Valvespring compressor

5150DSM · Feb 25, 2005

All right, here's the deal. I determined that my valve stem seals were shot and that was the reason for my smoking at idle and take-off so I have decided to change them. In searching around and reading the VFAQ and such it seems that this is a long and tedious job, especially if you have to remove the head. The Miller Tool compressor is too expensive at this point and I realistically only have about 6 hours to do the whole job so using the VFAQ method with the home-made compressor is not the best option either. Not having done this on a 4G motor before I don't know the limitations of the common storebought spring compressors and why exactly we can't use them. I saw this compressor at Checkers http://www.partsamerica.com/PartDet...EARCHRESULTS&MfrCode=PBI&MfrPartNumber=648432 and it seemed like a decent possibility to use and keep the head on, of course I have no idea if this work or not but it's only $30.00 so...
Does anyone have personal experience with this particular spring compressor or can an explanation be given as to why I wouldn't be able to use this one. Thanks in advance for any help you guys can offer.
Aloha

RoasT BeeF · Feb 25, 2005

First of all how did you determine it is the valve seals? Usually valve seals will mean smoking at startup.

I cant get to the picture of the compressor from that link but if its the same one that autozone and other common parts stores sell I can tell you that it will not work. And this isnt something you really dont want to speed through, especially if you have no experience. I would suggest either get the right tool and take the time to do it right or pull the head and just let a machine shop do it.

5150DSM · Feb 25, 2005

RoasT BeeF said:
First of all how did you determine it is the valve seals? Usually valve seals will mean smoking at startup.

I cant get to the picture of the compressor from that link but if its the same one that autozone and other common parts stores sell I can tell you that it will not work. And this isnt something you really want to speed through, especially if you have no experience. I would suggest either get the right tool and take the time to do it right or pull the head and just let a machine shop do it.

I determined it was the valve stem seals when I got good compression on the test and by the symptoms... smoking lightly at idle and smoking more heavily when leaving from an idle, the longer I sit the more I smoke.

IDK why the link doesn't work for you I can see it so...
Anyway, this isn't the common "rod-type" puller you see at every parts store, it actually looks more like a mini gear puller. It has two jaws that clamp onto the valvespring and a screw down piston that you can attach a socket to. Can you please elaborate as to why something like this wouldn't work. Time is not really negotiable, right now I work 7 days a week and drive my car for work so... Thanks for any help you can offer.

5150DSM · Feb 26, 2005

Here's a picture if the link doesn't work, courtesy of partsamerica.com

Maglin · Feb 26, 2005

That valve spring compressor will not work on a 4G63/64. It pretty much requires that you take the head off to do. I don't know of any tool that you can do it with the head on. It's a real PITA.

Also your symptoms don't point to valve stem seals. Points more to a bad turbo oil seal. I just droped a new 13B J-spec into my buddies 3rd gen RX-7 and we found out that he has a totally bad oil seal on one of his turbo's. Little smoke at idle and get progressively worse the longer it sits and the more oil pressure their is. And we went through 5 quarts of oil in under a hour.

What a PITA it is to take those turbo's out.

Anyways. Pull off your O2 housing and take a look at your turbine wheel. If it is wet looking that is definitly your case. Also if you have any creamy oil froth or thick film towards the rear of your exhaust that also points to a bad turbo oil seal. That is my .02

AL92 · Feb 26, 2005

I am not 100% sure on this blown turbo seal theory stuff but had a problem twice on my car where it all of a sudden starting blowing lots of oil out the exhaust and also leaking out the engine gaskets more than usual.I was sure my new turbo or my engine was shot and started to price out rebuild parts or was ready to send my new turbo for repair.
The problem went completely away when I found that I had blockages in my pcv system.I use an rre catch can and run no pcv valve just a line from pcv straight fitting thru catch can which has a breather on it and then it goes back to the valve cover.I had total blockages in the lines and this caused the oil to blow out pipes and was in intake tube ,o2 housing etc.
I removed the restriction the crankcase stopped overpressurizing and no more oil out out the pipes and most of the leaking has stopped too.
So don't assume its the turbo automatically.Maybe on a really really high mileage turbo the seals will go but pretty sure when I wrote agp asking about turbo seals they told me something about that can't happen maybe just on a garrett not mits not sure but anyway not sure if this helps you but may help other guys.
Also snap on makes a tool think for 120 bucks that will let you change out valve springs with the head on the car.I might be getting one in near future.

terefic181 · Feb 26, 2005

can an explanation be given as to why I wouldn't be able to use this one

My recollection of the reasons you can't use standard compressors on the 4G63.

The top type (non head removal) compressors don't have enough room peripheraly to let them work. In other words there's not enough room around the spring.

The standard (head off) type C compressors usually don't have enough unrestricted throw distance. (the C arm is to short on the valve spring side to clear the side wall of the head.

DsMWookie · Feb 26, 2005

Just use this tool

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4515499165&category=63700

you can do it on the head.....cost me like 98$shipped and I did mine on the car in a couple hrs....not to mention I did all the front seals on the engine new timing belt and water pump. That tool works awesome its cheap and I didn't have to pull the head.

NDgsx · Feb 26, 2005

Miller makes one that works great.

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Maglin · Feb 26, 2005

That is one kick ass Valve spring compressor. About the positive crankcase pressure you are correct. You have to ensure you don't have excessive crank case pressure. I forgot to mention to check that. Ensure your PCV valve isn't blocked. It's easy to just clean them out with break cleaner.

