Anyone into Eprom tuning?

[MountainDew]

I know it's old technology and isn't very desired, but I think I'm going to take this route. My dad has an old S4 Eprom Programmer. I've read up on tuning with TunerPro. I'm still trying to learn about the BIN and Hex files and what not, but I've got a general idea on how everything works.

Only thing is the TunerPro software seems to be pretty limited on what you can do. I've heard about the "RT" edition, but I don't know what more you can do with that. I know with TunerPro, I can make all my fuel adjustments, which is nice. No need for an SAFC or anything.

Basically, I'm wanting to know if there is any program out there with even more tuning capabilities. I would like to have something that is DSMLink based, adding my own stutter box would be awesome!

Anyone do Eprom Tuning though? Thoughts? Suggestions? Any input is appreciated and it would be awesome to see if there are some other programs out there. Note, I have never tuned in my life before. All I've done is help my buddy with his Snyper Tuning Software on his 96 Cobra.

 

[bling5tatus]

Check ds-map.net

TunerPro RT allows you to make adjustments to the eprom's image in real time with the laptop connected to the car.... (I think)... it also gets rid of the nag screen at start up.

You're definitely on the cheapest path to enlightenment, and I am pursuing a dsmap setup myself.... and then I can take that wretched afc off of my car.

 

[Ceddy]

Check ds-map.net

DS-Map is an awesome program, but for 1Gs only.
I assume the OP is talking about his 95.

To do real-time changes you will need the Moates Ostrich Eprom-Emulator and TunerPro RT.

If your just burning chips plain TunerPro is fine. Most guys use TunerPro to edit Maps and a HexEditer to change code by hand.

Yahoo Groups DSM-ECU is where you want to check for more info. But the search function is broke there right now, so its kind of useless unless you want to read thru like 8000 messages.

TunerPro is just a generic editor, you have to create your own definition file for your car. There isn't a program out there just for DSMs. If you want all the capabilities of DSMLink, you need to buy DSMLink. But if you want to do almost anything imaginable with your ecu, eprom editing is the way to go.

I'm running 1G timing maps on my 2G with 6-bolt swap(7.8:1 compression) and it greatly improved performance. The guy on here with the twincharger setup has his ecu add fuel when knock is detected before pulling timing. The guys at DS-Map have a full speed density setup for 1Gs.

I have a basic 2G eprom editing guide in the Tech section here. I've been working on a full disassembly of the EB23C (2G) eprom and have made some good progress. I have also been working a ALDL logger for the 95-96 ecu; 150+ samples/sec, log knock, injector duty cycle, solenoid and injector tests, etc. You can check out www.ceddy.us for some of my stuff, though I haven't updated in a while.

If there are any other people working on the 2G code, please show yourselves. Seems like I'm the only one sometimes. I'd like to get a mailing list together so we can all help each other out.

 

[jspec]

Has anyone figured out how to use an eprom with tunerpro on a 97-99 with the inverted CAS?

 

[Black_Bullet]

Me and a friend ( well mainly him im still learning how to use it.) we use a eprom-rom tuning software to burn and reflash rewriteable eprom ecu chips . http://www.moates.net/index.php?cPath=26Its a 1g program but you connect it to usb to serial adaptors with a laptop and can do road tuning right there in the car ( similar to dsmlink ) but the only draw back is keeping the ecu openly available to keep pulling in and out chips. Nothing big though. Its not as good as dsmlink at all, but cheap and cost effective way to get some road tuning.
It allows you to edit and alter the stock maps or even erase or change them completely but just small changes can alter things a lot and it takes time to get used to as im still not. Pretty much the same thing keydiver does; except keydiver only gives a base tune unless otherwise specified were as this allows us to give ourselves are more aggressive specific tune for our own cars individual intrincies. http://www.moates.net/index.php?cPath=50 http://users.wpi.edu/~ktarry/dsmtech/dsmromedit.html
http://www.ds-map.net/phpBB2/
Me and my friend just arent able to do ALL the features that keydiver does especially the more advanced ones.

Basically my car is set up with

altered air fuel ratio
altered timing advance and timing maps, extended maps
phantom knock delete, phantom knock ignore up to a certain point
2g/3g mass air sensor comp, injector compensation,deadtime and global changes, increased fuel pressure correction, idle correction, a knock alarm buzzer set to go off at 10counts of knock tapping into the purge solenoid signal, cyclone manifold activation, stuttarbox- 2step, nlts, rev limit change, fuel cut deletion, air flow cap deletion,
extended or shortened closed loop operation, octane value reset, yada yada think thats about it give or take a few more features...

