Thoughts On UR Crank Pulley???

Flash · Jul 12, 2004

Ok, so when I had my T-Belt changed the guy there said it looked like my crank pulley was worn out and needed to be replaced. But he was honest and said I would survive if I didn't replace right away.
So now I'm in the market for a new crank pulley and found this Unorthodox Racing Tuner series crank pulley. It's lighter weight and I can get it for less then a OEM one.
So what are the positive and negatives about getting this crank pulley? Will I have more engine vibration? Will it screw up my engine? How much hp will it give me?
Thanks!
http://unorthodoxracing.com/cgi-bin/merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=URI&Product_Code=220910602

Nerfherder · Jul 12, 2004

Because it is just a pulley, and not a harmonic balance, I would have to say, "skip it." If it's your daily driver, you need to bite the bullet and buy the OEM harmonic balancer. Without a harmonic balancer, you will get premature bearing wear on your main journals.

Cesar · Jul 14, 2004

I don't think the oem one is a harmonic balancer... (It doesn't even need a puller to be removed) It's just a crank pulley...I could be wrong though. I'm in the process of contacting them, (unorthodox racing), as we speak regarding this specific point, I'll be sure to post the reply from the horses mouth.

ItsStockOfficer · Jul 14, 2004

Cesar said:
I don't think the oem one is a harmonic balancer... (It doesn't even need a puller to be removed) It's just a crank pulley...I could be wrong though. I'm in the process of contacting them, (unorthodox racing), as we speak regarding this specific point, I'll be sure to post the reply from the horses mouth.

Your wrong, its a harmonically dampened pulley. The inside is joined to the outside with an essential 1/4 inch rubber layer.

boostedinaz · Jul 14, 2004

If its just a pulley and not harmonic then I would also say pass. Check out some vendors here on the site especiaslly www.mitsubishigraveyard.com they can probable get a stock replacment for a decent price.

Michael
:talon:

Cesar · Jul 14, 2004

this is a copy of the e-mail to and from Unorthodox racing...

The engine is balanced internally. The pulley and flywheel are balanced separately. Our pulley has better balance characteristics than the factory unit. We have not had any problems with these pulleys. The original weighs 4 lbs. 10.4 oz. ours is 1 lb. 1.8 oz.

Thanks for your interest,

Joe ///M

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Cesar Ito [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 2004 3:46 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Tunes S Series

220910602

http://unorthodoxracing.com/cgi-bin...en=PROD&Store_Code=URI&Product_Code=220910602

I have an eagle talon 90 tsi aws turbo...The tuner S series pulley replaces the factory pulley. Does the engine become less balanced? Do I have to worry about premature bearing failure?? How much does it weigh? How well balanced is it? Are there any negative side effects??

Thanks

Cesar

P.s. do you have it in stock??

apparently it's not a harmonic balancer, from the horses mouth of couse... :thumb:

Daedalus · Jul 14, 2004

I have one on my car and have had no problems. My freind has one on his GS-T (Full set) and hasnt had any problems for over 40,000 miles. People are wary b/c of the lack of a harmonic dampner. I understand this and agree that on some cars with a long block it could cause problems (I.E. Straight six supra). But I also have noticed that the people who say not to get them have no experience with the actual product. I have never heard of or seen a case of a UDP causing a bearing blow out on a 4G63.

It is just my opinion, but I do speak from first hand experience and not what I suppose COULD happen.

ItsStockOfficer · Jul 14, 2004

It's a harmonic dampner. Not a harmonic "balancer". Two entirely different concepts. If this was just about balance it would work lovely.

And getting positive information about a product from the manufacturer of the product is pretty easy to do. Call and ask Bushcur Racing about it for intelligent criticism.

The more you do to your engine, the worse it gets. Cams? No balance shafts? Every time your idle changes it cause acceleration in a circular different direction(slowing down is the same as accelerating backwards). Without a harmonic dampner, these accelerations do very bad things, even so far as to hurt your transmission. The stocker your car, the better off you are.

