Gain or Loss?

[GSTdude06]

Would a 1g sheet metal intake be more of a gain or a loss on my 97 GST 7 Bolt motor?
I just recently came across a great deal on a used one. But if it would be a lose I wont go after it.

 

[Slippi84]

It depends when are you shifting what kinda setup are we talkin here. I wouldn't do it if you don't plan on going past the stock rev limiter. Not to mention that you always want to do cams before you do smim.

 

[v2ner]

Seeing that your car is somewhat mildly modded, you won't need it. An upgraded IM should be one of the last mods on your list to do as most people on here will never need it. Even with this said, it will still be a gain to you...only because the 2G IM is so restrictive. Upgrading the IM is mainly for those with a huge turbo and are looking to rev beyond 7500 RPMs. It's up to you. Good luck.

 

[92awddsm]

It will be more of a loss than a gain 1) the 14b will fall off before the smim will start working.
2) Without porting the head to match the 1g smim ports, the air runs into a wall on the transition and overall, the flow will be worse.

 

[GSTdude06]

Well im going to go either EVOIII 16g or a T3/T4 turbo set up. But I can get cams easily to. Its either or.

 

[Slippi84]

It will be more of a loss than a gain 1) the 14b will fall off before the smim will start working.
2) Without porting the head to match the 1g smim ports, the air runs into a wall on the transition and overall, the flow will be worse.

This is not a completely true statement. The problem with this is not all SMIM's come with enlarged openings that you need to port the head. Like I know my dejon tool didn't. and two no smim is a loss it just moves the power band the same way cams do. You will make more power then you did before from like 6k to redline but the thing is you will loose some downlow and this is why what he said wasn't completely false. The thing is where do you plan on spinning your motor too. If it's not past the stock revlimiter then while you won't lose with the smim it will make your power band nmore narrow and in a diffrent area.

 

[92awddsm]

This is not a completely true statement. The problem with this is not all SMIM's come with enlarged openings that you need to port the head. Like I know my dejon tool didn't. and two no smim is a loss it just moves the power band the same way cams do. You will make more power then you did before from like 6k to redline but the thing is you will loose some downlow and this is why what he said wasn't completely false. The thing is where do you plan on spinning your motor too. If it's not past the stock revlimiter then while you won't lose with the smim it will make your power band nmore narrow and in a diffrent area.

Show me a 6 bolt 1g smim that has ports that match a 2g head and I will retract my statement. Until then, this stands true. That is the reason 2g guys want to run a 1g manifold and have to have the head ported to match.

 

[pnishr]

This is not a completely true statement. The problem with this is not all SMIM's come with enlarged openings that you need to port the head.

But, if it's a 1G manifold, it'll be made to fit a 1G head. The 2G head has smaller ports, so, at the end of the runners, the air will hit a wall.

 

[mirkoelek]

Show me a 6 bolt 1g smim that has ports that match a 2g head and I will retract my statement. Until then, this stands true. That is the reason 2g guys want to run a 1g manifold and have to have the head ported to match.

You are right here. Why put a bigger IM when the head cannot take it. Only, when you port your head and add some good cams, then you should upgrade to SMIM... i dont have it but i know what it does. Other then that, 2g IM and head are perfect flow for Evo16g...You can get a 1g TB and port the your stock IM next to the TB. THis will give you some gains...

 

[GSTdude06]

I already have a 1g TB and my manifold is ported. I can either get a T3/T4 right now. Or get HKS Cams and a EVOIII 16g.

 

[mirkoelek]

I already have a 1g TB and my manifold is ported. I can either get a T3/T4 right now. Or get HKS Cams and a EVOIII 16g.

Like i said, if you go with Evo16g dont make any changes (just waiste of money, and it will even perform better with stock head and IM)... Anything bigger, like you said t3/t4 (be more specific), stock head will hold you back...

 

[Slippi84]

Show me a 6 bolt 1g smim that has ports that match a 2g head and I will retract my statement. Until then, this stands true. That is the reason 2g guys want to run a 1g manifold and have to have the head ported to match.