Any kind of tuning or altering of stock maps should be taken very cautiously and a logger and wideband should be handy.

 

[Ravenous]

Me and a friend ( well mainly him im still learning how to use it.) we use a eprom-rom tuning software to burn and reflash rewriteable eprom ecu chips . Chips and Sockets : Moates.Net a 1g program but you connect it to usb to serial adaptors with a laptop and can do road tuning right there in the car ( similar to dsmlink ) but the only draw back is keeping the ecu openly available to keep pulling in and out chips. Nothing big though. Its not as good as dsmlink at all, but cheap and cost effective way to get some road tuning.
It allows you to edit and alter the stock maps or even erase or change them completely but just small changes can alter things a lot and it takes time to get used to as im still not. Pretty much the same thing keydiver does; except keydiver only gives a base tune unless otherwise specified were as this allows us to give ourselves are more aggressive specific tune for our own cars individual intrincies. Realtime Chip Emulation : Moates.Net http://users.wpi.edu/~ktarry/dsmtech/dsmromedit.html
http://www.ds-map.net/phpBB2/
Me and my friend just arent able to do ALL the features that keydiver does especially the more advanced ones.

Basically my car is set up with

altered air fuel ratio
altered timing advance and timing maps, extended maps
phantom knock delete, phantom knock ignore up to a certain point
2g/3g mass air sensor comp, injector compensation,deadtime and global changes, increased fuel pressure correction, idle correction, a knock alarm buzzer set to go off at 10counts of knock tapping into the purge solenoid signal, cyclone manifold activation, stuttarbox- 2step, nlts, rev limit change, fuel cut deletion, air flow cap deletion,
extended or shortened closed loop operation, octane value reset, yada yada think thats about it give or take a few more features...

Any kind of tuning or altering of stock maps should be taken very cautiously and a logger and wideband should be handy.

Would you mind sharing your code for the phantom knock delete? I've searched the yahoo group but there isn't anything conclusive to the right code, just bits and pieces from different posts. I would appreciate it. I am thinking of trying to contact Kyle and see if he will let us put his eprom codes up in the tech section. Then I would also like to gather up the knock gauge and pk code so that pretty much everything is in one place.
Thanks,
Chris

 

[spaugh]

Have you all look at the Ostrich that Moates offers it is an eprom emulator that lets you send your eprom flash to it instead of having to re flash a chip for every change.

 

[Ravenous]

I have the ostrich and I think it is great. I wish there was a switch on it so you could load 2 different roms. I would make one for e85 and one for 93 so I could leave the laptop at home and just flip the switch depending on what gas is available. I will have to just burn the chips and install a dual image switch.

 

[bling5tatus]

Ostrich can hold enough mem for 8x32k bins.... All you'd need then is software that allows you to switch between them. A hard wired switch like the one from dsmchips is not necessary when you have an emu.

 

[Ravenous]

The software is the problem, I don't want to have to pull out my laptop everytime I have to run the other gas. So in the end I think the dsmchip setup is much better once I get my tune finalized that way it is just a flick of the switch. Don't get me wrong I will be using the ostrich for quite some time, but once there are no more changes to make I will just burn the chips and use the switch and be done... if I am ever really done

 

[unlmtdndeavor]

PM pneumo (dave). He's had great results with chip burning. He ran 11's on the stock turbo, with the stock smic, tb, injectors, etc. On his gt35r setup he's done 10.8 i believe

 

[sbiggi]

Would you mind sharing your code for the phantom knock delete? I've searched the yahoo group but there isn't anything conclusive to the right code, just bits and pieces from different posts. I would appreciate it. I am thinking of trying to contact Kyle and see if he will let us put his eprom codes up in the tech section. Then I would also like to gather up the knock gauge and pk code so that pretty much everything is in one place.
Thanks,
Chris

Its there, but I'll post it.

