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Turbo System Tech: 4G63 turbos, Intercooling, Boost Control, Wastegates, etc.

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Old 08-13-2005, 11:51 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #1 (permalink)
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Big T28 dyno sheets


I just put my car back together with more than enough supporting mods and a big t28 and I was wondering if anyone with a big t28 or one with similar mods was making decent hp and 1/4 mile times?
mod list in profile:


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Old 08-14-2005, 12:11 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #2 (permalink)
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My setup is VERY similar to yours, minus the cam gears and suspension. I still have stock suspension and a unopened engine (just done the timing belt really). my FP BT28 is awesome. It has served its purpose and done more than I can ask for. I bought it since I wanted a better turbo as a acquired the parts to get my car ready for a bigger turbo, IE intake, FMIC, injectors ect. When I first got the BT28 I had a BOV, airfilter and cat back if im not mistakin now I have added the parts listed in my profile. now to answer your questions:

I live and race in SLC Utah. elevation 4200ft. my best 1/4 mile was a 12.831@110 this was with DSMlink, with a SAFC I was still ran a high 12.8xx but the timing curve is much easier to maintain (I just posted in a previous post of yours). I have never been on a dyno so I can not give HP or TQ numbers but she does move even more so when you look under the hood and turbo is so small you can barely see it with the exhaust mani heatshilds on. Best thing to do is take your car out yourself and run it, you will see what it can do. I hate when I see a freinds car (after they sell it) out and about I ask the new owner "what can it do"? they answer I run xx.xx, I ask when? the say well it wasn't me but I was told it done that before. ALOT of racing is in the driving and your familiarity with your car. 2nd most important thing is TUNING.

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Old 08-14-2005, 12:23 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #3 (permalink)
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Thanks,
I have kind of set up a goal to eventually put down about 360 to the wheels with that turbo and I believe it can be down after i add my imaginary hks cams and magnus intake manifold, coming soon now I am anticipating 330 whp after tuning. sound reasonable?

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Old 08-14-2005, 05:58 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #4 (permalink)
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I manged to pull a 12.959 on pump @ 20-21psi. It was a hot and humid day ~95*, 18" street tires and a lousy launch and 1-2 shift. I wouldn't go with 272 cams or smim if you plan to stay with a BIG28 as they may hurt your lower end performance.

I wasn't a firm believer of the BIG T28 but after I got my baseline runs in with a mediocre tune, that little bastard does pack a punch. I'd recommend an adjustable actuator, even though I didn't have one, I've heard from reliable sources they work great.

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Old 08-14-2005, 07:34 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #5 (permalink)
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Thanks, espinelli
I was under the impression that I could only purchase a 17lb bigger articulator instead of a adj.one for the t-28?

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Old 08-14-2005, 04:47 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #6 (permalink)
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Sure no problem. I only know of a 17psi adjustable actuator. If there is a non adjustable rated for 17psi I wasn't aware of it. Below is the product link I was referring to. Good luck with your setup.

http://linux.forcedperformance.net/m...egory_Code=DSM

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Old 12-07-2005, 12:31 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #7 (permalink)
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so,is this turbo fine for fwd cars then? io run high compression and i need a turbo that spools fast,and one that is powerful at about 15psi.. (because of the high compression) (9.5 ish)

my buddies always saying 16g.. but he has boostcreep issues and it spools kinda slow..
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Old 12-07-2005, 01:25 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #8 (permalink)
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16g, b16g, t28 ect all spool fast. They are smaller turbos and just what they do, if his spools slow then either A) your perception of SLOW will change when you ride in a car with a "big turbo", or b) your friend has a BIG BOOST LEAK. Just looking thru a few post for turboing a NA, I see 16Gs are used quite often so you might be safe running one of those at lower boost levels.

You say your engine is "high compression", but did you build it that way or is it just a stock NA engine? If its a stocker, read thru a few posts in the NA to turbo forum and get a idea of what works and what does not. If it were up to me I would have waited a bit and got a bigger turbo (Full garrett 60 trim) with a bigger exhaust housing. The things are good on pump, better on 110, good at the track and street. "just enough" IMHO.

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Old 12-08-2005, 09:05 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #9 (permalink)
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lets keep this alive cause i dont think there are enuff BigT-28 threads about the turbos performance. Just bickering threads about, 16g or T-28?!?!


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Old 12-09-2005, 01:54 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #10 (permalink)
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I think 330 w.h.p. is realistic and probably the practical upper limit for a T28. The secret is holding boost, that isn't so easy on a T28 because of the large wastegate flapper. I have zero intake/exhaust leaks and a high pressure wastegate actuator, and my boost still drops off to 17 psi by redline when set for 21 psi in the midrange.

