Should water lines be used on 16g?

[kamronman]

It's about time there's a discussion on people opinion for using water lines on any and all MHI turbos. I never used them on my 14b because they were such a hassle to take off every time I was taking the manifold/turbo off (same reason I got rid of my p/s) . I know Lucas doesn't use them on the 1g auto so I figured I'd do the same thing. Is this ok for daily drivability? Should I set the ole' turbo timer for a higher time to hopefully keep it from getting shut off hot? How hot is too hot to shut it off? Should I be using an EGT/Oil temp gauges to somewhat get an idea how hot the turbo is getting? -just throwing out ideas!

 

[Colt4G63 also]

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[habitatguy187]

^^^ Lots of people argue that water-cooled turbo's are pretty much worthless. I wouldn't go that far and would hook them up just because I don't pull my turbo very often, but even if I did they're super easy and I'd probably still use them.

 

[Colt4G63 also]

Yeah maybe my first answer was a little much, but come on people, it isn't that much extra work.

Thinking like that is why DSMs have such a bad reputation for reliability. I see so many hacked repairs in my line of work that a facepalm is just easier that wasting my time with an actual response..

I'm changing my answer:

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[Redwidow]

From what I understand and have read ( someone correct me if Im wrong) but any journal bearing turbo, can be ran with out the coolant lines, as long as the car is given a chance to cool down before shutting off the engine. The cool down period prevents oil coking on the journal bearings, which can cause premature bearing failure. So I see no reason to have the need for the coolant lines, as long as the engine is allowed to cool down for 30-45 seconds after stopping. Also with our youngest DSM being over ten years old, things have a tendency to break, or leak, therefore removing the cooling lines is just one less thing that could go wrong.

To answer the OP, I believe there is no need for the coolant lines, especially if you have a turbo timer. I would just bump it up a little bit so it stays on a little longer, and everything theoretically will be fine.

I will have a little more accurate knowledge here in about 2 weeks when I get the motor back in my car, as I am also in the process of doing this.

 

[Shadow21]

If you ask my opinion then i will give it to you. Mitsubishi designed the thing to be water cooled so put water in it. Simple as that. Would you run your car without a radiator? Ive actually seen damage to 2 16g turbos from not having coolant run through them. To each his own but there is no way in hell i would do it. You cant always believe what you read on the internet. Which ive found out the absolute hard way.

 

[toofast82]

I've ran many mhi turbos without using the water cooling. Just let the car idle for a bit before shutdown. Of course, the coolant wont hurt and is there to help with quick, hot shutdowns. Most factory turbo cars will have water cooled housings for this very reason

 

[JusMX141]

Ive actually seen damage to 2 16g turbos from not having coolant run through them.

I'd like to see proof of this considering most FP Green and FP Red turbos use the identical center housing without a water-cooling provision, and the Green / Red obviously have MUCH higher shaft and thrust loads than a 16G. This type of center housing was used on diesel turbos like the TD06 14C.

The ONLY reason the water-cooling is in place is to prevent oil coking and turbine blade distortion in the event of a hot shutdown. These cars did not come from the factory with turbo timers, so water-cooling in the center housing is the next best thing....and far more reliable.

If you're not going to run coolant, you should have the oil sourced from the filter housing so the oil will be as cool as possible....of course proper restriction may be necessary to prevent over-oiling the turbo when sourcing a TD05H from the filter housing.

 

[pboglio]

The last thing a DSM needs is another failure mode. Not running it is pure laziness. Only reason I see to bypass it is to remove another potential coolant leak issue, but otherwise I personally wouldn't do it.

Different turbo, but the Subaru's have a coolant circulation system that draws coolant thru the turbo after the motor has been turned off. This is the extent they go to protect the turbo, granted the IHI's are a pile of a turbo and probably need all the help they can get. It clearly illustrates there is some intelligence behind cooling the turbo.

 

[AndrewD5418]

I'd like to see proof of this considering most FP Green and FP Red turbos use the identical center housing without a water-cooling provision, and the Green / Red obviously have MUCH higher shaft and thrust loads than a 16G. This type of center housing was used on diesel turbos like the TD06 14C.

The ONLY reason the water-cooling is in place is to prevent oil coking and turbine blade distortion in the event of a hot shutdown. These cars did not come from the factory with turbo timers, so water-cooling in the center housing is the next best thing....and far more reliable.

If you're not going to run coolant, you should have the oil sourced from the filter housing so the oil will be as cool as possible....of course proper restriction may be necessary to prevent over-oiling the turbo when sourcing a TD05H from the filter housing.

What size of a restrictor do you recommend for a td05 from the ofh? .075?

 

[kamronman]

I've been runnng no coolant lines on my e316g for about 4000 miles now, and it finally blew a few weeks ago solely because of the 15$ knockoff bov I was using, EVERY shift=surge. And if you've gone throught the frustration of putting your shit together over and over, and STILL leaking coolant in the back..Wow i don't even want to think about how annoying that was. So go ahead with the face palming. I think the turbo's are water cooled from the factory to prolong the life of that ole' 14b when the driver of the car is uneducated on letting the car cool down after romping (even though it's posted on the drivers side flip-down mirror). An oil cooler is probably the preffered way of not running coolant lines on an mhi turbo. Just my input

 

[JusMX141]

What size of a restrictor do you recommend for a td05 from the ofh? .075?

Somewhere in that area. The inline filter that FP sells for use with their Evo turbos has a .070" oriface to protect the turbo from excessive pressure.

 

[Nati0nalxCrisis]

I don't see why you wouldn't want to run the coolant lines. By not having them on the turbo your just giving it one more reason to fail theoretically. IMHO I would leave them on, wouldn't you want all the extra protection you can get especially for something you pay 500+ dollars for?

 

[AL92]

I have mits 20g in my 99 twin turbo aps trans am.One came shipped with internal crack that let coolant into my engine oil big time.I caught it right away within first few minutes of running . I have not run the water cooling since and have like 7000 miles on the setup. I am swapping in modded 20gs and will be hooking up the water cooling to those.

 

[JusMX141]

I have mits 20g in my 99 twin turbo aps trans am.One came shipped with internal crack that let coolant into my engine oil big time.I caught it right away within first few minutes of running . I have not run the water cooling since and have like 7000 miles on the setup. I am swapping in modded 20gs and will be hooking up the water cooling to those.

How is it not leaking oil outside the turbo if you're no longer running the water to it....or did you cap off the water fittings so the oil can't run out?

 

[tsi1991awd]

I just bought a 20g from a member here who got it from Justin (jusmx141)

It doesn't have coolant ports on the CHRA...when I asked Justin about this he showed me several MHI CHRA's that actually did NOT have the coolant ports. So they are out there. Why would Mitsu make some with and some without if they were SUCH an importance?

 

[JusMX141]

Generally-speaking, a journal bearing turbo that is originally designed for use on a gasoline application will have coolant ports on the center housing while a journal bearing turbo that is designed for use on a diesel engine will not.

Many of the upgraded turbos you see on DSMs today derived from turbos which were designed for diesels. This includes all of the Garrett T3/T4 hybrids, some of the TD06/06H 20G's, as well as most Holset and BW turbos. There is nothing wrong with running them oil-only as long as they are treated right, meaning allowed proper cooldown prior to shutting off the car. On a drag-only car, cooldown is achieved while driving back the return road.

 

[AL92]

Yeah my internally cracked 20 g only leaked coolant into the oil not vice versa. So ran them oil only no problem. Not sure which turbo was doing it and dind't bother to send them back for warranty to australia.