Mystery clutch issue..stuck between a rock and a hard place

[Albrecht09]

Whats up..got quite a friggin' headache here, hoping someone can shed some light to my current debuckle..

Set up:

98 Gs-t, only mods are: Greddy FMIC, Greddy Type S BOV, Injen intake, TurboXS MBC, Greddy boost gauge, HKS turboback exhaust, KYB AGX struts/Tein S-tech springs

History:

I got the car like 2-3 weeks ago for a steal, the kid I got it off had no clue what was wrong with it. He was driving it and the clutch went to the floor and stayed there on him. He put a new slave and master on it, then decided to sell it because he couldnt get the tranny out (fork came off pivot ball somehow) due to severely stuck CV shafts in the bearing hubs. He said he just had a new clutch put on less than 5k ago.

After buying it:

Got new spindles, CV shafts, tie rods, control arms, pretty much most of the front end shit in the wheel wells, and didnt believe that it had a new clutch like he said, so bought a new one (Perfection OEM from Advanced Auto) anyways.

Got the trans out, turns out the clutch really was like brand new, but since I already had the new one, changed it anyways and kept his as a spare. Car ran great for ~500 miles. I didn't properly break the clutch in, per say, but I was by no means hard on it. The clutch wasnt engaging until the last likeee inch or so of the pedal, it needed adjusted, but since it wasnt slipping or nothing I didnt think to adjust it. Started slipping at moderate/high boost levels at first, then got worse and worse to the point it was barely driveable. After sitting for a while and the motor completely cooled off, it would run fine with no slipping at all for quite a while, like 50 miles, then started slipping at moderate boost, getting worse and worse again, and at one point going up a big hill it slipped real bad and I actually smoked the clutch. I then read up on how to adjust it properly, and it would still even after smoking it drive fine, only slipping at high boost, but gradually got worse again, so I said #### it and today dropped the trans again and put another new clutch in, this time making sure to properly adjust/bleed it before driving.

The first time I put the first new clutch in, I had the flywheel resurfaced. It looked like it had been resurfaced before, and I asked the guy at the machine shop he said he barely had to take anything off at all. Today when I put the second new clutch in, the flywheel looked like it had a little bit of minor heat/stress lines, but nothing that you could even feel, I assumed it was alright.

So after getting it all back together, adjusting, bleeding, making sure its all right, took it for a drive. Seemed like it fixed the issue. Its grabbing right where its supposed to in the pedal travel, and didnt slip at all for quite a while. Satisfied, I was on my way home after dropping my friend off, and out of nowhere I noticed OCCASIONALLY it would slip a little bit here and there still! Mind you this whole drive I barely hit boost if at all. Im getting pretty ticked off now if I gotta drop the trans again. Im thinking it could possibly be the flywheel..anyone have any insight? Sorry if I was unclear with anything, I tried to give as much detail as possible to get this shit figured out.

Thanks in advance

 

[95eclipseguy]

When you say you replaced the clutch, did that include the pressure plate? Just asking because this is where I would be looking. Also, are you sure that there is no pressure on the tob when the clutch is fully engaged?

 

[Albrecht09]

There is none. And yes when I say replaced clutch, I meant full clutch kit. (Clutch disc, Pressure plate, TOB)

When the first clutch smoked out comin up that hill, I was at first like...wtf 500 miles and I burnt through a clutch? Thats when I started realizing it was grabbing so late that it might not of been fully engaging, and wasnt too pissed after that because I thought I burnt it out so fast because my lack of attention to detail during the first install. (Refering to not adjusting it or anything the first time). Then with this new one, while not even hitting boost with it, starts slipping occasionally and at random rpms (sometimes at like 1500-2000 RPM in 5th gear while going like 45mph, Id hit the gas and it would slip, then sometimes it would be fine in that scenario and would slip at like 3k in third while accelerating). It only did it like 3-4 times, but I was full of emotions when I got back to my house tonight...strange mix between anger, frustration, confusion, and..more anger .

 

[95eclipseguy]

Well I can certainly understand the emotions. It almost seems as nothing is wrong yet, something must be. I know how this sounds and I'm not being a @#+_@, just trying to help. Is your trans tight on the block. could it be the pressure plates are not correct for the application. sometimes parts stores get it wrong. Did the input shaft seem tight or sloppy. I'm sure you have thought about all this. Just trying to keep you thinking. Seems crazy but with your issue, kinda have to look for any angle. Maybe the fork is sideloading the pressure plate.

Man, just read what I wrote, I'm not being much help so I'll just shut uip now.

