Clutch Goes Bye bye....

[STL91TSI]

Well, my 91 Talon TSI is spending the night along side the highway till morning.
Clutch is gone, pretty sure there isnt much left of it.
Wont move at all, I was trying to make it home and i was able to go 25 mph for a bit, then the damn hill!
Also before I came to a stop, i heard a noise, either i hit some junk on the road or guess might of been clucth breaking. Hope it was junk in the road...

At any rate on a good note, I have a Clutch , cover , and bearing that I have sitting in the garage as a future project, though the future is now looking like tomorrow.

What am in for, anything else I should look for or replace while im in there?
Just cause I know someone will ask, the tranny is fine, goes through all the gears, and engine is fine starts right up. (That clunk worried me for a moment.)

Anyway appreciate any tips and advice.

On a side note, its an AWD and this is gonna be my 1st tow. Has to be flad beded, or just towed with all 4 wheels on ground right??

 

[weith1111]

Check the flywheel for cracks. Check the main seal behind it too, or just replace as it's a couple bucks and quite a headache to replace as you'd have to pull the tranny out again. It sits inside this guy: http://www.slowboyracing.com/more.php?id=1932&

Flatbed is the way to go.

Check the whole drivetrain while you are down there, especially the xfer case for leakage.

Replace everybody's fluid.

Good time to check your ball joints, axles, CV joints, brakes, etc, too.

Good luck.

Depending on if you are due for a timing belt change soon (every 60k), it's almost easier to pull the motor with the tranny. Actually, I think it's always easier to pull the tranny with the motor, dropping the tranny is a bi***, especially with rusty 25 year old undercarriage. Then it's MUCH easier to do the timing belt/water pump/front case, and you can check/easily replace all your motor/tranny mounts.

 

[injection]

heh, have fun. i just did a tranny swap/clutch in my awd.. it was my first one it took me about 4 hours out.. took me longer to put in for some reason though. but anyways i had to take apart all the damn intercooler pipes and everything to get the tranny to drop down enough. the pipes held the tranny from dropping all the way. it's fun i'm glad mine is done. better you then me again .

 

[STL91TSI]

Any thoughts on the clunk i heard?
Guessing a piece of the clutch broke off?? (Coulda been road trash too)
I looked under the car (as best as i could along the road) didnt see anything abnormal with the best look I could get in that situation.

 

[STL91TSI]

Could I be wrong in it being the clutch?
Ill reenact what happened, I lauched at roughly 5500-6k, felt like it slipped a bit.
I get about 1/2 mile down road got to a stop sign, took off ( normal this time ), and took off seemed like it was slipping much more, and progressivly got worse within 1/4 mile to the point where I was going 25 mph at 7k rpm. Came on a small incline and then she wouldnt move at all , I pulled over and there she sits unable to move.
The clutch pedal feels like it always has, while clutch was still pulling a bit, i tried shifting and it went into all gears fine.

I dont recall though smelling the clutch though now I think about it.
Grr I hope its the damn clutch.


Bah , i need to quit thinking about it and go to bed!

 

[boosted_91_tsi]

When you do the clutch, replace the fork and pivot ball while you are at it. May want to think of the master and slave cylinder as well but be sure to do the fork and ball. It will save you a headache later down the road.

 

[injection]

sounds like the same thing i did with my car but unfortunitely mine ended up being the transmission. everything in the tranny was shot i had to do a tranny

 

[weith1111]

When you do the clutch, replace the fork and pivot ball while you are at it. May want to think of the master and slave cylinder as well but be sure to do the fork and ball. It will save you a headache later down the road.

Good idea.

Also, I forgot to mention, make sure your throw out bearing has the plastic sleeve, not the metal one. Most every one you come across will have the plastic sleeve, but if you have a super old one or someone was cleaning off their shelf of "can't get rid of's" for you, you might have an old metal style which is no good.

