Ultra Cool brake fans

[99gst_racer]

These were just introduced to us at work this morning. I'm still not quite sure what to make of them. Have anyone else ever seen something like this before? They appear to be primarily used on circle track cars, but it seems it could be beneficial in road racing as well.

Their claim to fame is that it's the only product on the market that cools the wheel side of the caliper and pushes heat out through the wheel. I believe they only weigh about 1/2 lb. each, so it's also lighter than a traditional duct and blower setup. My first concern was if they were decently balanced or not. My other concern was whether or not they actually worked well enough.

Thoughts?

Ultra Cool Brake Fans

[Bud92gsx]

Very simple design.But for 80$ a peice I think I would rather make ducting.Unless you are in nascar and can spend millions of dollars on stuff,I see no use for your weekend racer.

[96' Eclipse GS]

I'm sure there may be a sigh of difference in temps, But I will just stick to traditional Slotted and Drilled and go on with it. I have seen them from time to time though, different design here and there....just my $.02

[Dyesuperman]

Very cool, I actually wouldn't mind having some of these if I ever get into road racing. My only worry would be brake caliper clearance

[99gst_racer]

I just read further on the ordering page, and found this: "Does not fit Cup style hubs or most street car hubs (fan blade will hit brake caliper)."

They said that the blades can be bent for caliper clearance, but it sounds like that's just not an option on most street cars.

[Dyesuperman]

Originally Posted by 99gst_racer

I just read further on the ordering page, and found this: "Does not fit Cup style hubs or most street car hubs (fan blade will hit brake caliper)."

They said that the blades can be bent for caliper clearance, but it sounds like that's just not an option on most street cars.

Yeah I was afraid of that. I know the brembos stick out pretty damn far. Love the idea though, it would be cool if someone could figure out how to get them to work on street cars

[bmoha7321]

I have seen wheels on a couple supercars that are supposed to do the same thing. I forget exactly what car but the wheels had a similar vane to them.

[Artago]

What about making your own?

[crimsondragon]

You might as well buy rims with the spokes being fan blade shaped.

[cait sith]

Originally Posted by 96' Eclipse GS

I'm sure there may be a sigh of difference in temps, But I will just stick to traditional Slotted and Drilled and go on with it. I have seen them from time to time though, different design here and there....just my $.02

Considering slotted is negligible performance gains on stock rotors and cross drilling actually makes things worse by removing caliper heat-sink weight, your two cents might need to get changed up.

As far as those goofy fan things, you are never going to be running your car that hard and that long for braking to make it worth even thinking about. This includes track days, road course work, etc. Not even a GT class Rolex 24 hour car is running that stuff.

[Artago]

Originally Posted by cait sith

Considering slotted is negligible performance gains on stock rotors and cross drilling actually makes things worse by removing caliper heat-sink weight, your two cents might need to get changed up.

As far as those goofy fan things, you are never going to be running your car that hard and that long for braking to make it worth even thinking about. This includes track days, road course work, etc. Not even a GT class Rolex 24 hour car is running that stuff.

^^ Good point. Seems like a waste of time/money. The only thing you'll get is the bling factor.

[dsmTripp]

Originally Posted by bmoha7321

I have seen wheels on a couple supercars that are supposed to do the same thing. I forget exactly what car but the wheels had a similar vane to them.

I believe in the thread of old dsm article's, memorabilia, and ads they have some pictures of early 1g's with wheels made like this. But from the looks of these, other than being balanced, any body would be able to make these. So i dont understand the price tag unless its just somebody's new to do at filling their pockets by selling crap. 2¢

[red_devil]

I think if they worked well enough you would see them on more race cars. Interesting idea though.

[Ludachris]

Originally Posted by cait sith

Considering slotted is negligible performance gains on stock rotors and cross drilling actually makes things worse by removing caliper heat-sink weight, your two cents might need to get changed up.

As far as those goofy fan things, you are never going to be running your car that hard and that long for braking to make it worth even thinking about. This includes track days, road course work, etc. Not even a GT class Rolex 24 hour car is running that stuff.

I think good old fashioned ducting would do better for road course stuff, which is really the only application where you'd need to consider any type of rotor cooling. This is just one more part that can fail and potentially get lodged in the calipers.

I was able to make my rotors glow red doing 20 minute stints at the track. I need some brake cooling, as I was eating up pads quickly... and it reduces the rotor life too. You need some type of ducting if you're doing road racing. It's just tricky on a 1g with the limited space for it.