Daedalus, it's easy to say that because with engines you can always blame alot of factors....Buschur have about a dozen motors equiped with them lose main bearings and refused to sell them ever since.

You ussually make it when you walk through a mine field.

Rugger21 · Jul 15, 2004

How tough is it to install the crank pulley? Mine went the other day I guess the rubber part gave way and its now in 2 pieces! How hard is this to do? Do I need to pull the motor? I sure hope not. I can reach the majority of the pully from up under the car through the drivers wheel well. Any info would be great! I am in Pasadena MD if anyone would even like to help me out!

boostedinaz · Jul 15, 2004

Rugger21 said:
How tough is it to install the crank pulley? Mine went the other day I guess the rubber part gave way and its now in 2 pieces! How hard is this to do? Do I need to pull the motor? I sure hope not. I can reach the majority of the pully from up under the car through the drivers wheel well. Any info would be great! I am in Pasadena MD if anyone would even like to help me out!

Its not to bad. You have to take off the accesory pullies fromthe crank pulley. You will also have to take out four bolts and that should get the actual pulley off. Then you should just swap them out.

Michael
:talon:

david buschur · Jul 30, 2004

Hey guys,

I was sent a link to this and asked to chime in on it.

The factory car has a torsional harmonic damper on it. The unorthodox solid aluminum pulley does not have this. The damper is needed, regardless of what you may think or have been told.

We were loosing bearings years ago in the 4g63 and have recently (last few years) seen guys making bigger hp starting to crack crankshafts. They were using the solid pulleys. They have since switched to our underdrive pulley (have to as it is SFI approved and the stock is not, although stock will work too) and have not broken any more cranks.

I wouldn't run the crank pulley.

Thanks,

David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com

Daedalus · Jul 31, 2004

I'm pretty sure that most of us would gladly run something with a dampner that is lighter than stock if it didnt cost 400.00! The only lightweight pulley with a dampner cost something around 380 dollars or so. No its not worth it for a turbo motor, but the N/T guys get a 8-10% gain over stock hp ratings so it is something the seriously consider. Either way, thanks for chiming in and setting the record straight. I guess my friend and I have just been lucky.

The ironic part is my front bearing on my stock car blew out and the different engine with the solid pulley hasnt (knock on wood). :cry:

draxus83 · Jul 31, 2004

well personaly i run Unorthodox's under drive pully and i have had no probloms i think it was well worth the time and $$$

david buschur · Jul 31, 2004

The last two posts are why I don't like giving my opinion

On a low HP engine not spinning a bunch of RPM that hunk of solid aluminum might work out just fine. The cars I am referring to, that I have seen and worked on, were higher HP cars running higher RPM.

The only damper out there is one that I had a huge part in designing. I had a agreement with the company that builds them that we would be the only guys that could sell the part. The original owner sold out to his partner who has no integrity and now sells them to everyone.

The reason it is expensive is, machine work, the internal workings and the limited number of them that are sold.

Do you doubters actually think I couldn't make a bunch of money selling these underdrive kits to everyone? Do you know why I don't sell them? It's because the profit isn't worth nearly to me what it's worth to sell things that not only make power but also will not hurt you in the long run.

Back to the drawing board.

David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com

midnght · Jul 31, 2004

david buschur said:
The last two posts are why I don't like giving my opinion

On a low HP engine not spinning a bunch of RPM that hunk of solid aluminum might work out just fine. The cars I am referring to, that I have seen and worked on, were higher HP cars running higher RPM.

The only damper out there is one that I had a huge part in designing. I had a agreement with the company that builds them that we would be the only guys that could sell the part. The original owner sold out to his partner who has no integrity and now sells them to everyone.

The reason it is expensive is, machine work, the internal workings and the limited number of them that are sold.

