External Wastegate ???

[ALLeyesONmyGSX]

so i have a ported evoIII turbo, ported exhaust manifold... ported o2 dump... (all additional mods are my vechile profile) and i still have a major creep problem... im using the profec B spec II boost controller... now i know evoIII turbos do tend to creep... i have it set @ 12 PSI on low boost and @ redline im hitting 24 psi... the reading is accurate because the manual boost gauge and the electric reading on the profec's screen is the same... is it just the turbo or is it the boost controller ? ... would an external wastegate ultimatly gauranteed stop my creeping problem... ? how would well would it function with my set up, and what "mm" should i be looking to get... thanks

 

[oldman]

Whom and how was the turbo ported?

 

[WatchItExplode]

The profec-b spec II does not work well with 4G63's (as for why they don't, I couldn't tell you). Have you ever tried a different boost controller? If so, what were your results?

 

[Mackzero]

Turn the boost controller off, and see what boost you get. Then you will know if it is a controller problem, you could have switched a couple of the vac lines up when you installed it.

 

[DSM90AWD]

... would an external wastegate ultimatly gauranteed stop my creeping problem... ? how would well would it function with my set up, and what "mm" should i be looking to get... thanks

3" Exhausts are notorious for boost creep. To answer your question on externals, yes, you will no longer creep with 100% certainty if installed correctly.

Then again, if you port your W/G passage correctly on your 16G, you can eliminate some or all of the creep, but will never be as effective as an external.

So if you want to eliminate creep forever and never have to worry about it the next time you upgrade your turbo, spend the money now and forever be creepless

 

[ALLeyesONmyGSX]

i have wired of the Profec B... (the old school one with 3 knobs...) and i had the exact same results... Sloy Boy racing did the porting jobs... i have also made an attempt at turning to boost controller off to see if it returns to stock boost--- it doesnt... i still hit about 24 psi.... do u guys think the external is my only option considering im planning on going with a bigger setup soon, and keeping the 3" downpipe... ? how many "mm" am i looking for ? thanks...

 

[oldmopwater]

I have 46mm and it works great.

 

[Mitchel63]

You only need a large wastegate if you are running low boost on a big turbo. I run an old Tial 35mm and it has been great on every turbo I have had. As long as you aren't tryin to run 10psi on a 65lb/min turbo, any external gate will do.

Also, why only 12psi on the E16G.......that is just asking for creep anyway.

 

[ALLeyesONmyGSX]

if its set at stock boost 12psi... or 13psi... or 15psi... or 20 psi... regardless of the setting... it'll increase uncontrollably... im leaning towards the 35mm external wastegate by tial... hopefully this would control my ongoing problem... what do you guys think ?

 

[DSM90AWD]

im leaning towards the 35mm external wastegate by tial...

FYI.. Tial replaced the 35mm with the 38mm a couple years ago but can find a used 35mm dirt cheep if you look hard enough. They do share the same flanges though

 

[oldman]

what do you guys think ?

I think your turbo was not properly ported for the purpose of boost creep and it needs to be ported again. If money isn't an issue and you're prepare to deal with loud external dump and higher underhood temperature, go with an external mounted on the manifold. If you're like me who like the sleeper look, post back and I will show you what and where needs to be ported.

 

[ALLeyesONmyGSX]

sleeper it is... the body of my car is totally stock... except the exhaust and the FMIC kinda gives it away, but i dont mind the loud scream of the external wastegate (considering i have an o2 dump now) ... do you believe i should re-port my turbo and run it internally gated, as it is now--- or save money from the porting, and get a tial 38mm wastegate and hope to solve my problem... ?

 

[oldman]

do you believe i should re-port my turbo and run it internally gated, as it is now--- or save money from the porting, and get a tial 38mm wastegate and hope to solve my problem... ?

I was talking about porting it yourself, sounds intimidating but it's actually quite easy and additive once you get started. The cost of tools required would be no more than $40. The best part about porting it is that you'll end up improving flow and spool all at the same time. Read through this thread, he also started off with a sbr ported EVO3 just like you. If this is something you're interested in doing, I'll help you through the entire process like I did with him.

 

[project_tsi]

OK guys. After doing all the porting and modding work that I could possibly have done, I will be converting to external this winter.

