Another LED upgrade thread.

[DJ Raydiate]

I figured I would go ahead and start a thread on my LED upgrades. I am planing to do custom LED tail lights that are inspired by the Dodge "Race track Light" and will look something like this:

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Everything is going to be controlled by a central control bard that will be connected to the car via 1157 bulb base adapters and a 3 pin plug. This way the only places that I would have to tap into the car is the 3rd brake light signal and the tag light + and -. The control harness will consist of 2 1157 base adapters and a 3 pin plug going into the harness, and then a 7 pin plug and 2 20 pin ATX plugs going into the control box. I will have a 20pin ATX plug going into each of the tail lights and a 7 pin plug going into the center.

Here is the schematic that I have drawn up for the control board.

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When it is all said in done, I will have sequential turn signals and a very unique rear for an Eclipse.

It will be starting the conversion very soon so I'll keep that updated.

I have went ahead and started on other things however. Today I made the harnesses for the Demon eyes for my car and did a test fit.

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I still have to take the headlight out and get the LED mounted into the projector. I do plan on doing a true HID retrofit to the headlights so the mounting would be somewhat temporary.

All of this would be just the start of things to come on my LED upgrade Path. I will not be using any of the pnp LEDs that they have out there. Everything will be hand soldered and custom fit to the car so its going to be fun, fun.

 

[GSLENK]

Looks nice and it looks like you know what you are doing.

I think the logos, eclipse, and sequential part are a bit too much for me. The rest looks really clean.

What brand LEDs are you working with? I used phillips lumiled series and they have held up to a lot of use. (almost a year of daily driving).

 

[DJ Raydiate]

For the tail lights, I too am using the HPWTs. Over there on HIDPLANET, they seem to be the one of the leds of choice so I figure I'd do it right the first time. I also used the HPWTs for the Demon eyes and voltage regulator so they should last a good while.

The logos are going to be there for the reflector of the light. I also plan on getting some lancer rear lower reflectors and mounting them on the car so that way I still have somewhat of a reflector on the rear of the car

 

[greengoblin2011]

I think it all looks sick! I love the taillight setup, keep that updated, I want to watch and see the finished product. I like that you have it all planned out and drawn up, very detail oriented. Will defintely turn out well.

 

[DJ Raydiate]

I think it all looks sick! I love the taillight setup, keep that updated, I want to watch and see the finished product. I like that you have it all planned out and drawn up, very detail oriented. Will defintely turn out well.

Yeah I have been planning to do this for well over a year and have been doing research on it all before I started. I wanted to make sure I had an understanding of what I was getting into. I will be posting pics when I actually start on the lights. everything from the LEDs, components, mounting, etc. It's going to be fun and can't wait to really get into do it.

 

[dsmcrzy]

Wow those will be nice!! I have been wanting to do something similar with your tail light outline for running lights and then the center of each side as the brake/ sequential turn signals.

I am looking forward to seeing more of this!

 

[DJ Raydiate]

The way I have it designed is the entire ring is going to be Run/Brake and the outer lights will also be the sequential turns. The only thing I haven't figured out as of yet(or maybe ever) is how to keep the brakes on the outsides not to sequence when I hit the brake. It will only happen once until I take my foot off the brake and hit it again but I think it will still be OK. The lettering in the center and the symbols are going to be strictly run only.

 

[DJ Raydiate]

Beings that it's snowing in NC today I figured that I would play around inside

Just to give people a perspective of how intricate this or any custom LED project is, here is the size of the LEDs that I will be using for the tail lights. I will be ordering 1200 of these LEDS to do my tail lights, however I will only be using about 580 to 600 depending on how I space them.

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I went ahead and did a small array to get the hang of handling and soldering them onto copper ringed project board.
Front.

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Back.

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My soldering station and homemade power supply.

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All lit up.

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I wanted to see what just 6 of these looked like inside the housings so I did a test fit. I still need to work on the spacing but I think that it will work out alright once I get to paint the lenses.
Head on view.

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Slight angle.

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I would still need to put some chrome bright inside the housing and on the board before I do the actual LEDS for it to reflect more light.

 

[1sick_gst]

Looking forward to seeing the outcome to this project!!

 

[91-GS]

Did you use flux on the solder joints? Did not look like you did.

