WHY CANT I soften my clutch pedal, increase the play.

[Lordpaxin]

I am so aggrivated

I have a cm 2500 in the car now
its a 2g and the accumulato is still in place.

the problem is.
the clutch pedal is super stiff, and has no play. engages at the steering wheel instead of a few inches from the floor like i want it.

so i get out my 12mm and adjust it pefect soft pedal, perfect play, engages right about 3 inches off the floor.

and drive. 20 minutes into the drive the pedal starts to tigten up again the point of engagement moves right back uptopwhere it was before i adjusted it.


Wtf!!!!!!!

so once again i have a super stiff clutch with super high engage point.
why?

 

[Morphius]

I don't own a manual 2g, so I'm baseing this off experience with 1g cars (although they are very similiar)

You describe symptoms associated with pedal pump up. I'd speculate you have the MC rod adjusted too far out. I'd refer you to RRE's site for a good 2G writeup.

 

[Lordpaxin]

That the thing.
I ajdust it down to where it should be.
and it just hardens back up.

also, during re adjustment, it seems super hard to turn, i have to use pliers to turn the rod, then it "breaks" loose. and turns smooth either direction.

It is a little wet too, leaks a small amt.
I have a new one on the way, aswell as a ss line to remove the accumulator.

 

[PieEyedPiper]

Sounds to me like your master cylinder is leaking. Well thats a no brianer cause you just told us it leaks a bit right?

Since your master is leaking fluid/pressure that is why the engement point keeps moving even after adjustment.
Rebuild it or replace it.

Same thing happened to me, replaced the master, slave and got a new ss line from the master to the slave that entirely bypasses the accumulator (slowboy) and my problme was solved.

The line is very pricey though, cost me like 90 bucks. Almost as much as a new master and slave were.

oh and post back if you "feel" a difference with the accumulator bypassed, I noticed zero difference.

 

[Lordpaxin]

I see.

I went ahead and ordered a new master and ss line, but im foggy with the theory that a leaking master would make the pedal pressure Increase!

ohwell.

 

[leakyfaucet]

^^^

Yeah, a leaky slave or master will only cause the clutch to engage closer to the floor, not further away.

 

[PieEyedPiper]

hmm, well from the problem i was experiencing, the pedal engagment would slide up towards the steering wheel because at the top of the master cylinder's stroke it would leak due to a worn seal i presume. So when the rod was full extended it would leak fluid/air/pressure and allow the pedal engagment to come up real high.

at least that was my understanding.
the pedal never got stiffer.. but the engagment would get higher for sure. I would think depending on the nature of the wear/leak of the hydraulic system you could end up with a lower or higher engagment? and of course however the rod was adjusted could also determine to what degree the engagment would change.

I was also very high when i thought about how this worked, so it's definitely possible that i had overlooked something.

EDIT: also, would not the only cause for this kind of symptom be hydraulic related? I could conjur up no other explanation for pedal feel/adjustment changing than a worn/leaking/air in the lines/messed up hydraulic system.

 

[Lordpaxin]

New update.

I drove the car to work with a dumptruck clutch, felt like.... and went inside, came out 8 hours later, and 20 degrees colder, and the clutch was Exactly like it was when I adjusted it, Soft (as a 2500 gets) and the right engagement location.

about 2 miles into the drive home, ROCK solid again.

haha, i bet when i throw that new master on itll be fine.

 

[Sharkcus]

oh and post back if you "feel" a difference with the accumulator bypassed, I noticed zero difference.

Just wanted to chime in on this. I noticed no difference either.

 

[SpyderGuy97]

Im having the exact same problem, I have adjusted the clutch several times to no avail. A friend and I bled the fluid out, it helped for a little while, but its doing it again, I guess im going to start at the slave cylinder tommorow. Any one know anything about this????

 

[Lordpaxin]

I have a SS clutch line, and a New Master Comming.

Also, I adjusted it down so it was so low that engagement was instant.
and it hasnt stiffened up yet.

I think a disfunctional master is the blame.

 

[bhop]

I just replaced my master and slave this weekend, so they're brand new, and I have the SS line installed as well. I'm having the pump-up problem myself. It's happened before (like when my clutch was installed a few months back), but I was usually able to find a adjustment spot that worked, which doesn't seem to be happening this time, no matter how I adjust the pedal, it pumps back up. If you find a fix, please post it.

edit: actually, I finally figured out what Road Race meant in their write up about pump-up. I think the upper pedal stop needs to be adjusted so that it's a little farther away from the floor. I'm going to give it a try when I get off work..

The text about it is here, halfway down the page, under "2G Pedal Pump Up" http://www.roadraceengineering.com/clutchandflywheeltech.htm see pic:

http://www.roadraceengineering.com/eclipsetech/clutch/2g-clutchadjustment.jpg

 

[greysave]

I had a similar problem but on a comletely different platform and setup, but I hope this helps. I have a twin plate clutch in an sti...When I initially had the problem the clutch would engage like trash and it would be hard to get into gear. The clutch and plate are actually much deeper then stock. It took until the clutch broke in for the problem to start. How long ago did you put your clutch in? If it is brand new It may need to burn off the excess disk.

 

[Lordpaxin]

it was a recent install..... I few days ago, i adjusted it down to the Minimum most position and still go into gear, it engages at the carpet, . and hasnt pumped up yet.

I tried this previously, but ajdusted it up just a hair more, and got pump up fast. so far this low, it hasnt.

 

[bhop]

FIXED IT, thanks to Road Race's little write-up.

I had to drive home from work the same way you mentioned, with it engaging on the carpet, but tonight I adjusted it properly and went driving around. so far, it's working fine...Basically loosen the upper adjuster nut, then turn the little black box circled on the photo so that the pedal stops farther away from the floor. (I twisted mine 3 rotations) This will allow you to adjust the engagement point farther from the floor to a more comfortable position instead of right next to it. Don't forget to tighten the nut back. Hope this helps you. It did for me.

 

[Lordpaxin]

WOW excellent
I didnt even think about that.
I have my new master and ss Line sitting on the shelf, so ill get at it sooner or later.

i probly dont NEED to replace the master, But, it is showing signs of death, there is black sticky residue around the push rod and boot.

Thanks again, cant wait to give it a try.

 

[bhop]

...there is black sticky residue around the push rod and boot.

There should be some grease there to lube the rod (no pun intended), so I think that's pretty normal. It's the liquid fluid you need to worry about. Although, mine died and I didn't see any fluid.. I don't know where it was going when It was emptying out.. but oh well.. it works fine now with the new cylinders.

 

[Lordpaxin]

I have the new one in the box with the line, I figure Im going to have to bleed the whole system out anyway after i put on the line, might aswell stick that ho on there too.

so you have expierenced No more pumpup?

 

[bhop]

so you have expierenced No more pumpup?

Nope. I drove all the way to work, in L.A. stop and go traffic with no problems.