5B9D: 86 FF LDAA $00FF ; Load 255d (max) to A

5B9F: 97 52 STAA L0052 ; Store 255d (FFh) to octane (mem address 52)

5BA1: 96 E1 LDAA L00E1 ; Load airflow per rev to accA

5BA3: 81 8C CMPA $0082 ; Compare to 8Ch (130d), which is approximately 0 psi

5BA5: 23 03 BLS 5BAA ; If E1 is greater than 130, do nothing; jump out

5BA7: 7E DB F3 JMP DBF3 ; Jump to end of octane code area

5BAA: 86 00 LDAA $0000 ; Load 00h (zero) to accA

5BAC: 97 8B STAA L008B ; Store 00h (zero) to knock sum address

5BAE: 7E DB F3 JMP DBF3 ; Jump to end of octane code area




changing 5C0E to 20 26, which will bypass the whole octane map calculation

 

[sbiggi]

I have the ostrich and I think it is great. I wish there was a switch on it so you could load 2 different roms. I would make one for e85 and one for 93 so I could leave the laptop at home and just flip the switch depending on what gas is available. I will have to just burn the chips and install a dual image switch.

Read more on the yahoo group and write your own code. Its not to difficult.
I have 4 seperate maps on my chip that are on the fly selectable by switch.

 

[Ravenous]

Was that on Kyle's page? I try to read the code and understand it. It is just hard to do without much coding background. I downloaded the commented disassembly to try to figure it all out but I get so afraid of doing something really foolish and detrimental to my car. The hex code is easy to do for the layman so that is what I usually look for. Thanks for the help, I do appreciate it.

 

[sbiggi]

Was that on Kyle's page? I try to read the code and understand it. It is just hard to do without much coding background. I downloaded the commented disassembly to try to figure it all out but I get so afraid of doing something really foolish and detrimental to my car. The hex code is easy to do for the layman so that is what I usually look for. Thanks for the help, I do appreciate it.

The commented disassembly is great. I used that and other people's commented code to write my own.

The only thing that has ever happened when I messed up code is
a) the car didnt start
b) car barely ran

I screw up the code all the time when I'm writing new stuff, it usually takes me a few read threws and trying it in the car to catch my errors. I freaking hate programming.

-Seth

 

[steve]

Its there, but I'll post it.

5B9D: 86 FF LDAA $00FF ; Load 255d (max) to A

5B9F: 97 52 STAA L0052 ; Store 255d (FFh) to octane (mem address 52)

5BA1: 96 E1 LDAA L00E1 ; Load airflow per rev to accA

5BA3: 81 8C CMPA $0082 ; Compare to 8Ch (130d), which is approximately 0 psi

5BA5: 23 03 BLS 5BAA ; If E1 is greater than 130, do nothing; jump out

5BA7: 7E DB F3 JMP DBF3 ; Jump to end of octane code area

5BAA: 86 00 LDAA $0000 ; Load 00h (zero) to accA

5BAC: 97 8B STAA L008B ; Store 00h (zero) to knock sum address

5BAE: 7E DB F3 JMP DBF3 ; Jump to end of octane code area

changing 5C0E to 20 26, which will bypass the whole octane map calculation

I can't remember if this is Kyles version of Jeffs version the the PK code.
It is however ROM size specific mixed assembly code.
Most of the operands are correct memory locations but the "addresses" listed are 27256 specific offsets. They are really displaced by 8000h from the memory addresses.

So this code really starts at DB9D. It should read.

DB9D: 86 FF        LDAA $FF          ; Load 255 to A
DB9F: 97 52        STAA L0052        ; Store A to octane (mem address 0052h)
DBA1: 96 E1        LDAA L00E1        ; Load airflow per rev to A
DBA3: 81 82        CMPA $82          ; Compare A to 82h (130), which is approximately 0 psi
DBA5: 23 03        BLS  DBAA         ; If airflow per rev is less than or equal to 130, clear the knock count. 

DBA7: 7E DB F3     JMP  DBF3         ; Airflow per rev is greater than 130, jump to end of octane code

DBAA: 86 00        LDAA $00          ; Load 0 to A
DBAC: 97 8B        STAA L008B        ; Store A to knock sum (008bh)
DBAE: 7E DB F3     JMP  DBF3         ; Jump to end of octane code

You'll note that the Lxxxx are really labels for memory addresses in RAM. They are also all in low memory so they can be referenced by 8 bits rather than 16 bits like the jump addresses. These operands are call direct mode and save a byte of memory and machine cycles. The operands for the other loads, stores, and compares are the actual values or immediate mode. There are no additional machine cycles required to fetch the data being used.

If you look at the hex code you see that op code for the immediate mode version of the load A instruction is 86h and the direct mode form is 96h. There are a couple of other modes to allow and index version and a extended address mode where the location isn't in low memory.