Doing routine work and inspection to the car, I noticed the harness was melted against the EGR pipe. Yay. I am lucky the vehicle ran as well as it did. I immediately repaired it.

I post pictures so I (we) can use it as a reference to link against when describing the issue to New Members.

Here is a wide shot of the bay showing the loom touching the EGR pipe.



Here is a close up shot of the loom showing the damage. This damage usually causes all sorts of odd and difficult to diagnose problems.

Good catch. Nice save.

Ouch.

Just to possibly help some people diagnose some future weird problems, What kind of problems does it cause (what wires are they)?

I believe the MAP sensor wires are and if those ground out, they can cause big problems (as in car not idling, running, etc). Just buy a block-kit like I did and don't have to worry about it

well g, if you would have removed your egr....

just playin-

totaleclipse_05 said:

Just buy a block-kit like I did and don't have to worry about it

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I won't have to worry about it anymore. After I repaired the wires, I taped them up pretty good and tied the harness back against another harness. I then wrapped that portion of the pipe in heat wrap.

I have been contemplating blocking it off. I have a thick amount of muck built up behind the throttle body. I am going to clean the intake, head, et cetera, and see how quickly it mucks back up. If I deem it problematic, I will probably block it off. Otherwise, I would see no need.

absolute_DSM said:

Just to possibly help some people diagnose some future weird problems, What kind of problems does it cause (what wires are they)?

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There are sensors wires for the engine and emissions in there. Problems are almost always difficult to diagnose. Sometimes intermittent drivability, intermittent no-start, no-start, constant drivability, odd idle, can also damage sensors or possibly the ECU if wires short to each other or short to hot. Problems can be very strange. It is often recommended inspecting when all signs point to a malfunctioning sensor or system, but the sensor/system is in good repair, and ECU swaps don't work.

Sometimes the wires within the loom can become damaged due to the heat, with little or no outward signs of damage to the loom itself. In this case, the loom and tape at joints must be removed and wires inspected individually.

To repair, cut out the section of damaged loom (or completely remove) and wire(s). Cut a little more off than is apparently damaged. Slip some heat shrink tubes over the wires, then solder in a new length of wire which is of at least the same gauge as the original. It would be preferred to match the color of the new wire to the original. (I just used some red I had laying around.) Shrink the tubing with a heat gun, or butane torch, or some other form of moderate heat. Either replace the loom with a new one, or wrap the exposed area well with quality electrical tape. Find some way to prevent it from happening again, either by tying the harness back away from the EGR pipe, wrapping the pipe in a thermal wrap, or blocking off the EGR system completely.

I recommend to others, (and did myself) to pin probe large sections of all the wires in the loom to check for broken conductors. Wires work-harden over time and become brittle, (even the stranded wires that are used in automotive applications, though not as quickly) and bending and playing with these important wires during a repair could cause some to break. I checked all of mine after the repair, and they were ok.

This is a little off topic for the wiring harness repair (good catch by the way looks kinda like what i found.)

But as for blocking off the egr pipe.... From what i just learned at school bad idea, if you live in a state with high emissions, Because the egr (exhast gas recirculation) is used to regulate the amount of exhast gas allowed to retun back to the intake air flow. They do this reduce peak combustion camber temps, and to lower NOx (nitrogenoxide's). which a cat cannot reduce. It might be difficult to pass some emissions laws once removed. Besides the dirty intake why do you want to block it off?

Just my .02

Focker420 said:

It might be difficult to pass some emissions laws once removed. Besides the dirty intake why do you want to block it off?

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We have no state or local emissions laws or testing here.
There is no reason (for me) besides the dirty intake, and only if it seems to be problematic.

Good looking out locke, I and a few others had this same issue, Should have done a nice write up about it.

BigRand said:

Good looking out locke, I and a few others had this same issue

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I've noticed. It ought to be something people inspect for when they are looking to first purchase a 2gnt, right along with kicking the tires.

BigRand said:

Should have done a nice write up about it.

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I was thinking about submitting it for the tech section, but I did not feel there was much 'tech' stuff involved. So I just posted pics so others know what and where to look when we try to describe this as a possible problem they may have.