With my setup I had a ported SBR manifold, ported Bullseye turbine housing, a new high pressure actuator w/ bullseye 38mm internal flapper. I also had a 2.5" tubular o2 housing w/ 1.5" o2 dump, along w/ full 3" exhaust w/ no cat. Everything that I ported myself was done correctly. I just feel that everything is flowing so well, that the internal gate is just not enough. I would creep from 20 to 28psi and it was horrible. Shit, I even did the mod to the internal wg housing to allow it to extend out a full 45* and open straight up. Sure, as I did mods and changed to the higher pressure actuator I started to keep boost a little better, but still it wasn't worth the trouble.

So now, this winter a Tial 38mm WG mounted on the manifold is in store for me. I will be welding shut the 38mm flapper, and saying goodbye to boost creep.

 

[ALLeyesONmyGSX]

w/ out doing any additional porting... would slapping on an external wastegate completely SOLVE my problem ?

 

[oldman]

Yes, but only if it's mounted on the manifold. An o2 mount will still be limited to the same restrictions as you have now, the entrance to the wastegate path located in the turbine inlet.

 

[oldman]

You should still port match both the manifold and turbine to a 7cm gasket even if you decide to with an external, best free mod ever.

 

[DSM90AWD]

So now, this winter a Tial 38mm WG mounted on the manifold is in store for me. I will be welding shut the 38mm flapper, and saying goodbye to boost creep.

ah-men brother

I've a 3" exhaust lying in my garage waiting to be installed and can guarantee you I will be creeping (much better flowing than my press-bent Buschur 2.5" system) so saving up for a proper external to go with it.

BTW, a "quiet" external setup is very easy. Just plumb the dump back into your downpipe at a 45deg angle using a 1.5" ID exhaust bend with/without flexible SS tubing

 

[oldman]

That's none sense John , ship back my o2 along with your turbine and manifold, I'll guarantee you will not creep with a 3" setup. If it doesn't work, I will buy the external for you for Christmas. If it works, you buy me DSMlink for Christmas.

 

[DSM90AWD]

w/ out doing any additional porting... would slapping on an external wastegate completely SOLVE my problem ?

If O2 housing mounted you will need to remove your flapper door mechanism and weld the hole for the arm passthru. This alone frees up alot of restriction, but would normally take it a step further and enlarge the wastegate hole and profile the entry way to the WG passage.

If manifold mounted, simply have the WG flapper welded in place and you're done

 

[DSM90AWD]

That's none sense John , ship back my o2 along with your turbine and manifold, I'll guarantee you will not creep with a 3" setup. If it doesn't work, I will buy the external for you for Christmas. If it works, you buy me DSMlink for Christmas.

Tempting, as Ken ported the hell out of his O2/turbine/manifold and creeped with his "small16G" and that same 3" exhaust. Though knowing you, after I win you'd send me some $20 eBay Tial clone that would explode when I hit 10psi

An aside, I've NEVER in 13years of DSM forum lurking heard someone regret going external, on the contrary mainly hear "why the f---k didn't I listen in the first place"

 

[oldman]

Damn it, there goes my DSMlink.

 

[project_tsi]

An aside, I've NEVER in 13years of DSM forum lurking heard someone regret going external, on the contrary mainly hear "why the f---k didn't I listen in the first place"

I know what you are saying. After spending $85 for a high pressure actuator (supposedly rated at 30psi), and the hours of porting and the money spent on a tubular o2 housing w/ dump, I wish I would have went external in the first place. But all in all, Im going external now, but am still glad I ported everthing.

Oh Bruce, when you do get DSMLink, you will love it.

 

[oldman]

Oh Bruce, when you do get DSMLink, you will love it.

How about you Dan, want to send me your stuff? I really want DSMLink.

 

[ALLeyesONmyGSX]

Spring Pressure:....
0.25 bar (3.63 psi)-- 0.4 bar (5.80 psi)-- 0.5 bar (7.25 psi)-- 0.6 bar (8.70 psi)-- 0.7 bar (10.15 psi)-- 0.8 bar (11.60 psi)-- .9 bar (13.05 psi) -- 1.0 bar (14.5 psi)


which one do i go with... and how are these explained ?