Are These N/T UnderDrive Pulleys Really Good?

[bo0st]

Are These N/T UnderDrive Pulleys Really Good? I found it on ebay and it claims to add about 5 - 8 HP, what do you guys think?

95 96 97 98 99 Eclipse Non Turbo Underdrive Pulley NT @ : eBay Motors (item 120553668423 end time May-06-10 15:12:41 PDT)

How much would it be to get one of these professionally installed?

 

[Boosted_talon98]

Are These N/T UnderDrive Pulleys Really Good? I found it on ebay and it claims to add about 5 - 8 HP, what do you guys think?

95 96 97 98 99 Eclipse Non Turbo Underdrive Pulley NT @ : eBay Motors (item 120553668423 end time May-06-10 15:12:41 PDT)

How much would it be to get one of these professionally installed?

I bought one .. If you know how to work on your car at all then def do it yourself because a shop will charge you alot...The engine has to be lowered a few inches and a shop will labor out the arse

If you are gonna pay a shop to do it then buy a new timing belt and water pump and have them do that if you need to save some money later on.

 

[nothingfiction]

underdrive pulleys are good... BUT make sure you get one from a company that actually does research and development on their products. the one in the add i would not get!!! it looks nothing like the one i have, its from n un-named source, they dont even know where its from nor that it will actually fit your car. don't get something as important as a pulley or gear or anything that spins on unknown and untrusted sources. do your homework, dig up information. if you could find something from AF/X or unorthodox or some other company that actually tests their products, i would highly suggest going that route. Who's to say this products has even been balanced? if it spins it needs research and development and balancing especially something as critical as the alternator pulley.

This is the same argument over are obx products any good. they sell it, but they don't research it. just make a cheap knock off from another brand. if your looking into exhaust go for it how bad can you mess up there. but a belt pulley could seriously damage your engine if made cheap and unbalanced. Then to add the thought of bad installation. Say hello engine rebuild.

it's your money, do what you will. you may get lucky. me personally, i only trust products that have been thoroughly tested.

Good luck.

 

[bo0st]

Thanks for the quick replies guys. Is there any negatives to installing one of these?

I heard someone say that it will suck away power from my A/C is this true?

Thanks,

bo0st

 

[nothingfiction]

installing an underdrive pulley, you are really shrinking to a different size pulley, so you will need a different size belt for it. Since the underdrive pulley weighs less (significantly... about 7 pounds for stock, 1.5 for aftermarket) it takes less effort for your engine to spin the pulley. However you will have a little loss of power in some functions (your ac won't be as powerful, your alternator wont charge you battery at the same speed) but you shouldn't notice that at all. Depending on who makes it that is. if you get a cheap one it could be made out of cheap aluminum and the ridges can break, the belt may walk, it may not be harmonically balanced and chews up your belts like candy. But a good one will be researched how much loss (ac power and such) is acceptable yet still functional.

the majority of the 2GNT i have seen (including myself) run the AF/X underdrive pulley and all (even me) swear up and down by it. Just google it. Howell Automative doesn't list it on their site anymore but AF/X says their still an authorized dealer, so i would call Howell up and ask them about it.

if you plan to take this to get professionally done... Just so you know, it's a quick 20 minute job, you will be charged for an hour worth of work. Price shop around who can do it.

 

[96_killer]

I'am running the same cheap ebay UDP on both my cars for a bout 3+ years now and never had a problem. i never expected to be running them for this long they were only temporary until i could get some name brand ones, but i will keep them. for me the A/C feels the same, very important that your A/C works down here in the south!! as you know... not really any performance gains but you will see your engine rev quicker and decelerate faster, this should be one of the first up grades that should be done...

 

[david-b]

I've been running one for about 4 years now. Never had a single problem with it. I cracked the edges when Was pulling it off the last time and bought another one for dirt cheap and this one is good just as well.

 

[LD25Delta9]

Just make sure there isn't any wobble going on after you install it. If you do have some wobble going on take it to your local machine shop and have them balance it. shouldn't be much more than 20 bucks. Since I removed my PS and AC, I took mine to one and had them grind off the ACC belt ridge and had them balance it. By the way you'll need the chrysler specific harmonic balancer pulley to pull it.

 

[Boosted_talon98]

I took mine to one and had them grind off the ACC belt ridge and had them balance it.

what does that look like???

