timing belt change?

[91eagle_tsi_awd]

my 91 gsx is off timing by 2 teeth,so im planning on doing the timing belt change sometime this week.well a friend of mine who has alot of knowledge on dsms told me just to but the timing belt ,balance shaft belt and the tenshioner from the dealer and bring it to him,he sed i dont have to change the pulleys or anything,so im thinkin of doing as he told me.just need someone opinions about this?

 

[GTM]

Originally posted by 91eagle_tsi_awd
my 91 gsx is off timing by 2 teeth,so im planning on doing the timing belt change sometime this week.well a friend of mine who has alot of knowledge on dsms told me just to but the timing belt ,balance shaft belt and the tenshioner from the dealer and bring it to him,he sed i dont have to change the pulleys or anything,so im thinkin of doing as he told me.just need someone opinions about this?

Yup, willie nelly change the belt. WHY is it off 2 teeth???? Which cam was off 2 theeeeth. Yes, snapping on there a belt may solve the problem... but why? As a professional lots of things occur naturally and this aint one of them... 9,000 rpm and I don't know why it happened... seemed reasonable at the time.

Cheers,
GTM

 

[91eagle_tsi_awd]

i had the car for like 2 months,one day i washed the motor and then i took it for a spin,i felt it so slow n sluggish,but never knew wat it was till now,i remember checking the timing marks that day before i washed the motor and they were fine.now its off 2 teeth.car still runs smooth and everything but it has no power what so ever and turbo is really spooling late .so im really anxious to see the difference in the performance of the car after i do the belt change

 

[GTM]

Originally posted by 91eagle_tsi_awd
i had the car for like 2 months,one day i washed the motor and then i took it for a spin,i felt it so slow n sluggish,but never knew wat it was till now,i remember checking the timing marks that day before i washed the motor and they were fine.now its off 2 teeth.car still runs smooth and everything but it has no power what so ever and turbo is really spooling late .so im really anxious to see the difference in the performance of the car after i do the belt change

I'm 62, any chance you could loose the dialect soez I can help you? Cryptc msgs ain no prob, jes gotaaben samlanqage. nes pa? Ianit gonna no hou espalin... Iffn U r reel pmme

 

[91eagle_tsi_awd]

sorry,ok i washed my engine bay one time and i remember seeing the timing marks aligned fine.i drove the car around the block and it felt slow and sluggish so i started to think there was something wrong the car.i then found out the timing was off 2 teeth.im not sure how it happend.but im planning on changing the belts and tenshioners this week.my mechanic told me not to buy any aftermarket parts for the timing belt change because it will skip again.i just wanted to know if its safe just to change the belts and the hydraulic tensioner without replacing the pulleys with it?

 

[jpolizo]

I'm not sure what you mean by "safe"? You would be assuming the pulleys are OK and they probably are. There are two points in replacing them:

1) A timing belt problem can chew up an engine pretty bad

2) Changing the belts is a good bit of labor; changing the pulleys is very little additional work

Personally, I wouldn't do just the belt and tensioner. Can you most likely get away with it? Probably.

 

[steve]

Money is always tight, so you have to consider the costs/risks of cutting corners.
If you do the job right it should last 60k.
That means timing belt, auto tensioner, pulleys, balance shaft belt and anything else that's worn out or reaching the end of it's service life, like the water pump, cam and various other front end seals, oil pump, and the actual tensioner arm does wear out. Usually it just wears a dimple in the part that contacts the auto tensioner and need to be filled in by welding and regrinding flush but the pivots have been known to wear out by 120k.
If you cut a few corners on parts you might get lucky and not have any problems over the next 60k but it's more likely one of the items you didn't replace will trash your timing belt and at best cause you to do it again. At worst your looking at a new engine.

To me it wasn't worth saving maybe $50 on three new pulleys that were in good shape right now but had 60k on them, I really didn't think they still be good with 120k on them.

Steve

 

[GTM]

Originally posted by 91eagle_tsi_awd
sorry,ok i washed my engine bay one time and i remember seeing the timing marks aligned fine.i drove the car around the block and it felt slow and sluggish so i started to think there was something wrong the car.i then found out the timing was off 2 teeth.im not sure how it happend.but im planning on changing the belts and tenshioners this week.my mechanic told me not to buy any aftermarket parts for the timing belt change because it will skip again.i just wanted to know if its safe just to change the belts and the hydraulic tensioner without replacing the pulleys with it?

Thanks, helps when trying to figure out these things. You have a couple of good replies which you should consider. They and I don't meant to terrorize you but playing with that timing belt has to be thought of as one of the most serious things you will ever do.

You still havn't said which cam jumped 2 teeth and in which direction. I stress this onliy from a validation that you know what you are seeing is correct.

Basic philosophy is the blasted thing ran in here so it's gonna run out. I've no solid explanation why washing the engine off may have caused the problem other than with a stretched belt and the soap it was able to jump time. This of course would justify a major power loss as you have described.

At the very minimum a new belt will be required, your "mechanic" is giving you advice based on his experience. If something goes south you will stand a better chance of getting satisfaction with a factory part. However, all these other companies couldn't stay in business if they made bad parts so that will be a decision you have to make.

When you get into the viscera of this operation do one thing, argue with yourself time and again that you have done everything correctly. Being over confident will bend every valve in that engine if you make a mistake. When you think you have it right, then explain it to someone WHY it is right. Pull the engine through by hand a couple of revolutions and show them it has to work.

If you decide to cut corners just know that the other parts mentioned can go south next week, next month, or next year. It can be a real bummer if you have to replace that water pump because the new belt puts additional loads and causes it to leak. But if your pocketbook only has x dollars and you got to be at work Monday morning you do what you have to.

When you get done I've got this GM Quad4 with 3 bent valves sitting in my driveway. It will make you appreciate what a piece of cake that timing belt job really is.

Be patient with yourself, you didn't learn to walk in a day, read the book, rehearse in your mind each step so you can do it in your sleep. And every time you skin your knuckles just keep telling yourself how much fun you are having.

Keep us posted.
GTM

 

[NOSLO2PT0]

Originally posted by GTM
And every time you skin your knuckles just keep telling yourself how much fun you are having.

Keep us posted.
GTM

Invest $20 on some Mechanix gloves from the auto parts store. No more busted knuckles!!

 

[GTM]

Originally posted by NOSLO2PT0
Invest $20 on some Mechanix gloves from the auto parts store. No more busted knuckles!!

There may be some things you can do with gloves on, they never worked for me. Of course I also never lived in Chicago in the middle of winter either. Still I've had to pick up some pretty cold tools that just sucked the heat right out of your body, your hands turn into paws for they have lost all desterity. Once in a great while I'll use them when doing a brake job just to keep the dust off my hands.

Besides that would spoil half the fun, just think your vocabulary would be lost for you would have nothing to swear at except the blasted gloves.

Cheers,
GTM

 

[91eagle_tsi_awd]

thanks for the good advise gtm ,this is my third dsm ,the last one the timing belt snapped on me and you know how that goes,i bent 5 valves,lucky i had a spare head.but im just going to go ahead and change the belts and the tensioner.im planning to rebuild and upgrade this july coming up,this car hasnt given me any problems or anything besides its lack of power because of the timing being off,thanks alot guys

 

[babell2]

The only piece of advice I have is "Concider the retention pin in the tensioner piston a handgrenade pin, If after setting the tension on the belt you can't remove the pin and put it back again It will blow up." Thats how tight