I removed my egr as soon as I got home from the emissions test site. The inspections last for two years here in WA. I also installed my MS when I got home. I have the IAT sensor threaded in the egr hole in the intake mani. From only about 100 miles or so on the new motor, teh intake mani was nice and dirty from that egr. Not to mention my thorttle plate and everything around it.

I haven't noticed any bad effects from not having it, I just be sure the car is some what warmed up before I drive off everytime, a good habbit to be in anyway. I figure I ahve to unhook the ms when I do emission anyhow cause my cel says I have no injectors! Who needs those anyways!

I wonder what the emissions person would say to me if they pulled that up? They just plug in the obdII here.

Good find, Locke. I'll include this in the 420A FAQ once we finally get it up and running.

This problem is so common it should've been recalled by Mitsubishi. My thread below says it all: http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=253288. Car is sold though.

If you remove your egr does the cel stay on all the time and if so is there a way to stop it? Is it really worth removing your egr and if so where can i get a kit to block it off. I have heard that it might give you a little more hp but nothing big. Myth or truth?

Blackclipse620 said:

If you remove your egr does the cel stay on all the time and if so is there a way to stop it?

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Yes the cell will stay on, but there is a way to stop it. Just search 2gnt.com they have a mod to not only trick the ecu into thinking the egr valve is still there, but theres also a mod to make the car still think its re-circulating the gasses.

Blackclipse620 said:

Is it really worth removing your egr

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If you dont have to pass an emissions test then taking it off can only benefit you. You will have a much cleaner intake and not to mention it will lower engine bay temps slightly. It also makes the engine bay look less cluttered.

Blackclipse620 said:

and if so where can i get a kit to block it off.

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I have the mopar performance version, its a high quality piece, but its overpriced because it comes with extra parts, I guess its for multiple applications or something. Concept illusions sells them as well.

Blackclipse620 said:

I have heard that it might give you a little more hp but nothing big. Myth or truth?

Click to expand...

Lets go ahead and say myth, it has lots of benefits, but performance is not one of them. There is one minor downside to it. I always like to check my gas mileage and ever since I blocked off my egr I get about 1-2 mpg less.

So I removed my EGR this morn and yeah....WTF I took one look down that egr pipe and saw a slow painful death for my intake sitting in there. There was an ass load of carbon in that piece. But I got it off and I also took your advice and search 2gnt.com. Found that there is a resistor you can tap into that plug that goes to the back of your egr. Now i have no cel and i feel better knowing im not feeding my intake all that carbon anymore. It only cost me 26 bucks to. I got that concept illusions kit and ordered the resistor from a comp company.

4UH8ERS said:

If you dont have to pass an emissions test then taking it off can only benefit you. You will have a much cleaner intake and not to mention it will lower engine bay temps slightly. It also makes the engine bay look less cluttered.

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i don't know about the lowering temps part by removing the EGR but the cleaner intake is definitly a bonus, The egr lowers combustion chamber temps by using exhaust gases to slightly alter your a/f and therfor run lower combustion temps.

time for EGR block off..........and kill the rest of the polar bears

i noticed the same problem with my engine also

You can get the kit from concept illusions for $20. website is www.cimotorsports.net and the resistor is at www.digikey.com there part number is 1.2KW-10-ND and its .60 cents. Makes for a great fix and i dont think the polar bears will really give a rats ass. Good luck with it!

Focker420 said:

i don't know about the lowering temps part by removing the EGR but the cleaner intake is definitly a bonus, The egr lowers combustion chamber temps by using exhaust gases to slightly alter your a/f and therfor run lower combustion temps.

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It was merely an assumption from the obvious fact that there will no longer be a burning hot recirculation tube in the engine bay. Therefore engine bay temps in that area will be reduced just slightly.

Assumptions aren't good around here


Let's stick to the facts, so when new people actually follow the rules and search, they might find something useful

P.S. egr block-off is a plus hehe

there is no hessitation or misfire in idle when the EGR is clogged or blocked is there. my car is acting up and i noticed my EGR pipe was completly clogged with carbon