Getting 280whp (AWD) and maintaining good spoolup

[aaronmatusz]

Okay, I don't know how to show you my dyno sheet, so I'll just let you in on the numbers:
255whp on 93oct @ 19psi
295whp on race gas (102oct?) @ 21psi

So here's the deal:
I'd like to squeeze another 30hp from my setup safely, minimize turbo lag...and pretty much leave it at that FOREVER.

My question is what should I start with to reach my goals?
I was thinking of a magnus intake with thick gasket and some sort of custom "short route" upper IC pipe.
I suspect a bigger turbo might be in order as well, like a PTE BB 50 trim.

Please let me know if I'm on the right track, I use this car at a local auto-X and as a daily driver.

 

[Black Venom]

A Magnus intake manifold is not needed, an Evo 3 16g should get you there. If not then cams, Fp1's would be appropriate.

 

[bob123131]

An ported evo 3 16g or even an fp big t28 will you get you there fine with the right supporting mods.

 

[MyBeatGSX]

Take a look at my mod list. I'm at or well over (the dyno will tell soon) the power you want.

 

[prostreetdsmx1]

the cams will really help you gain some power bud. It looks like you have a pretty well established base to work off of and you are on the right track for your goals. I would probably recommend you pick up an EVOIII16g, something like Comp 101100 or Brian Crower 264s and you should be ther without a problem.

keep us posted on your progess.

 

[weith1111]

The s16g will get you there, don't swap it! I have basically the same setup, but I have cams instead of a FMIC. And I'm getting about the same numbers as you. With both cams and FMIC 300hp will be reachable. I say go that route. You can squeeze more boost out of that little guy too, as long as the 550's are keeping up, low 20's psi is doable.

Good luck!

 

[20psi_GST]

Yes cams will do you a world of good. If you want around 320whp safely then basically all you need are a good set of cams. And possibly an external w/g setup. It says you alrdy got the EVO 3 manifold. You could get a tubular DNP manifold with a Tial 38mm flange, the w/g isnt but like 215.00 dollars. Its a little expensive but will help you hold boost better, build boost faster and could possibly make you build more HP up top.

 

[donmagicjuan]

If you want around 320whp safely then basically all you need are a good set of cams.

Cams would certainly be a good investment, but I don't think 65awhp is a reasonable gain to expect from 264s on a small 16G. If you were able to go from 255awhp to 320awhp by simply dropping in a set of cams, that would be one hell of a feat. I do think the cams and a pound or two more boost will let you reach your goals, however.

 

[weith1111]

Gents, the man wants 30 more hp. The thread is titled "getting 280..." he is at 255. So he's looking for 25-30 more.

This could easily be done by cams alone. A little tweaking of the tune, and a couple more lbs of boost and he will be at almost 300.

 

[JOEY A]

I think if you switch to DSMLINK with a really good tune you should get there, if all else fails go with some 264s.

 

[20psi_GST]

My estimate was with race gas. He said it put 295whp on race gas. Sorry i run only 100 octane in my GST so is why i guess i only noticed the race gas numbers.

 

[donmagicjuan]

My estimate was with race gas. He said it put 295whp on race gas. Sorry i run only 100 octane in my GST so is why i guess i only noticed the race gas numbers.

I had a feeling that's where your numbers were coming from, but I didn't want anyone to get the wrong message. Thanks for clearing that up.

 

[CanadianTSi]

What kind of dyno was this done on?

Cams and 1-2 more psi on 93 octane will get you there.

 

[mwracing]

well i have had big boost issues with my evoIII16g... the internal wastegate wall was raised to the flapper, so even if you wanted to port it, the wall was to thin to make a difference. so i removed the exhaust portion of the turbo and replaced it with a big 16g housing. no more boost creep and better spool too.

is your boost consistant across the dyno sheet? if not you could be lacking power while it creeps to the peak boost.

also i would like to suggest is a blown through design by using a 3'' GM MAS, and maf-t.

so you can vent your blow off valve, and build your boost quicker between shifts.

 

[aaronmatusz]

By the look of it there are two schools of thought here,
The Cam People and the Slightly Bigger Turbo People...

I'm inclined to go with the bigger turbo crowd...why does that work anyway?

Also, does it make sense to cover the details?
I'm thinking of things like a turbo wrap kit, popping a hole in the hood to let hot air out and shortening the IC piping as much as possible.

 

[MyBeatGSX]

By the look of it there are two schools of thought here,
The Cam People and the Slightly Bigger Turbo People...

I'm inclined to go with the bigger turbo crowd...why does that work anyway?

Also, does it make sense to cover the details?
I'm thinking of things like a turbo wrap kit, popping a hole in the hood to let hot air out and shortening the IC piping as much as possible.

Absolutely. The little things are the difference between the people that really know what they're doing and the ones that just throw parts at the car. Will you get a huge power gain? Probably not, but every little bit will make a difference and you're only looking for 30hp.

Why does a bigger turbo work? I'm assuming that's what you meant. Because it moves more air volume at the same boost and is more than likely blowing cooler air at that boost too. In the case of a significantly bigger turbo, the hot side will be bigger too and give you less backpressure. So this all adds up to more power and safer power without turning up the boost.

 

[weith1111]

You can pick up those 30 hp any number of ways, the question is, which road do you want to travel: cheap, easy, more possibilities for the future, etc.