For soldering many LEDs in place it might be simpler to use flux-solder mix (can be found at a hardware store, used in plumbing) and a torch. Make the board, then put drops of the mix where LEDs need to be. Position LEDs on the solder and the torch to melt it. It will flow away from material of the board and melt nicely along the traces, attaching the LEDs. Solder will melt way before a component is damaged by heat (at least with something like this) so there should not be any damage if you do it carefully.

 

[We're on Boost]

Looks like a great project. I see pwm chips in your diagram - is that pulse-width-modulated? Would that be for controlling dimming of the LED's?
And the 9 volt regulators, are the LED's 9 volt, or is there something else going on there?

 

[DJ Raydiate]

Did you use flux on the solder joints? Did not look like you did.

For soldering many LEDs in place it might be simpler to use flux-solder mix (can be found at a hardware store, used in plumbing) and a torch. Make the board, then put drops of the mix where LEDs need to be. Position LEDs on the solder and the torch to melt it. It will flow away from material of the board and melt nicely along the traces, attaching the LEDs. Solder will melt way before a component is damaged by heat (at least with something like this) so there should not be any damage if you do it carefully.

I did use a flux paste but hand soldered the connections. One has to watch what kind of flux they get in the plumbing section because a lot of it is acid based and can destroy electronic components.

With that being said, I will have many, many hand soldered joints in my project. In the end, I will not be mounting the LEDs on copper boards but mounting them on Lexan sheets. You will see when I get to that point.

Looks like a great project. I see pwm chips in your diagram - is that pulse-width-modulated? Would that be for controlling dimming of the LED's?
And the 9 volt regulators, are the LED's 9 volt, or is there something else going on there?

Yes, the pwms are in fact pulse width modulars and they will be controlling the brightness of the run circuit of the LEDs. The LEDs have a min 2.0 forward voltage. I will be regulating them at 9v so that way they will still be bright even if the car is off. I plan on going to a lot of cruise ins when I move down to FL in the next 2 months. Once the tail lights are done, it would be the perfect time to show them off.

Edit: This test batch of LEDs that I have has a typical fv of 2.2. I have them in series of 3 with a resistor.

 

[We're on Boost]

Yes, the pwms are in fact pulse width modulars and they will be controlling the brightness of the run circuit of the LEDs. The LEDs have a min 2.0 forward voltage. I will be regulating them at 9v so that way they will still be bright even if the car is off. I plan on going to a lot of cruise ins when I move down to FL in the next 2 months. Once the tail lights are done, it would be the perfect time to show them off.

Edit: This test batch of LEDs that I have has a typical fv of 2.2. I have them in series of 3 with a resistor.

Oh I see, with 3 in series they will never see more than 3 volts each, and the pwm's will control the amount of current going through them, I guess, unless it isn't that simple.
This is cool stuff, I have never really looked into it before. So I googled up a nice little article to read about it, here:

LEDs_104 - Constant Brightness Circuits Although this .. .. doesn't talk about dimming.

Florida, ah yes, I have nice memories of driving around in Florida in-town in a 1968 Camaro SS 350. With the windows rolled down, nice warm weather, people will just start talking to you when you're sitting at a stop light. I miss that.

 

[DJ Raydiate]

Kind of. For example, with 3 in series @ 2.5fv each, you add the fv together and get a total of 7.5fv. With regulating them at 9v, you have to use a resistor to eat the rest of the 1.5v to equal the 9v.

The PWM is not going to limit the current at all. However, if you look at the PWM as a switch, it turns the LEDs on and off at such a hi rate giving the effect of dimming. The faster they turn on and off, the dimmer they appear. The slower they turn on and off, the brighter they appear. I could have used a resistor in place of the PWMs but I wanted to be able to adjust the dimming effect anytime I want without having to desolder the resistor and place a new value one in.

Both my wife and I grew up in Jacksonville FL and moved to Nc 10 years ago. We have decided to move back to Jax. for better opportunities plus we both miss it.

As for me working on this project, I am still in testing stages and still get to work on it between packing so I'll still have updates. In fact, I'll have one coming up this week so I will keep everyone posted. After my wife and I move, that's when the real fun is going to happen.

 

[91-GS]

Did not know that acid based flux is bad for electronics. Thanks for the warning.

 

[Blurred Talon]

Few tips I can share from doing this myself.

Make your own boards, there is a small learning curve and it's a bit of money to get going but the results are worth it.

Get a good soldering station, I've got a Weller WESD51 and I love it.

Sticky paste flux makes soldering SMD (surface mount) components very easy.

Pack your LEDs as close together as possible.