 

[bo0st]

not really any performance gains but you will see your engine rev quicker and decelerate faster, this should be one of the first up grades that should be done...

So you didn't notice any performance gains at all? Is it even worth it than guys?

 

[96_killer]

@boOst>>YES you should...you will notice a difference in how much faster you're throttle response will be or engine response. it will decrease the load on your engine and thous responding to you better(rev up quicker) hp will be small at max around 4hp i say(depends on other mods)... and a mod you should get!!

 

[nothingfiction]

they are beneficial as they relieve strain on your engine.
a underdrive pulley simply just makes your engine work less to run all of your accessories.

if you want something more that you can "feel" upgrade your throttle body to 55mm. if you upgrade to a 60 mm you will lose horsepower because too much air pushed into a naturally aspirated engine without other supporting mods (oversized pistons, valve job, ect) kils horsepower.

if you want some good advice over the underdrive pulley check this out...
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/169294-underdrive-pulleys-merged-1-6-07-a-3.html
Skip all of the 4G63 turbo talk... About half way down you will see "AF/X UnderDrive Pulley" POST 79
Start from there and continue reading. it goes on until POST 97

Given... this is just one brand alone. You can chose your own brand. But on the 420A they are worth it.
Feel free to try to read the whole thread just keep this in mind...

Due to this being a compiled thread (multiple threads on the same subject turned into one very large thread) there is a lot of 4G63 talk, and they fail to realize that even though underdrive pulleys are good for us, they seem to be bad for them and don't bother checking or caring if you have the 420A or not they assume you have the 4G and you're a retarded ass.

the 420A UDP is a single pulley without a harmonic balancer (because either it's built inside the crank already or we just don't have one.
the 4G63 UDP is a 2 piece pulley with a harmonic balancer that likes to separate from each other destroying their engine.

there's many pages. just sift thru it. the amount of HP you free up is only relevant/limited to whatever supporting mods you have. Don't expect to get 10-15 HP out of them. if your car is bone stock be amazed if you get 2HP out of them. 10-15 more horse is possible with other mods. But that goes without saying. Any mod you do will be beneficial and work with future/past mods.

think of it this way... You put headers on your car, sure it will increase HP but it bottlenecks into the cat and the rest of the exhaust. You get a cat-back exhaust, now the only bottle neck is the cat. You get a hi-flow cat and now you have all off those ponies free. Let's just say that you get a cold air intake. Yes you increase HP but not by much because it still gets trapped at the throttlebody. You upgrade your TB now your pushing more air in, but your intake manifold can only hold so much air. So you bore out your IM, now you free up more horses. Sure you can do just one of these little mods but you won't "feel" much until you complete the circuit. Do you follow me?

in a nutshell...
Tech Guide: 2G 420A Power Upgrades - DSMtuners

01: Air Intake
Replace your stock air box with a solid pipe and high-flow cone filter.
02: Cat-back Exhaust
Replace your stock cat-back exhaust with a higher flowing model.
03: High Flow Cat
Replace your stock catalytic converter with a higher flowing model.
04: Exhaust Header
Replace your factory exhaust manifold with a tubular steel header.
05: Bored-out Throttle Body
Increase the opening on your throttle body to increase air intake.
06: Ported Intake Manifold
Further increases air intake.
07: Camshafts and Cam Gears
Agressive camshafts and cam gears allow for more power through timing adjustment.
08: Underdrive Pulleys
Underdrive pulleys can be added at the same time to reduce weight, which means the engine will work less to drive the accessory belts.
09: Cylinder Head Porting
Greatly increase air flow through the cylinder head. You may need to compensate with more fuel, which means you'll need an aftermarket Air/Fuel Controller.
10: Air/Fuel Controller
Allows tune-ability of the air/fuel mixture to avoid detonation and major engine damage.
11: Ignition Timing Controller
Allows you to control the timing.

Given it lists the UDP as #8, this is more of a guide as to when you will feel the most out of each step.
When you have completed the previous 7, that's when you will really notice how much of a difference it makes. Not saying only to do it then, but that's when you may get that 10-15 HP just from the UDP.

 

[Fotowntalon]

i believe they have it listed number 8 for simplicity in installation, if you are doing the cams, you already have your harmonic balancer off, so perfect time to change it. I'd almost recommend if first for your car, it can actually increase the life of your AC/PS, if you have them.