I plan to do something where I just run a short piece of duct from the rotor down under the control arm and pull air from under the car. I'll put more effort into creating a seal around the area where I'm feeding the air so that it doesn't just bounce right out - I'll force it to go through the vanes.

[99gst_racer]

Originally Posted by cait sith

As far as those goofy fan things, you are never going to be running your car that hard and that long for braking to make it worth even thinking about. This includes track days, road course work, etc. Not even a GT class Rolex 24 hour car is running that stuff.

Huh? Lots of road course cars address brake cooling. Lots of cars on this site do as well. And I don't have to know anything at all about Rolex cars to know they probably address brake cooling in several different ways. Afterall, heat is a killer. Pulling heat from the brake system is always a good thing. Especially prolonged heat during repeatedly aggressive braking.

Nobody is claiming that every car needs a product like this. But it very well could be a viable option for some race cars.

Originally Posted by red_devil

I think if they worked well enough you would see them on more race cars. Interesting idea though.

I wouldn't gauge it's effectiveness on that alone. This is a relatively new product.

Originally Posted by dsmTripp

But from the looks of these, other than being balanced, any body would be able to make these. So i dont understand the price tag unless its just somebody's new to do at filling their pockets by selling crap. 2¢

They're laser cut and CNC shaped to ensure repeatable precision. I seriously doubt any of us could replicate one of these and maintain their level of quality and precision. The corrosion resistant zinc coating adds to the price as well.

The retail price is where it is so that these can be sold through the 3-step process. If they retailed for $50 each, warehouse wouldn't stock them because they couldn't sell them and be profitable, and the product line would never grow.

[delta448]

I think these belong here.

I wonder why their video used a little flag instead of a thermometer to show how effective they are.

[99gst_racer]

I didn't even know they had a video. It's blocked from my view. I was wondering why I didn't see any test data and couldn't find anything on their site that appeared to be a test results of some sort. That's definitely another reason to be skeptical.

[cait sith]

I was referring to the fans, not actual brake ducting, if that clarifies. Actual proper ducting and effort put into that is always worth it.

It's like those old late 80s touring car "Turbo" wheels that fell out of favor (eg: the big IMSA Audis) because pad compounds changed so much for the better.

[red_devil]

It’s new to the public but F1 teams have been using a fan design since 2001. The only difference is that the ducting on a F1 is a fully enclosed system and the blades are used to reduce turbulence inside the ducting. At the same time using the static wheel fairings to help aid the hot air to escape.

[99gst_racer]

Originally Posted by cait sith

I was referring to the fans, not actual brake ducting, if that clarifies. Actual proper ducting and effort put into that is always worth it.

I figured you would agree that brake cooling is a good thing and necessary in some situations.

These Ultra Cool guys are claiming this fan product works better than a traditional duct and blower because it moved a greater amount of air. And of course, I would like to see proof of that claim just as much as anyone else.

Originally Posted by red_devil

It’s new to the public but F1 teams have been using a fan design since 2001. The only difference is that the ducting on a F1 is a fully enclosed system and the blades are used to reduce turbulence inside the ducting. At the same time using the static wheel fairings to help aid the hot air to escape.

Interesting. I had also been wondering if this fan product would truely move air in the proper direction or just cause turbulance. I imagine wheel design and speed would also have a great affect on it too.

[snowborder714]

Paul, see if you can get one for "testing/customer feedback" purposes and send it to me for testing


I'm not sure if I'd expect gains with this over a proper duct setup or not. But I can see clearance issues being a problem.

[PieEyedPiper]

Originally Posted by 99gst_racer

I figured you would agree that brake cooling is a good thing and necessary in some situations.

These Ultra Cool guys are claiming this fan product works better than a traditional duct and blower because it moved a greater amount of air. And of course, I would like to see proof of that claim just as much as anyone else.


Interesting. I had also been wondering if this fan product would truely move air in the proper direction or just cause turbulance. I imagine wheel design and speed would also have a great affect on it too.

How much is a blower and duct flowing in CFM? What is enough?

Just at a glance, I'd wager that those blades would toss around more air than your average oscillating fan. I guess we could start bench racing the blade design.. but I'd really think that those would, indeed, move a significant amount of air. A lot of the effect would likely come from removing heat from the giant heatsinks that are our wheels, rather than direct cooling of the rotor/caliper.

Do you have any specs? Blade pitch, etc. ?