 

[Ghost_92TSi]

Check out a new mustang wiring diagram. They are sequential for turn only and solid for hazards and brakes. I did the conversion harness for my moms 06 and it cycles once when you brake, not terrible but it is different.

 

[curt-s]

I've gone through this as well for a 1Ga, though I went the Arduino + PCA9685 route for control, sequencing, and PWM.

Be aware that the refit PSU might cause you an issue with testing just because those computer power supplies do NOT like to supply a heavy load at PWM duty cycles. I was using around 200Hz and a >400W Antec unit kept tripping at around 40% for less than 275 HPWT-DH00-G4000.

I'd too suggest making your own boards. That perforated board, while convenient, may warp over time due to various environmental factors. You want a strong board; I'd suggest FR4. Custom fabrication of your boards is more costly, but the end result is much, much nicer. However, if you do decide to go with that perf board, then at the very least, do not skimp out. Get good quality stuff (not from China's side of eBay).

I will second the good quality soldering station. Hakko is another great brand. You'll want something with variable temperature and accuracy, especially if you have to do rework. China knockoffs are never accurate enough.

Good call on the 9v regulation. I assume you're using Sharp PQ09RD21?

If you don't want to bother with flux (I didn't), I find that tinning one of the pads on the board works fine enough. Place your resistor, hold it down with tweezers and heat up the tinned pad a little bit. The solder will flow onto the resistor contact by itself, and all you have left is a touch of solder on the other side. Probably REALLY patronizing you here though

 

[DJ Raydiate]

Thanks everyone for chiming in. Much knowledge. I'm sure i was leaving something out trying to explain the fv and PWMs.

Did not know that acid based flux is bad for electronics. Thanks for the warning.

Hey you're welcome. Im still learning so any info that I can give to help other people out, I will .

Few tips I can share from doing this myself.

Make your own boards, there is a small learning curve and it's a bit of money to get going but the results are worth it.

Get a good soldering station, I've got a Weller WESD51 and I love it.

Sticky paste flux makes soldering SMD (surface mount) components very easy.

Pack your LEDs as close together as possible.

I would like to get into making my own boards but right now its just not feasible. We live on well water and there isn't a waste disposal around for something like that and my father inlaw doesn't want to take it to work with him to dump into Cree's disposal system.

I talked to Defyant over on Hidplanet about mounting that many LEDs on lexan and he said that I shouldn't have any issues. I may do my own boards after I move to FL. The water plant can deal with the waste .

Check out a new mustang wiring diagram. They are sequential for turn only and solid for hazards and brakes. I did the conversion harness for my moms 06 and it cycles once when you brake, not terrible but it is different.

I did look into the mustang harness but to me it was a waste. it was like over 100 bucks for only 3 sequental sections. I can make an analog sequential unit with up to 10 sections for a fraction of the cost. However, I already stole the lit door sill idea from them. www.dsmtuners.com/forums/appearance-interior-exterior/466973-custom-door-sill-lights-lots-pics.html. I also have something else planned that I am going to steal from the mustang but that will be another day.

I've gone through this as well for a 1Ga, though I went the Arduino + PCA9685 route for control, sequencing, and PWM.

Be aware that the refit PSU might cause you an issue with testing just because those computer power supplies do NOT like to supply a heavy load at PWM duty cycles. I was using around 200Hz and a >400W Antec unit kept tripping at around 40% for less than 275 HPWT-DH00-G4000.

I'd too suggest making your own boards. That perforated board, while convenient, may warp over time due to various environmental factors. You want a strong board; I'd suggest FR4. Custom fabrication of your boards is more costly, but the end result is much, much nicer. However, if you do decide to go with that perf board, then at the very least, do not skimp out. Get good quality stuff (not from China's side of eBay).

I will second the good quality soldering station. Hakko is another great brand. You'll want something with variable temperature and accuracy, especially if you have to do rework. China knockoffs are never accurate enough.

Good call on the 9v regulation. I assume you're using Sharp PQ09RD21?

If you don't want to bother with flux (I didn't), I find that tinning one of the pads on the board works fine enough. Place your resistor, hold it down with tweezers and heat up the tinned pad a little bit. The solder will flow onto the resistor contact by itself, and all you have left is a touch of solder on the other side. Probably REALLY patronizing you here though

Thanks for the heads up on the ATX power supply. As long as I am able to test the LEDs to make sure the work after that are mounted, I'll be ok. I plan on building the control board first and the wiring harness for the car. Once those 2 are done, I can use the cars power to test the function of the system.