 

[nothingfiction]

maybe that could be, but i think a throttlebody swap (or work in general) is easier than doing all that exhaust work and dealing with old rusted bolts and clearance issues of having to be able to get under your car in general. if it was by what's easiest i think the list would be more like

air intake
bored out throttlebody
headers
underdrive pulley
catback
cat
intake manifold
ect

the underdrive pulley isn't hard to get off and you dont need a special chrysler tool as some say (unless my dads was chrysler and he couldn't remember). But taking this off and replacing it was a very easy job compared to just doing my catback and torching bolts off and such. so i doubt its what's easier. but what do i know.

 

[Locke]

if you upgrade to a 60 mm you will lose horsepower because too much air pushed into a naturally aspirated engine without other supporting mods (oversized pistons, valve job, ect) kils horsepower.

The purpose of a throttle body is to allow airflow to be variably restricted. It limits airflow. Unlike other areas of the engine, velocity through the throttle body has a far smaller (if not nil) effect on positive engine performance.

On carburetors velocity is extremely important, as velocity must be proportionate to the size of the venturi and fuel jets to meter the proper amount of fuel. On our fuel injected engines, airflow calculation done by the ECU take data from the MAP and IAT (amongst others that aren't relevant here) sensors which are located in the intake plenum, meaning the measure is taken after the throttle-body. Having the maximum volume of air available to the runners will allow the maximum amount of air into the motor. The self-charging effect caused by high velocity air within the runners and intake ports during valve overlap (similarly inverse to the scavenging effect in the exhaust side) is limited by the volume of air in the plenum and the ability for the throttle body to supply (or restrict when not WOT) air into the plenum.

At WOT, you want as little vacuum as possible. Vacuum indicates a restriction, meaning the engine is trying to pump in more air than is available.

OEM's use small throttle bodies to limit the maximum power a motor will make.



Hmmm, what a scrambled mess of thoughts. I hope it is understandable.

 

[nothingfiction]

i stand corrected. Must be some other BS i have read a thousand times on here i guess or i would have went with the 60mm (...assuming i am reading what you wrote correctly)

 

[LD25Delta9]

what does that look like???

I'll be updating my blog here soon and I'll have ALOT of pics. I just finally finished up with finals this week, so I should be able to get to work on my checklist within the next 2 weeks.

 

[bo0st]

Thanks for all the information everyone, I really appreciate everyone's time. So what do you guys think about this pair:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Unorthodox-Underdrive-Ultra-SS-Crank-Pulley-Set-Eclipse-/200467087558?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2eacc500c6

It's $324.99 but it look's pretty good to me.. What do you veterans think?

 

[1995eternal]

doesnt the application say its for a turbo 2.0? I thought you had N/T?

Why dont you go with the AF/X that everyone else is running... Its a lot cheaper, not off ebay, and comes with the belt....

AF/X 30% Underdrive Pulley 2.0 Diamondstar - AFXDSP95S

 

[Diamondrev]

Here! before you pay wayyyy to much for the wrong product.

Remember turbo and nt parts dont mix...

Unorthodox Crank Pulley 95-99 Eclipse/Talon 420a

 

[nothingfiction]

doesnt the application say its for a turbo 2.0? I thought you had N/T?

Why dont you go with the AF/X that everyone else is running... Its a lot cheaper, not off ebay, and comes with the belt....

AF/X 30% Underdrive Pulley 2.0 Diamondstar - AFXDSP95S

Dude. i spent the better part of a week looking for that link! How did you find it? Or did they just re-list it or something?

 

[bo0st]

Ah I didnt see the turbo there before posting.

I'll check out that other link, thanks man.

 

[1995eternal]

Dude. i spent the better part of a week looking for that link! How did you find it? Or did they just re-list it or something?

haha I spent the better part of a week researching underdrive pulley's. I found that link in an old thread about the AF/X pulley, so I added it to my favorites list because I plan on getting it soon.

 

[bo0st]

So a shop would charge me for about an hour of labor right guys? So that should be around $50 - $200 depending on my hook ups?

 

[nothingfiction]

At the Satan Stealership it should be about 60 bucks (just called them)
Add an oil change on for a total of $92.

...but that will very from location to location.