[99gst_racer]

Originally Posted by snowborder714

Paul, see if you can get one for "testing/customer feedback" purposes and send it to me for testing

I have one sitting here on my desk, but I believe it's live inventory, not a sample, so they probably wouldn't let me send it out for free to be tested.

I'm curious though; how would you go about testing something like this?

Originally Posted by PieEyedPiper

How much is a blower and duct flowing in CFM? What is enough?

Just at a glance, I'd wager that those blades would toss around more air than your average oscillating fan. I guess we could start bench racing the blade design.. but I'd really think that those would, indeed, move a significant amount of air. A lot of the effect would likely come from removing heat from the giant heatsinks that are our wheels, rather than direct cooling of the rotor/caliper.

Do you have any specs? Blade pitch, etc. ?

The inline blowers that I sell range from 140 CFM to 240 CFM depending on length and diameter. I have no clue what kind of CFM one of these Ultra Cool fans moves.

I only have basic measurements of it. It's roughly 11.625" in diameter and an overall thickness of about 2".

[snowborder714]

Originally Posted by 99gst_racer

I'm curious though; how would you go about testing something like this?

I'd probably go do a spirited run with some hard braking without it, stop, and use my IR temp gun to see the caliper/rotor temps. Then install and repeat.

Other than doing it at night on a course to see if I could get the rotors to glow with and without it, that's the only thing I can come up with.

[turbosax2]

I'd use something of this sort:
https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/pr...oduct=THERMAX6

[iugrad92turbo]

Simple enough design.

[PieEyedPiper]

Originally Posted by 99gst_racer

I have one sitting here on my desk, but I believe it's live inventory, not a sample, so they probably wouldn't let me send it out for free to be tested.

I'm curious though; how would you go about testing something like this?



The inline blowers that I sell range from 140 CFM to 240 CFM depending on length and diameter. I have no clue what kind of CFM one of these Ultra Cool fans moves.

I only have basic measurements of it. It's roughly 11.625" in diameter and an overall thickness of about 2".

My instincts tell me that this product should be able to hit those kinds of numbers or greater. I was thinking we'd see something around 1600rpm @ 80mph. You blowers surely spin much faster but they need to due to not being 12" across.

I dunno, I think they're neat.

[bmoha7321]

Directionally vaned rotors work similar to these?
TCE offers directionally vaned rotors. I was told they make a difference over a traditional OEM straight vaned rotor.
I couldn't see 1G or 2G swirlies do much of anything.
I'm trying to remember the supercar I saw it on... but one of the newest hypercars has a piece that bolts to the outside surface of the wheel that grabs air and forces it thru the spokes of the wheel... Straight thru to the vanes of the brake rotors. It was pretty neat.
Also I read that titanium is widely used. As titanium is terrible at heat transfer. They put a spacer block of titanium between the brake pad and the brake caliper to help keep the heat in the rotor and pad and not in the brake fluid.
Also I'd swear I just read somewhere that a newer supercar has fluid cooled brake rotors. Positive of it.

[PieEyedPiper]

Originally Posted by bmoha7321

Directionally vaned rotors work similar to these?
TCE offers directionally vaned rotors. I was told they make a difference over a traditional OEM straight vaned rotor.
I couldn't see 1G or 2G swirlies do much of anything.
I'm trying to remember the supercar I saw it on... but one of the newest hypercars has a piece that bolts to the outside surface of the wheel that grabs air and forces it thru the spokes of the wheel... Straight thru to the vanes of the brake rotors. It was pretty neat.
Also I read that titanium is widely used. As titanium is terrible at heat transfer. They put a spacer block of titanium between the brake pad and the brake caliper to help keep the heat in the rotor and pad and not in the brake fluid.
Also I'd swear I just read somewhere that a newer supercar has fluid cooled brake rotors. Positive of it.

It's the lambo.
http://forgiato.com/blog/tag/lamborg...venton-wheels/ this appears to be a different attempt at this idea. The reventon has something different on it when I saw it on top gear. At least I think so, my memory.. well yeah.

Ah, here we go:

[bmoha7321]

Not the ones I saw. I think the ones I saw were on a Konigess. er However you spell that company. Maybe Porsche. I forget. It was actually a dish that bolted on to the face of the wheel. that stuck out slightly farther than the edge of the rim. So as it drove down the road the leading edge would grab passing air and cram it thru the center of the brake rotor. Real neat.