Motor build suggestions

[TuRBoTaLooN]

Before I go into my post, let me preface it this way. I've been looking through the forums about motor rebuilds, headgaskets, hardware limitations, etc. I am not looking for specific information, rather looking for other members opinions who have had experience in this area. I also plan on writing follow-ups when necessary to help further inform other DSMers.

I recently picked up my second 95 tsi awd. I sold my last one about a year ago. I have the information about the car in my profile, but the short of it is this:

Stock 7-bolt with 145k (no issues with it yet *knock on wood)
550's, 195lph, custom 16g/18g turbo (garret wheel in a TDO-5H housing is all the info i got)
dejon super sidemount, intake, exhaust.
act 2600 clutch, rebuilt trans and front end suspension (stock).

For the time being, I have a 2006 Cobalt SS S/C as a daily driver so I can start building up the talon a little more. I would like a very streetable car somewhere in the range of 400-450awhp and torque in the high 3xxlb/ft range. I've never really pushed a stock 7-bolt before but I have heard/read that it can handle a lot. Right now I'm running my setup at 19psi daily without any issues. I am deciding between one of following options:

1) Rebuild 2.0L motor with forged parts
2) Rebuild 2.3L stroker motor

I'm stuck between keeping the motor 2.0L or stroking it to 2.3L. I've read that with a stroked motor, there are lower end gains and easier/quicker to spool a bigger turbo, but it is limited at the high end because it can't rev as high. Also, since I'm not looking for an all out 500+awhp race car, this may not be necessary. I'm just looking for your guys' thoughts on the subject. I appreciate any and all opinions.

 

[gsxtacy]

Buy a JDM 6 bolt 4g63T.

Tear the cyclone crap off.

Install ARP Headstuds.

Install SMIM of your choice.

DO NOT tear apart the longblock!

Eliminate the BS's.

Install new timing components.

Install turbo/matching fuel system of your choice and beat the crap out of it.

Swap it into your 2G and forget about any problems!

That right there is a Engine that will take 300-500 whp all day long and come home to tell stories about it.

A Bone Stock 6 bolt WITH Balance shafts is good for over 500...n o p r o b l e m

but do what moves you.

 

[TuRBoTaLooN]

what would an estimate be on the cost of a longblock such as that?

 

[Dream On]

Probably a little over a grand. I would just find a 6 bolt and rebuild it. If you're not looking for over 400 whp, I would just get 2g pistons on 1g rods. Forged internals are probably more than you need, unless I'm reading the goals wrong.

 

[gsxtacy]

Junk yard 6 bolts are pretty much everywhere Dead 90,91,early 92 DSM's are.

I have scored 4G63/4g63Ts for less than the cost of a new 4g63T oil pan.

Someone on a budget could build a good longblock for under $600 pretty easy.

A good core longblock +

OEM rings
Rod Bearings
Main Bearins
Oil Pump
Timing Belt Components
Head Gasket
ARP Headstuds

 

[TuRBoTaLooN]

Dream On: I'm actually looking at the 400-450whp range.


gsxtacy: this setup would be able to handle power in this range? what about the headgasket. I'm assuming I'd be running somewhere in the range of 23+psi. Would a stock headgasket suffice?

 

[dsm-onster]

gsxtacy, you mentioned a 'JDM 6-bolt'. What is the difference between that an any other 1990-1991 6 bolt? I was under the impression that they were all the same .

TuRBoTaLooN, so many have put down over 500whp on a 6-bolt block that I'll let you do the research to find out . Personally I've run 30 psi on the stock hg and arp head studs w/ no ill effect other than the "sensitivity". 6 counts of knock and it popped. But it is a great "idiot fuse". It keeps you from damageing something important if your tune isn't great. Tune methodically and consistantly, and a stock composite gasket w/ studs will do fine for your goal.

 

[TuRBoTaLooN]

Thanks for all the advice guys! Please feel free to keep posting opinions. I will start hunting down a 6-bolt.

Any other thoughts on the advantages on stroking the motor vs disadvantages?

 

[unlmtdndeavor]

Buy a JDM 6 bolt 4g63T.

Tear the cyclone crap off.

Install ARP Headstuds.

Install SMIM of your choice.

DO NOT tear apart the longblock!

Eliminate the BS's.

Install new timing components.

Install turbo/matching fuel system of your choice and beat the crap out of it.

Swap it into your 2G and forget about any problems!

That right there is a Engine that will take 300-500 whp all day long and come home to tell stories about it.

A Bone Stock 6 bolt WITH Balance shafts is good for over 500...n o p r o b l e m

but do what moves you.

sorry to say, but i do not agree with you. why would you not tear apart the longblock.

450awhp is not easy to obtain on the stock block. but i would feel much more comfortable with a block that has been freshly machined, forged pistons and rods, new bearings etc.

we also need to know what fuel he plans to run to reach his goals. no way you're going to do 500whp on a stock 6 bolt with 91 octane.

my advice: 6 bolt with eagle/wiseco. it's a budget build but will perform pretty well. deck the head, install a metal head gasket. if you have the money, build the head too. if not, just get some cams, 272 or similar.

if you have the money, i would do a 2.4 long rod. it really does depend on money and how you plan to drive the car. 2.0 for high revving, 2.3 for torque.

2.0 with gt30r

 

[dsm-onster]

sorry to say, but i do not agree with you. why would you not tear apart the longblock.

450awhp is not easy to obtain on the stock block. but i would feel much more comfortable with a block that has been freshly machined, forged pistons and rods, new bearings etc.

Talk to RayPeters about his TWIN charged setup and come back... Personlly. I've run 30 psi on pump gas and a stock long block w/ 195K on it...

we also need to know what fuel he plans to run to reach his goals. no way you're going to do 500whp on a stock 6 bolt with 91 octane.

It's possible. water injection is great... Yes we'll need to talk about it, but don't debunk it as unattainable!...

my advice: 6 bolt with eagle/wiseco. it's a budget build but will perform pretty well. deck the head, install a metal head gasket. if you have the money, build the head too. if not, just get some cams, 272 or similar.

A budget build is 1g rods and 2g pistons... This has taken guys much farther than this guy's goals.

if you have the money, i would do a 2.4 long rod. it really does depend on money and how you plan to drive the car. 2.0 for high revving, 2.3 for torque.

2.0 with gt30r

Great setup. Much cheaper has gone much farther. . . but great setup nonetheless for a street reliable and happy machine!!!

 

[gsxtacy]

I said JDM because they are known to run and have fewer problems than your regular junkyard 6 bolt...

 

[unlmtdndeavor]

Talk to RayPeters about his TWIN charged setup and come back... Personlly. I've run 30 psi on pump gas and a stock long block w/ 195K on it...


It's possible. water injection is great... Yes we'll need to talk about it, but don't debunk it as unattainable!...


A budget build is 1g rods and 2g pistons... This has taken guys much farther than this guy's goals.



Great setup. Much cheaper has gone much farther. . . but great setup nonetheless for a street reliable and happy machine!!!

well i suggested the built bottom end considering this guy was thinking about a stroker setup...aka...he's got the money to spend. why settle for a budget bottom end. water injector is great. i am personally running a snow performance stage 2 setup, but 100% meth. i'm not saying a stock long block won't take the abuse...but i do suggest building the bottom end for power like that.