 

[Boost Freak 3]

Ive been there. I had the same prob. I blew my clutch and i could only go like 5mph in 5th gear. that time it was my clutch. But I was at the track when I launched it and started going down the track when all the sudden every gear went to redline. After letting the car cool down everything was fine. But I sold my car a week later and the kid who bought it called me the next day saing that he lost 1st 3rd and 5th. Brought it over and yep the insides were shattered. I would get both though fixed whill your there.

 

[95talon_in_ma]

To me it doesn't sound like your clutch.
All your clutch does is break up the driveline when the tranny is in gear. So when you step on the pedal, the clutch does it's job. When the pedal is not depressed, the clutch is just along for the ride with the flywheel. So if the tranny is slipping and it's in gear and the pedal is not depressed, it's probably the tranny itself.
Every time a clutch went on me, It's basically like stepping on the pedal and nothing happened. Basically it feels like it's stuck in gear. Trying to put it back in you will hear allot of grinding.

If this isn't what happened, your clutch is fine and it's probably your tranny.
A bad clutch will not make your car feel like it's in neutral when it's not.

You more than likely would have had signs it was going for quite some time too. Your pedal "feel" would have been noticably decreasing for at least a few weeks prior.

The clunk was probably your tranny.....

 

[weith1111]

To me it doesn't sound like your clutch.
All your clutch does is break up the driveline when the tranny is in gear. So when you step on the pedal, the clutch does it's job. When the pedal is not depressed, the clutch is just along for the ride with the flywheel. So if the tranny is slipping and it's in gear and the pedal is not depressed, it's probably the tranny itself.
Every time a clutch went on me, It's basically like stepping on the pedal and nothing happened. Basically it feels like it's stuck in gear. Trying to put it back in you will hear allot of grinding.

If this isn't what happened, your clutch is fine and it's probably your tranny.
A bad clutch will not make your car feel like it's in neutral when it's not.

You more than likely would have had signs it was going for quite some time too. Your pedal "feel" would have been noticably decreasing for at least a few weeks prior.

The clunk was probably your tranny.....

This is incorrect information for a few reasons. A bad clutch WILL make your car feel like you have no power. The motor is turning, but the clutch isn't holding on to keep the tranny up to speed. Also, you can go from a perfectly functioning clutch to a completely not working clutch with just one high rpm slipping clutch launch. I've done it myself and had to limp the bastard home at 20 mph. Also, the clutch is not simply "along for the ride." A slipping clutch is exactly that, it can't HOLD ON to the flywheel anymore. That's what clutches do, they HOLD ON.

I don't know about the clunk, it could be a ton of things, depending on where it came from. But I do know a stock clutch with 100k plus miles on it being launched at 6k rpms, followed by, while in gear, revs going up, but car not going any faster, is a glazed clutch. If you are in gear and the clutch is engaged, and the car does not accelerate coinciding with the increase in RPMs, the clutch is either not clamping (worn) or not clamping (not fully engaging). Either way you look at it you are dropping the tranny, so just do it!

 

[suicidal2af]

To me it doesn't sound like your clutch.
All your clutch does is break up the driveline when the tranny is in gear. So when you step on the pedal, the clutch does it's job. When the pedal is not depressed, the clutch is just along for the ride with the flywheel. So if the tranny is slipping and it's in gear and the pedal is not depressed, it's probably the tranny itself.
Every time a clutch went on me, It's basically like stepping on the pedal and nothing happened. Basically it feels like it's stuck in gear. Trying to put it back in you will hear allot of grinding.

If this isn't what happened, your clutch is fine and it's probably your tranny.
A bad clutch will not make your car feel like it's in neutral when it's not.

You more than likely would have had signs it was going for quite some time too. Your pedal "feel" would have been noticably decreasing for at least a few weeks prior.

The clunk was probably your tranny.....

How do you have 2 chicklets?

The clutch disk, the part that typically fails, is a friction surface. The flywheel turns the input shaft by turning the clutch disk -- which adheres to the flywheel by way of friction. This friction surface wears down, and eventually loses its ability to hold torque -- and the disk starts to slip. The problem he described is EXACTLY what a failing clutch disc would do.