Since you don't plan on raising the horsepower again in the future (yeah right ), getting a new turbo would be the LAST thing to do. You should be looking to maximize what you have. People constantly just get a bigger turbo. Need more power? Bigger turbo. More still? Go bigger. The good tuners can take a 14b or 16g much further than all these rookies bolting gargantuan snails to their motors.

Getting DSMlink would probably allow you to grab 30 hp, but it's not the most affordable route (cams would be cheaper).

I'd give it a go with what you have. Try to eliminate ALL boost leaks, make sure your plugs are flawless, wires are in good condition, build a box around your aif filter to get colder air, wrap or heat shield the turbo and manifold/o2 housing/any exhaust parts you can.

Then max out the turbo and injectors.

You will get there or at least make it really damn close with some patient tuning.

Is the manifold/turbo/etc ported?

 

[Jeff822]

As for cams i would suggest some FP2's, and if you are thinking bigger turbo, then just like everyone else said go with the EVO III 16g. Or, just run race gas everyday

 

[aaronmatusz]

Very good stuff,
The more I read this the clearer things get including my own goals.
For this reason I shall repeat these goals with some revisions:

Cost is no object really (about $3500 budget for 30HP)
My goal is supercharger quick throttle response and maintianing as much power in the 2500-3500rpm range as possible, and I think weith1111
is on the right track with a great start on a list of details...any more to add to that list and all the other great suggestions so far?

Also, will cams make for less low-end power?

...Sheesh, I just need a bigger motor

 

[Slippi84]

Very good stuff,
The more I read this the clearer things get including my own goals.
For this reason I shall repeat these goals with some revisions:

Cost is no object really (about $3500 budget for 30HP)
My goal is supercharger quick throttle response and maintianing as much power in the 2500-3500rpm range as possible, and I think weith1111
is on the right track with a great start on a list of details...any more to add to that list and all the other great suggestions so far?

Also, will cams make for less low-end power?

...Sheesh, I just need a bigger motor

Supercharger?? Bigger motor??? These are sacreligous terms around here. Get the bigger turbo. I have heard a million times this is my final goal I want to get to. Then the next month ok well maybe 30hp more and so on. Pick up a true 16g and 650's and you will be able to hit your goal asleep and have head room for when you get just a little more power hungry.

 

[20psi_GST]

Also, will cams make for less low-end power?

Of course they will, they will open you up up top also.

 

[weith1111]

This thread is getting a bit of misinformation, poor suggestions, and the overall question here is rather ridiculous now when you say you have a $3500 budget. With $3500 your options are endless. Rather, it would be hard to stay UNDER 300hp with $3500 spent on performance mods. Actually, I think it would be impossible...

Just be another person that gets another turbo upgrade when it's not necessary.

Newbies may not be able to post in the advanced forums, but you can read threads in there, and I suggest you do. There would only be one suggestion from advanced Tuners: more boost and better tuning. DSMlink wouldn't be a bad decision if you still aren't there. And if for some reason you can't get to 300 at that point, then do the cams. Needing a new turbo for 30 more horse is silly when you aren't maxing out your current turbo.

Obviously it's your car and your cash so do as you wish, but with the basic question, what do you need to buy for 30 more HP? Nothing that you don't already have.

Good luck.

 

[1997turbodsm]

evo III will def do the trick.

 

[Slippi84]

This thread is getting a bit of misinformation, poor suggestions, and the overall question here is rather ridiculous now when you say you have a $3500 budget. With $3500 your options are endless. Rather, it would be hard to stay UNDER 300hp with $3500 spent on performance mods. Actually, I think it would be impossible...

Just be another person that gets another turbo upgrade when it's not necessary.

Newbies may not be able to post in the advanced forums, but you can read threads in there, and I suggest you do. There would only be one suggestion from advanced Tuners: more boost and better tuning. DSMlink wouldn't be a bad decision if you still aren't there. And if for some reason you can't get to 300 at that point, then do the cams. Needing a new turbo for 30 more horse is silly when you aren't maxing out your current turbo.

Obviously it's your car and your cash so do as you wish, but with the basic question, what do you need to buy for 30 more HP? Nothing that you don't already have.

Good luck.

I thought the same thing. $3500 to get 30hp that's a pretty shitty dollar to hp ratio. But that's not the point he asked what to do and we're giving him information based on his question no matter if we agree or not. If it were me I would buy dsmlink bigger injectors cams and a turbo and go for 400+hp but it's not me so I just give my .02 on what he asked.

 

[Caithness]

I don't understand any of these replies. He wants to go from 255 to 280whp and people are saying "upgrade turbo, upgrade fuel injectors, upgrade engine management" etc. If you look at his profile you'll see he already has a turbo easily capable of 280 whp on pump, 550cc injectors easily capable of supporting 300whp even at 1g stock base pressure. An SAFC2 which isn't ideal but when paired with reasonably sized 550cc injectors, a workable solution. All he needs to easily push 280 whp is a set of mild cams. The Brian Crower stage 2's are only 316 bucks, those would do it. Get a bit spendier and run the FP1 cams for 430, not that they'd necessarily work better, but they have a longer track record. Install those and bump the boost to 20 psi on pump and he's there.

If he wanted to spend money just for the heck of it, DSMlink and a 2g mas would be nice. I'd recommend an Evo/3g mas, but I don't know if DSMlink can compensate for those yet. An AFPR would be nice too, or just a non-turbo 1g fpr. Get the fuel pressure up to get a bit more fuel out of the injectors, and get rid of overrun.