Got my car Tuned and Dyno'ed

[Splitpi]

So this weekend I went up to minneapolis for a Batchelor party and decided to visit the good fellas at MAPerformance for a dyno run and to tune a pig rich eclipse.

I arrived about two hours early and caught them on their way to lunch. They were very polite and asked if I wanted to go with them. So we had lunch, chatted and got to know them a little bit. Very nice guys.

Anyways after a quick tour of the shop, they hooked my car up to the dyno. First pull was 191 hp. After the tune it hit 202 hp. After that it was just some fine tuning and few more runs to verify. We ended up at 201 but that was with several back to back runs and the car was warm. I am very happy with those numbers. Better than I had anticipated, especially when I am only running stock boost (wastegate pressure) on my Big16G. The 450's I had on there were measured at about 75-78% IDC at 202 hp. So if I want to go more, I need to get the Evo injectors installed and working, get a larger Fuel Pump and a new clutch (still have the stock clutch with 80k on it!)

Anyways, it was a pleasure meeting them and I would recommend if someone is in the area to swing by and say hi.

One other note, I made a video of the first and second runs with my car. You can hear a metallic squick when shifting gears. Anyone have any ideas what that may be? I want to get rid of that noise and it has been plaguing me for sometime. Throw Out Bearing?

Video:
Video of Tuning Video 202 HP - Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting

 

[silver bullit]

Nice mods list?

 

[gsxAWDdsm692]

Good shit man!

So your running stock boost as in stock BCS on a Big 16g? Do you get any creep?

 

[CanadianTSi]

If you were only at 80% why not turn the boost up a few more PSI?

 

[silver bullit]

Good shit man!

So your running stock boost as in stock BCS on a Big 16g? Do you get any creep?

If you were only at 80% why not turn the boost up a few more PSI?

Waiting for answers!

 

[Splitpi]

Good shit man!

So your running stock boost as in stock BCS on a Big 16g? Do you get any creep?

No creap. When I installed the b16G, I ported the wastegate path. That helped alot, plus I'm only running wastegate pressure. I just have a T on the BOV line running directly into the wastegate nipple.

If you were only at 80% why not turn the boost up a few more PSI?

I could, but 80 to 90% is really the max in my opinion of what injectors should be safely run at. I need to do some more work on it ... clutch and FPR/Fuel Pump and swap in my Evo 8 560cc injectors before I crank it up further. I'm happy with the numbers. Better than I was expecting.

And my mods list is in my profile. Should be accurate.

Anyone have any ideas what the squek might be?

Edit:

Oh .... one last detail... My LC-1 was reading ~10.7 or there abouts if memory serves me correctly. The external was measuring a little leaner. We got one run with a bit more torque, but I was starting to see some knock, and backed it off to be on the safe side. This was all done on good ole 91 octane pump gas.

 

[silver bullit]

I dunno cant really tell.
What kind or tranny fluid you got, last time changed, cables adjusted?

 

[Splitpi]

So I was playing with some numbers trying to figure out what the BSFC was on the dyno run.

Crank HP = ((((injector size)/10.5) * (Duty Cycle))/ BSFC) * 4)

First time I put the wheel Hp in and duty cycle from my dsmlink log:

202 = (((450/10.5) * .74) / BSFC) * 4)
50.5 BSFC = 31.71
BSFC = 62.8%

Thats pretty inefficient!

But then I realized I should be using Crank HP and not wheel HP. So I did a little research on transmission loss. My understanding is that transmission loss is really a static value with a percentage loss. I.e. the stock 2G motor was rated at 210 hp. On average it appears that the engine would produce about 165-170 at the wheel. This means roughly 40 hp loss. So using my assumption above, I said 30 hp + 5% (i.e. 30 + 210*0.05 = 40.5 hp loss).

Wheel HP = Crank HP - 30 - Crank HP * 0.05
202 = 0.95*Crank HP - 30
Crank HP = 244 Hp

Throwing 244 hp into the BSFC equation above... yields:
BSFC = 52%

That is pretty good!

So is my second assumption correct?

 

[bob123131]

When dealin with stats like that, there are really very few ways to do this accurately. Estimating hp at the crank can be effected on so many different motors with v.e. and different trannies. I would say that isnt an unreasonable assumption, i would ###### guess its more around 235 crank hp, but this is all really bench racing which no one likes.

 

[DSMsOwnYourV8]

I don't understand why you only put 200 to the wheels with those mods. I wouldn't think a stock 2g would put much less to the wheels than that.

 

[gsxAWDdsm692]

I don't understand why you only put 200 to the wheels with those mods. I wouldn't think a stock 2g would put much less to the wheels than that.

Re-read post 1 please

He's running a big 16g on stock boost and stock fuel system.

 

[Splitpi]

I don't understand why you only put 200 to the wheels with those mods. I wouldn't think a stock 2g would put much less to the wheels than that.

Yes you are right... though not at stock boost levels, I'm only running about 8.5 - 9 psi. And my IDC's were at about 75%.