DsMWookie · Feb 26, 2005

Miller's is hella nice...but mine was alot cheaper

5150DSM · Feb 26, 2005

Thanks for the replies...
My PCV valvle is new and I don't have any oil in my intake or I/C piping, my catchcan also isn't showing any abnormal amounts of blow-by. Compression was 145-150-150-150 and the turbo was replaced with a new factory unit about 50-55,000mi ago. I still think it's the stem seals but I am certainly open to other opinions.
Thanks also for the links/opinions on the valvespring compressor, I begin to see why the compressor I asked about would be hard, if not impossible to use. Maybe the e-bay too is a better option for those who don't want to pay $130+ shipping for the Miller tool.

DsMWookie · Feb 26, 2005

If the miller tool is only 130 that isnt that bad...like I said i got mine for 98$ shipped and it worked but the miller tool looks nicer. But mine worked.

WhiteCloud · Feb 26, 2005

From the sound of the symptoms, that is valve stem seals. Exactly what happened to my car--a little smoke on startup, and a puff of smoke taking off from a stop. Otherwise, everything was normal. Nonetheless, the pistons were caked like you wouldn't believe after driving the car like this for a couple months.

We pulled the head to do mine...but the Miller's tool is well worth the money, IMO. You will always be able to find someone to buy it from you, or even rent it to fellow local DSMers for $10 when they do head work or something.

myblack98gst · Feb 27, 2005

the miller is similiar to the tool mitsubishi uses in their shop.. I used the dealer tool on mine and it worked great.. luckily I have not had to remove the springs again.

half-cocked · Feb 27, 2005

The SPX Miller tool is the tool they use at mitsu. Miller is a supplier of specialty tools to auto manufacturers. Like that flat castlated nut that goes on the front case just behind the oil pump sprocket. They make the socket that fits that, for $15.

pneumo · Feb 27, 2005

There is a way to know for sure if your exhaust valve stem seals are leaking. Start by pulling off the exhaust manifold, then have a look at the top of the exhaust port. You should use a small mirror to get a good look since the radiator will block the view. If you see dark, wet streaks coming from the valve guide, then your seals are shot.

You should also pull the plugs and have a look at the piston tops. Use a strong flashlight to peek inside.
It's possible for oil to enter the cylinder through the intake valve stem seals or the piston rings. Either source will look similar.

There's no guarantee that a 50k mile old turbo will still be good either.

Gooberlog · Feb 28, 2005

DsMWookie said:
Just use this tool

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4515499165&category=63700

you can do it on the head.....cost me like 98$shipped and I did mine on the car in a couple hrs....not to mention I did all the front seals on the engine new timing belt and water pump. That tool works awesome its cheap and I didn't have to pull the head.

I used this same tool, bought from toolwarehouse.net i've done 3 valve seal jobs on 4g63's with it. Wouldn't bolt up to a 3.0 toyota camry i had to do though.

myblack98gst · Feb 28, 2005

half-cocked said:
The SPX Miller tool is the tool they use at mitsu. Miller is a supplier of specialty tools to auto manufacturers. Like that flat castlated nut that goes on the front case just behind the oil pump sprocket. They make the socket that fits that, for $15.

the one I used was different from that.. . it had 2 plates bolted down to each side of the head where the cam caps bolt down. then 2 rods slid through holes in the plates. and the compressor went between the rods.. eitherway bolt look like they would work equally well.

One of my friends told me the easiest way to get the retainers to break free is to use a socket on aextension that is the same diameter as the cap.. and hit it with a hammer.. that will knock the reatiners out.

slvrstingray · Feb 28, 2005

Hey guys! Thought i might chime in on this one. I port cylinderheads and do marketing for a company called Power Performance. The owner of the machine shop has designed this tool for removing and loading keepers on single groove valve locks. (all japanese import cars) It works faster than anything that i've ever seen! It works great on the car without removing the cylinder head! If you want to replace your vavle seals, or valve springs without removing the cylinder head, this is the tool for you! I own one... and i love it! Check it out... If anyone's interested in one, PM me. I might be able to work out some kind of discount or group buy with my boss.

KE Tool Website

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half-cocked · Feb 28, 2005

Ouch, convienent yes, but you sure pay for it. You should see if you cant arrainge a group buy.

turbo90gsx · Mar 10, 2005

Does anyone have a link to where one might be able to purches a Miller spring compressor?

4gsx63 · Mar 10, 2005

Does this sound like valve stem seals issue to you guys?

"Sometimes it's fairly thick, sometimes barely at all... usually it's after the car has sat overnight, which makes me believe it's valve seals. After a little bit of boosting and the car warming up, it usually goes away."

Thanks!

Defiant · Mar 11, 2005

slvrstingray said:
Hey guys! Thought i might chime in on this one. I port cylinderheads and do marketing for a company called Power Performance. The owner of the machine shop has designed this tool for removing and loading keepers on single groove valve locks. (all japanese import cars) It works faster than anything that i've ever seen! It works great on the car without removing the cylinder head! If you want to replace your vavle seals, or valve springs without removing the cylinder head, this is the tool for you! I own one... and i love it! Check it out... If anyone's interested in one, PM me. I might be able to work out some kind of discount or group buy with my boss.

KE Tool Website

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Careful, you're edging the rules:
No spam, group buy posts, vendor advertising, website advertising, or self promotion of any kind in the forums.

Since the damned thing is $300, I'm not deleting your post. Group buys, however, are prohibited here. You may want to look into becoming a vendor here, or selling this product through other of our vendors.

Bestwestranger · Mar 12, 2005

If you look in the classified section there is an inexpensive tool there for sale. Its not pretty, but it does the job great.

Please don't delete this post for being self serving or self promoting! After you figure in all the cost and time, I make very little $ from building and selling these. I do it as a service to the dsm community, not to get rich :thumb:

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