 

[Albrecht09]

Ill take any advice at this point, even if you came out calling me a dumbass ..people overlook the obvious/basics all the time. Me especially hah. But, the input shaft was solid, zero play, and Ive heard of people using wrong PP's before..but twice? different brands too. (both OEM clutches though). Fork looked fine, I had to shim the pivot ball to get the proper travel out of the fork without it hitting the bell housing...so that's all been taken care of..and I use a torque wrench and the torque spec in the Hayne's for any bolt unless its just one that holds a bracket or wires down somewhere or something..keep the suggestions coming though

 

[awdtalon4451]

When you say you adjusted it what were you referring to? Pedal, slave, master? Clutch pedal assembly would be my first look. Did you watch the jacks transmission clutch video? If not here it is. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYJxQyjIhUw

 

[Albrecht09]

Ya, I watched it a few times already before. 90% of the adjustment I did was at the pedal, the master/slave seemed just about right once the pedal was set right

 

[awdtalon4451]

Huh, now you've got me curious as to what it may be.

 

[awdtalon4451]

When you installed the clutch kit what TOB did you use? Hopefully not the one with the kit. If you used the TOB that came with the clutch it may be your culprit. Never ever use anything other than Mitsu oem TOB. It only leads to heartache and a lighter bill fold. Trust me I know

 

[mcraetim23]

Hey mine has the same problem when you drive it a couple days its fine then it will start slipping a little at first then more and more I found that my slave cylinder was gettin stuck open if I bleed it it fixes it temporarily I believe either the slave is bad or maybe a collapsed line

 

[Albrecht09]

The line that goes to the slave has already been replaced with a SS line, to my knowledge the rest of the lines are stock. Slave and master are new. I am thinking possibly the flywheel is the problem...if the guy had it resurfaced before and I got it done, maybe its worn below the spec?

 

[mcraetim23]

That sounds possible if u pinpoint the exact cause let me know as I am also getting fed up with mine having the same issue

 

[shampoo]

Never assume new parts are good just because they're new.

I believe even new parts must be tested to ensure they're working.

There is an accepted level of failure for all new "things" in this world.

Check with known working parts just in case.

 

[DsMWookie]

Check behind the slave cylinder boot to see if it is leaking. How fires the travel if the clutch fork look?

Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk

 

[Albrecht09]

Never assume new parts are good just because they're new.

I believe even new parts must be tested to ensure they're working.

There is an accepted level of failure for all new "things" in this world.

Check with known working parts just in case.

I 100% agree, and always check new parts before using them, and when I had the tranny out the first time for the first new clutch, I took the master and slave off the car and disassembled them.. the bore's looked perfect, no scratches or nothing. After it was all back together and bled the lines, I double checked both and neither are leaking at all.

Check behind the slave cylinder boot to see if it is leaking. How fires the travel if the clutch fork look?

Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk

The fork travel seems to be about right..when at rest, the fork is right in the middle, actually a teeeeeny bit towards the driver side of the hole it comes through of the bell housing which is where its supposed to be, and when the clutch is pressed, it moves almost all the way to the passenger side.

After driving it a little more, still being really easy on it, it seems like the issue is slowly improving..in 2-3 days it only slipped like 2 or 3 times. Something still isnt right, as its obviously not supposed to at all..

 

[Crushbone]

most likely not the problem, but just throwing ideas out for you to bounce around...disc in backwards? everything aligned correctly? bolts torqued to spec? i just got done replacing my clutch/tranny and i found that half the bolts i removed from the pressure plated were stretched, and i broke one quite easily removing it...made sure I torque wrenched everything to spec when i put the replacement in.

 

[Albrecht09]

most likely not the problem, but just throwing ideas out for you to bounce around...disc in backwards? everything aligned correctly? bolts torqued to spec? i just got done replacing my clutch/tranny and i found that half the bolts i removed from the pressure plated were stretched, and i broke one quite easily removing it...made sure I torque wrenched everything to spec when i put the replacement in.

Nah, I torque everything with torque wrenches, both times disc's were definitely not in backwards, no issues with broken bolts, etc..

Update:

Today I drove it a good 50 miles, and doesnt seem to be slipping anymore... the last 3-4 miles on my way home I got on it pretty good and let it spool up to almost full boost for the first time and still seemed to be holding. It seems my problem is "slipping" away...

Even if it doesnt slip anymore, still worries me why it did this

 

[pauleyman]

Push the slave. If it doesn't go back in it's bore easily the hydraulics are preloaded and you have to adjust more at the pedal. If you adjust and then find you can't get enough travel without locking the hydraulics you must go back inside and look at the flywheel step, fork, ball, pivot etc. Please tell me you don't have an extended slave rod.

 

[Albrecht09]

Push the slave. If it doesn't go back in it's bore easily the hydraulics are preloaded and you have to adjust more at the pedal. If you adjust and then find you can't get enough travel without locking the hydraulics you must go back inside and look at the flywheel step, fork, ball, pivot etc. Please tell me you don't have an extended slave rod.

To my knowledge, no, but what should the length be? Ill measure it real quick..never heard of that before.