I'm going to try a boost controller with rpm programmable settings. I've already run 21 psi at redline, but I had to tolerate 24-25 psi in the midrange. Man, the power difference between 21 psi in the midrange and 24-25 psi is huge, at least 30 h.p. So its obvious my wastegate actuator can hold the exhaust back pressure but not in a linear way.

I'd say to run even 330 w.h.p., you'd need to hold 21-23 psi to 7000 rpm to have a chance. On another note, cams are a guaranteed 25 h.p. on a T28, worth every penny.

My goal is to hit 38 lb/min on my T28, highest I've hit so far is 36.5 lb/min.
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Old 12-09-2005, 04:24 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #11 (permalink)
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You know whats really messed up. There are talons/eclipses on this board pulling 12's with around 110 mph traps with the stock 14B turbo and with minimum to zero fuel mods.

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Old 12-09-2005, 07:08 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimatedsm
You know whats really messed up. There are talons/eclipses on this board pulling 12's with around 110 mph traps with the stock 14B turbo and with minimum to zero fuel mods.
Those 14b equipped cars were most likely light weight 1gs, possibly even FWD, and gutted to boot, along with high octane race fuel, and a high flowing 1g intake manifold and cylinder head. You can't compare that to a heavy 2g AWD on pump gas. Strap a T28 to that 14b equipped car and it would pick up 5 mph.

I'd expect a full weight 2g AWD on pump gas running a T28 rated at 35 lb/min to trap 111 mph using the trap speed calculator.
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Old 12-10-2005, 02:49 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #13 (permalink)
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I enjoyed my AGP bigT28 for 6 months. I had a completely stock internal motor and ran 12.8 @ 109 on 18 psi on pump gas in my 98 GSX. I was on junk cut springs at the time with crappy street tires. I never got a chance to push the turbo to its full potential. I was tuning with an EGT gauge & pocketlogger. I was using an SAFC for fuel control. I was also on stock 450cc injectors also. The car was a blast to drive. The turbo is a great turbo to start modding with. I would recommend it to anyone.

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Old 12-10-2005, 03:45 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #14 (permalink)
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This is from the guys at Far North Racing.

Check out this link.


I ran a BIG28 for about a year on my car. It was on the 2.0L for about 10 months, then after a month of down time I used it to break in my 2.3L. I absolutely loved that turbo. It's boost response was super fast and I never had a problem with it. If I was to do another dsm I'd make it a daily driven 2g w/ a big28 and all the supporting mods.


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Old 12-10-2005, 04:26 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #15 (permalink)
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BigT28 and top end


Hi guys,

I am happy to finally see a thread dedicated to the T28.. I am interested in buying a FPBigT28 and what I really want to know, from all you BigT28 owners is: How is the top end (after 5500Rpm) with this turbo, compared to the stock t25?? I really like the stock turbo, but after 5500 rpm it doesn't pull that much... Is this the same with a Big T28 or not? And also is there a real difference compared to the T25 in power?


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Old 12-10-2005, 04:46 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #16 (permalink)
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Big28 is like the big 16g power wise. There will be a significant gain over your stock T-25 turbo. Unlike the T-25, it can hold around 20 psi to redline.

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Old 12-10-2005, 04:51 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #17 (permalink)
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re


That's great to hear! Is it worth to port a BgT28, if I am planning only a 2.5 inch Cat back?

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Old 12-11-2005, 07:15 AM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CRiXman
That's great to hear! Is it worth to port a BgT28, if I am planning only a 2.5 inch Cat back?
Crixman,

FP's Big28 comes ported already to "7cm", or 2.36" inlet dia, and yes porting is worth it. Buy the FP 17 psi adjustable wastegate actuator ($99), don't ask just do it Skip the 2.5" catback exhaust and run a 3" catback, again, you'll thank me later. Read this if you must know why: Thermal R&D Exhaust Review, 2g AWD

I just looked at the Big28's compressor map (Garrett 62 trim 60mm) just to double check its performance envelope. Its compressor flows 35 lb/min @ 14.7 psi, and maxxes at 38 lb/min @ about 20.5 psi or so. Thats in 85* weather. It'll flow an extra 1% for every 10* temperature drop, according to Garrett's massairflow temperature correction formula. So going from 85*F to 30*F you'd actually be able to get 40 lb/min out of one, or 400 crank h.p.

Last edited by pboglio; 12-11-2005 at 10:07 AM.
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Old 12-11-2005, 06:51 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #19 (permalink)
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so where does the bigt28 fit in comparison to these 14b, e16g as far as supported HP?


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Old 12-11-2005, 07:38 PM Show Printable Version Show Printable Version   Email this Post to a Friend Email this Post      #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mellon
so where does the bigt28 fit in comparison to these 14b, e16g as far as supported HP?
It would fall in between them both.


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