Ok I thought you were saying that smims loose power over stock manifolds with a 14b. Yes the stock 2g ports are smaller than the 1g ports but will still make more power than the stocker. Show me a situation where a smim didn't make more peak power than a stocker and i will retract that statement.

 

[GSTdude06]

I want to get to at LEAST 350whp, which set up should I do?

 

[Slippi84]

I want to get to at LEAST 350whp, which set up should I do?

16g 2g ported exhaust manifold 264/272 combo and the smim is your choice. If it's a drag car I would do it if it's more aof a dd and just fun car that will see more road corse type racing and such stick with the stocker.

 

[mirkoelek]

16g 2g ported exhaust manifold 264/272 combo and the smim is your choice. If it's a drag car I would do it if it's more aof a dd and just fun car that will see more road corse type racing and such stick with the stocker.

I agree with cams, but not with SMIM. He has to get 1g head, new HG, studs, + SMIM + cams.... its a lot of money for minimu gains , maybe no gain at all.
350whp wont be as easy with evo16, but not unreachable. You have to have other things done too.

 

[Slippi84]

I agree with cams, but not with SMIM. He has to get 1g head, new HG, studs, + SMIM + cams.... its a lot of money for minimu gains , maybe no gain at all

I didn't say 1g smim I just said smim

 

[mirkoelek]

I didn't say 1g smim I just said smim

Ok, he could get a 2g SMIM...Not worthed

 

[daren_p]

I agree with what 92awddsm has said. Forget about the 1g shim and grab and evoIII and 264/272 or straight up 272's and you will see a nice bump in power through the hole power band. Your next issue will be traction

 

[92awddsm]

Show me a situation where a smim didn't make more peak power than a stocker and i will retract that statement.

When you add a 1g smim(which is what he was asking about) to a unported 2g head.

Anyway, you can reach the 350 awhp mark on the stock intake manifold without any issues at all. The evo 3 and cams can get you there and a little further but not by much. If you decide you want more power later, you wwill end up having to get a larger turbo because the 16g will be close to maxxed out.

As far as the smim, you really dont need it untill you are over the 400hp mark. Before then, the gains will be very little if any. Nothing at all will be noticed untill after 6-6500 rpm.

 

[GSTdude06]

So should I grab the cams then get the T3/T4? Cause I want to have flex in my hp range...not just have a maxed 16g

 

[mirkoelek]

So should I grab the cams then get the T3/T4? Cause I want to have flex in my hp range...not just have a maxed 16g

I would do it, but be ready to spend good amount of money, to make that turbo do what is capable of doing... Still not sure what do you mean by T3/T4, there are turbos that are specificly built for dsm and there are bolt on... check

http://linux.forcedperformance.net/...en=CTGY&Store_Code=FP&Category_Code=DSM-Turbo

You should look into fp3052 or even fp3065 for more power....

 

[GSTdude06]

Thats a great shop, about 30 min from me to..... I have money no problem, just cant buy everything at once, im only 18. Ill look into those, ill try and get the cams im not sure if they are still for sale.

 

[mirkoelek]

Thats a great shop, about 30 min from me to..... I have money no problem, just cant buy everything at once, im only 18. Ill look into those, ill try and get the cams im not sure if they are still for sale.

There are 30min away from your house? : and you're just mentioning that now.
Those guys are great on the phone, i wonder how they would be in person.

Yep, definetelly they will help you for sure...

 

[GSTdude06]

ya they are in mckinney tx im n mesquite tx.........down 2 highways

ima get the cams then check on a bigger turbo.... i kinda want a dsmlink before the turbo so I can get full power....SAFC is only good for 650cc's I thought

 

[mirkoelek]

ya they are in mckinney tx im n mesquite tx.........down 2 highways

ima get the cams then check on a bigger turbo.... i kinda want a dsmlink before the turbo so I can get full power....SAFC is only good for 650cc's I thought

DSMLINK all the way.....From personal experience, SAFC is limited POS, but DSMLINK , there is not a thing that you cannot do with it. There are still updating, but i really dont know what is there to update....It will perfectly suit you if you go with one of the fp turbos.