Do you doubters actually think I couldn't make a bunch of money selling these underdrive kits to everyone? Do you know why I don't sell them? It's because the profit isn't worth nearly to me what it's worth to sell things that not only make power but also will not hurt you in the long run.
Back to the drawing board.

David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com

This guy knows what he is talking about. If you are a newcomer here at the website, I would listen up. Dave has been turning DSM's to monsters for awhile. This is not only his business, but his joy. I have driven 2 different Buschur equiped cars and was very impressed with the power and delivery.

If you would please re-read the red section in his post once more........This is the reason Dave is one of the premier Shops around for us. Do as you please, just don't bi*** to us when you have had warnings from most all of us that have had the time and effort thrown into our work and have seen the results of people not listening to those who warn.

saw wave analog · Jul 31, 2004

word to the above.

just because it hasnt happened to you doesnt mean it cant or wont. listen to those who speak from experience, its one of the best ways to further this art.

boostedinaz · Jul 31, 2004

Every milestone for the DSM was set by Dave so I would listen when he talks. He has forgotten more about DSM's than we will ever know. You name a time and he was probably the first to be there in our cars.

You make the call.
Its your money and your car, but its also your fu(k up if it goes wrong.

Michael
:talon:

Daedalus · Jul 31, 2004

hell i know who dave is and I respect him more than any DSM tuner out there. The stuff they are doing with the 8 is just amazing.

When I swap the engine next month we are taking it off my car permanetly. Its not worth the risk to me anymore. I have way way way to much invested!

GSGoinFast · Aug 1, 2004

Daedalus said:
hell i know who dave is and I respect him more than any DSM tuner out there. The stuff they are doing with the 8 is just amazing.

When I swap the engine next month we are taking it off my car permanetly. Its not worth the risk to me anymore. I have way way way to much invested!

didnt you just say you loved it??? :confused:

draxus83 · Aug 2, 2004

no disrespect to dave but it seem's this trend turned into a worship service quick

ItsStockOfficer · Aug 2, 2004

david buschur said:
The last two posts are why I don't like giving my opinion

On a low HP engine not spinning a bunch of RPM that hunk of solid aluminum might work out just fine. The cars I am referring to, that I have seen and worked on, were higher HP cars running higher RPM.

The only damper out there is one that I had a huge part in designing. I had a agreement with the company that builds them that we would be the only guys that could sell the part. The original owner sold out to his partner who has no integrity and now sells them to everyone.

The reason it is expensive is, machine work, the internal workings and the limited number of them that are sold.

Do you doubters actually think I couldn't make a bunch of money selling these underdrive kits to everyone? Do you know why I don't sell them? It's because the profit isn't worth nearly to me what it's worth to sell things that not only make power but also will not hurt you in the long run.

Back to the drawing board.

David Buschur
www.buschurracing.com

Not just power and RPM, but the direction changes of the crank matter. As an example: If you have cam's, whenever it lopes it tries to slow down but the pulleys have inertia and try to keep it spinning. With a harmonic dampner their low inertia is meaningless. Without one, your yanking on the crank in the opposite direction it want's to travel twice a second. Small forces add up over long periods of time.

midnght · Aug 2, 2004

draxus83 said:
no disrespect to dave but it seem's this trend turned into a worship service quick

No, it is just that when an experienced person comes into a thread that was pointed out to him, and people just toss his knowledge to the side, that someone has to man-up and state the obvious.

draxus83 · Aug 2, 2004

i know i was just poking LOL

midnght · Aug 2, 2004

I know you were.

draxus83 · Aug 2, 2004

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Thoughts On UR Crank Pulley???

Flash

Nerfherder

Cesar

ItsStockOfficer

boostedinaz

Cesar

Daedalus

ItsStockOfficer

Rugger21

boostedinaz

david buschur

Daedalus

draxus83

david buschur

midnght

saw wave analog

boostedinaz

Daedalus

GSGoinFast

DSM N/T Wiseman

draxus83

ItsStockOfficer

midnght

draxus83

midnght

draxus83

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