing issue.

Another thing to check. Make sure the mechanic didnt flip flop the coil harness plug and the speed sensor plug. They are both the same length in most 2GNT's. If he did, you may be looking at a new ECU.

Let me know what you find.

Terry

 

[Wildflyer897]

ohhh.. well he has be knowledgeable on everything so far.. but i will have a talk with him and see what he says.. it might have just slipped his mind..
to go a little further in depth: we took it to a bigger shop in town and had them look at it.. their first thought was the ecu. but we couldn't understand why... it worked b4 the engine rebuild but not after.. then they checked the 60 wires to the ECU. and what they said is that it is a three row setup.. 1-20 21-40 and 41-60... the middle row, 21-40 matched with their book. but the first and third row, 1-20 and 41-60, didn't. they also checked the fuel pump relay and the ASD. they said the ecu wasn't giving the signal but the relays worked... hence their thought of the bad ecu. and because the fuel pump relay and the asd wasn't getting signal the car wasn't running....

 

[Talon ESI-T]

Well as far as their schematics, dont worry about that. Each year was slightly different and the chiltons manual is notortious for being wrong. Not sure what diagrams they are using, you know.

Since the ASD and Fuel pump relay are not switching, that means it is possible for the ecu to be the problem. First check the coil/speed sensor plug because if you flip flopped them, it will do just this exactly.

More importantly as you said, why did it fail now. Check all the wiring and fuses. IF the ECU is not getting power then the ECU cannot send signal to the relays. Your mechanic may have missed a conector or wire upon installing the motor. I would expect a shop to check for this but the last guy didnt so there goes "expectations"...


Another way to check the computer is to scan it. Many faulted ECU's wont scan. If you know someone that has a good ECU you can try it.

Check the fuse panel under the hood as well, remember all the harnesses were move around.

Also just a tid bit. The shop needs to check the ASD relay and fuel pump as the car is turned on. after 15 secs the ECU shuts the relays off to conserve power until you try to start the car. That is often overlooked.

Terry

 

[dr1665]

At the same time, I'm also curious whether timing is a factor. When my tensioner failed (not completely, just slightly under load), the car would crank and crank, but not fire. I began troubleshooting electrical issues based on a rogue CEL code pointing to something electrical, but never found it.

My guess would be (and this is not to counter Terry, but just as another idea):
Backprobe the CAS while cranking. You should see an alternating 5VDC going hi-lo-hi-lo while the engine turns. The same can be said for the CMP. The CMP will switch slower, due to the cams turning at half crank speed.

Think about it. The ECU needs to know where the crank and cams are before it will fire the injectors or plugs. ASD stands for Auto Shut Down. I'm pretty sure the ECU is programmed to shut the engine down if something is not right, internally. If it doesn't know where the valves are in relation to the pistons, the safest thing that ECU can do is shut the entire process down immediately.

(This is also why, if your timing is too far off, the engine will not run. The ECU sees things are too far out of whack and will not allow you to fire it up. At the limits of safety, the ECU will run that pig like a Harley.)

Good luck to you. PM sent.

 

[XMasta19]

meh...this thread isn't too old.

I don't feel like starting my new thread yet, but I finally got my tranny swapped and now have similar issues. Car ran great for almost 500 miles after rebuild in winter before the tranny grenaded. When I finally got the tranny in recently, I've been having nothing but problems. From getting the infamous code 11, to the car not starting at all. I believe I noticed my egr burning through the harness somewhat and that could very well be the culprit, but haven't managed to find any exposed wires yet. Coil and speed sensor are not switched. Car ran and went to work for one day, only a couple minor rpm fluctuations while otherwise running and idling well. Then to having trouble even starting the car. When I finally had car running again, it shut off on me twice, each time after simply closing the car door hahaha. Something goofy in the electrical world is definitely goin on. I moved the harness some and rerouted some other lines etc, and now all of a sudden my fuel pump doesn't prime when I turn the key to on. It most definitely was working fine up until this point. I guess tonight I'm gonna pull the loom apart and separate that huge mess of wires in the harness to see if I can find any exposed/burnt mess. I guess I should also go about checking the relays to see if the ecu is sending the signal. I miss my car

 

[Wildflyer897]

i would say the thread is too old but my eclipse still isnt running so your still good.
anyways it sounds like we are in the same boat.. while your checking things check your ASD relay and you fuel pump. both are located on the drivers side firewall up high. i can't even switch my coil and speed sensor wires so thats not my problem. i'm taking my car to the AZ2GNT guys and i'll see what they come up with. let me know how your progress goes.. i'm gonna be checking my ecu if i can find one cheap. ### i don't want to fry a brand new 350 dollar ecu and then have the car still dead. shoot me an email and we can talk further if ya want.. Good Luck

 

[XMasta19]

meh...this thread isn't too old.
I guess I should also go about checking the relays to see if the ecu is sending the signal.

I'm still at work, so not sure if I'll get to play with car tonight...but most definitely in the morning when I get up