I baby my car too much that is for sure. I don't want to break 80% IDC and from what I understand much past 230 ft/lb the stock clutch goes into kanipshons. So I "think" I am near that line (at least injector wise). And rather than break my car because I took it past what the parts can support, I am shooting lower than I could realize if I pushed things. I'm happy with my numbers (better than I had expected really). Now I have to go get the baby diapers out and rub down the intake and wipers

Also I know I am getting near the limits of the stock fuel pump (at least for the 12.5V numbers RRE posts). Though I could probably crank it up to 12-13 psi and be alright and within a 13% safety margin of worst case with the 14v rewire. But I would rather upgrade the fuel pump and injectors first though and get them tuned and running properly.

Though I still would like to know what that noise is when I shift gears. I have had suggestions it is the BOV... but it doesn't like it to me and it happens irregardless of boost. Throw Out Bearing?

 

[anmGST]

Yes you are right... though not at stock boost levels, I'm only running about 8.5 - 9 psi. And my IDC's were at about 75%.

I baby my car too much that is for sure. I don't want to break 80% IDC and from what I understand much past 230 ft/lb the stock clutch goes into kanipshons. So I "think" I am near that line (at least injector wise). And rather than break my car because I took it past what the parts can support, I am shooting lower than I could realize if I pushed things. I'm happy with my numbers (better than I had expected really). Now I have to go get the baby diapers out and rub down the intake and wipers

Also I know I am getting near the limits of the stock fuel pump (at least for the 12.5V numbers RRE posts). Though I could probably crank it up to 12-13 psi and be alright and within a 13% safety margin of worst case with the 14v rewire. But I would rather upgrade the fuel pump and injectors first though and get them tuned and running properly.

Though I still would like to know what that noise is when I shift gears. I have had suggestions it is the BOV... but it doesn't like it to me and it happens irregardless of boost. Throw Out Bearing?

nice mod list man and looks like your on the right path do your homework first then turn it up. Most just slap on parts and crank it up, next the need a new motor. Be careful on the boost 12-13 PSI my buddy blew his engine in a 14b at 17 PSI. Better safe than sorry. Good luck on the build up

 

[DSMsOwnYourV8]

Re-read post 1 please

He's running a big 16g on stock boost and stock fuel system.

Actually he's running only about 9 psi, stock boost is between 12 and 15, so that explains it right there. A dsm with a 16g, intake, exhaust, fmic, and dsmlink, would definitely be putting more than 200 to the wheels if he was actually running stock boost.

 

[Splitpi]

Actually he's running only about 9 psi, stock boost is between 12 and 15, so that explains it right there. A dsm with a 16g, intake, exhaust, fmic, and dsmlink, would definitely be putting more than 200 to the wheels if he was actually running stock boost.

Yup I'm just running wastegate pressure.

 

[STM tuned]

Nice to see your taking your time before ramping up the boost. Always do what you feel you should be doing and take your time with it. 202 looks good on only 8-9psi. Should really get good once you hit the high teen psi range with new pump/injectors and new tune.

 

[Splitpi]

So I was doing some math and reviewing the DSMlink log:

Knowns:
Dyno HP = 202
Airflow = 23.5 lb/min
Intake Temp = 73
Airflow per Rev = 1.54 g/rev
Boost = 9.2 psi = ~0.65 kg/cm2 (as measured on boost gauge)
Map ~= 23.9 psi (14.7 + 9.2)
A/F = 11.2 (as measured by LC-1)

Guess:
Crank HP = 1.05 * Wheel HP + 30

Solving:
wa= cHP * A/F * BSFC/60
23.5 = 240 * 11.2 * BSFC/60
BSFC = 53%


map = (wa * R * (460 + t))/ (Ve * N/2 * Vd)
23.9 = (23.5 * 639.6 * (460 + 73)) / (Ve * 6970/2 * 122)
Ve = 78.8%

Looking at the chart here

23.5 lb/min = 310.8 CFM
pressure ratio ~= (23.9 / 14.7) = 1.63

It doesn't quite fit the map... So I need to fudge my numbers a bit and accept a difference in map aswell.

 

[Splitpi]

UPDATE:

I found out what the squeek was. My J-pipe was rubbing against metal fan shroud of the AC fan. The clearance was just too little but enough to not be a consitent rub. And as the motor vibrated under load or bumps it would rub. I new it was something near the radiator but wasn't sure, so I took the front end apart figure it out. And it turned out to be the fan shroud.

So took the fan and fan shroud apart and ground a clearance for it. Then sanded all the old rust off of it and repainted it with high temp paint. Looks great now.... and no more ghetto squeek.

However I now realize my SS oil feed line is leak a small but consistent amount of oil... so I'll need to put new crush washers on it during the next oil change... no biggy. I'm just happy it doesn't make that squeek anymore.

 

[DSMunknown]

I hate the J-pipe.

 

[98eclipsekidd08]

Why didnt you do your pump and injectors before the tune? That way you could only do it once and save money and time. I dunno thats the way I did it just curious. Ha im in the same boat with you and the crush washers. Mine were slightly to big and are useless now so I leak just enough to make me mad but not enough to fix it haha.