The transmission, on the other hand, is comprised of many, many interlocking parts. The only part that does any sort of friction related activities are the syncros, which in no way would impact mph vs rpm. If the car is revving up real high in gear without moving, you have a gear whose teeth have been sheared off(at best), and the car will not move at all in this gear.

Cliff Notes: Clutches slip, transmission break.

Back on topic to the OP:

It's most likely your clutch. The noise you heard may have been you losing all remaining friction surface(happened to my stock clutch) and rivets coming in contact with the flywheel. If this is the case, inspect the flywheel closely to make sure there are no cracks or anything like that. In my case, there was only slight gouging and a simple resurface did the trick.

Also plan on resurfacing your flywheel and having your step height checked. A decent machine shop can check both of these for you. If they don't have the equipment to check step height, measure from bottom of flywheel to top of step with a caliper, then measure the flywheel thickness between the step and subtract it from the first.

 

[1990talon]

Ok I just went through this same exact thing and put a clutch in for no reason. Mine turned out to be the drivers side axle broke. it is simple to check and could save you alot of time and money (Actully I am in the process of doing this right now). Just crawl under the car and grab one axle and move it then the other, both should have minimal play in them it will be obvious if you broke it some one else told me this and I thought It was definatly the clutch and then there was a problem on top of that but it seems it was just the rear axle. Oh well got a new clutch now! just a pain trying to find the axle. but seriously mine was exactly the same exact symptyoms might as well check it is free and easy to check it and might save you alot of money

Good luck,
Brandon

 

[T is for TURBO]

Not sure, But is is possible that the clucking noise could have been one of the disk springs popping out? Not sure why it would, but it's just a thought...

 

[T is for TURBO]

Ok I just went through this same exact thing and put a clutch in for no reason. Mine turned out to be the drivers side axle broke. it is simple to check and could save you alot of time and money (Actully I am in the process of doing this right now). Just crawl under the car and grab one axle and move it then the other, both should have minimal play in them it will be obvious if you broke it some one else told me this and I thought It was definatly the clutch and then there was a problem on top of that but it seems it was just the rear axle. Oh well got a new clutch now! just a pain trying to find the axle. but seriously mine was exactly the same exact symptyoms might as well check it is free and easy to check it and might save you alot of money

Good luck,
Brandon

Also, what he said ^^^

A buddy of mine had the same shit happen... Driverside rear axle borke, and he said it felt like a slipping clutch... he was so convinced it was the clutch that he was just about to pull the tranny, but for some reason he looked under the car and saw the broken axle...

 

[STL91TSI]

Cars about all wrapped up,

The clutch was completely destroyed it exploded, guessing it was the original clutch.
The clunk was the clutch I guess, tranny is fine.
While the engine was out , checked it over carefully, decided to just replace the timing belt,balance shaft belt,water pump,tensioner etc. As well as clutch,cover,TO Bearing, and resurfacing flywheel. No other real leaks to speak off, except for the transfer case had a minor leak so gonna take care of that.

Should be back on the road by Tuesday.

 

[weith1111]

Cars about all wrapped up,

The clutch was completely destroyed it exploded, guessing it was the original clutch.
The clunk was the clutch I guess, tranny is fine.
While the engine was out , checked it over carefully, decided to just replace the timing belt,balance shaft belt,water pump,tensioner etc. As well as clutch,cover,TO Bearing, and resurfacing flywheel. No other real leaks to speak off, except for the transfer case had a minor leak so gonna take care of that.

Should be back on the road by Tuesday.

F'ing fantastic to hear that. I'm glad you did the timing belt while the motor was out.

Check your master and slave cylinders while you are at it. They are probably on their last legs, and if you are putting in a higher pressure clutch, now will be the time they give out on you.

Nice work!

 

[STL91TSI]

Timing Belt had a small crack in it too.