The station that I have is a Hakko clone. I like it and if it ever goes out on me, I can use genuine Hakko replacement parts. I had seen a review of it before I bought it from someone who does electronics for a living and he said that he liked it so that was good enough for me. It may not heat up or recover as fast as the Hakko but for me, It gets the job done.

The vregs are in fact the PQ09RD21s. I wanted a ldo regulator and didn't trust some of the other so called ldo vregs that one sees on ebay. Plus I wanted the 4th just in case and ended up needing it as you can see in the schematic.

 

[DJ Raydiate]

Alright, as promised, I have a small update. Beings that I don't want to get too heavy into doing the LED upgrades in the car right before I move to FL, it gives me a chance to play around to do little test.

I conducted two test for this installment that I would like to share.

Beings that I am masking most of the tail lights, I am going to lose a little of the factory reflectors in the rear. I was trying to come up with a way to gain something reflective in the tail lights so that way I can stay somewhat DOT approved so I looked into REFLECTIVE CONSPICUITY TAPE (the kind that you see on the side of trailers). I just wasn't sure if it was conductive or not. I had a suppler send me some samples for me to test out.

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It turns out that the grade of tape I got is non conductive so it was time to get to playing with some LEDs. I first used a single LED to see what it would look like with the tape behind it and if it would help the LED appear brighter/bigger.

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Notice the light ring around the LED. This stuff looks to be promising at this point so it was time to do an array. I had some thin plastic left from when I did my lit door sill project that I used to attach the tape to.

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Now I wont bore you with pics but after the tape was on the plastic, I drilled hole for the LED legs and spaced them a LED apart. When I do the lights, the LEDs will be packed together so this way just for testing. I used 3 LEDs for the array just to see what the output would be like.

Now here is where the 2nd test comes into play .

With me doing this on plastic, obviously I couldn't just solder the LEDs down to it. An idea arises . My father-in-law had some dollhouse electrical tape laying around so I took some .

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I wanted to see how the spacing for the LED legs would look like so I sat a LED on top. Wouldn't you know, perfect!

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This tape is made from Cir-Kit Concepts. It is a tape so it has an adhesive back that you can stick to what ever.

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After sticking it to the back of the plastic, I pealed the top protective layer off of the Cir-Kit tape. I didn't know if I could just solder right onto it as is, so I cleaned it up a little with a small foam nail file.

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After it was all cleaned up, I cut spaces in the tape to where it would not create a short. It was like etching copper pads out, but with a knife instead. Once cut out, it was time to solder the components into place. I did it real quick so it wasn't my best soldering job.

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After everything was set, I was happy the way everything was working out. Both tapes seam to be promising for the projects. The only thing that I didn't like was the fact that the reflective tape ended up with a slight discoloration from the soldering iron. I think that if it was on something thicker, it would have been fine. Other than that, these test worked out great.

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I still have to figure out if I want to use some stock housings for the tail lights or get some clears. Beings that I will be painting them to my liking, I could go either way I guess.

Her are some pics of just the 3 LEDs inside the center section. You can compare them to the other pics of the center section that has 6 LEDs in them and see the results.

Head on.

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Slight angle.

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[We're on Boost]

"CONSPICUITY TAPE" ..... Now why didn't I think of that?

"dollhouse electrical tape" ..... Of course, why didn't I think of that?



Good going.

 

[DJ Raydiate]

"CONSPICUITY TAPE" ..... Now why didn't I think of that?

"dollhouse electrical tape" ..... Of course, why didn't I think of that?



Good going.

Thanks. All of this was just testing but beings that I will be using Lexan sheets as my boards, This seams like it would work full scale.

 

[spyderdrifter]

Once I get around to building my LED tail lights, I'm using carbon fiber for the boards since the heat generated by some LEDs won't burn, warp, or otherwise distort the carbon. Lexan may work, but I'd think extra heat, introduced to the Lexan over and over across countless cycles, may eventually warp it, or make it brittle.. guess I'm thinking of thermal convection.

 

[DJ Raydiate]

The way that it was explained to me for using Lexan is that if it was bad for the Lexan, it would be bad for the lenses as well. I had talked to someone over there at HIDPlanet and he uses it all the time. So after talking with him, I figured it would be OK.

 

[spyderdrifter]

The only reson I would see it bad for the Lean but not the lens, is because the bulbs would be mounted to the Lexan, and still sit 1-2 inches from the lens. There'd be a decent gap between the bulbs and lens.