420a engine rebuild

[420aNEWB]

if i order stndard size it will will exactly the stock size right? <a href="http://imageshack.us"><img src="http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/9793/newbitmapimage3qz1.png" border="0" alt="Image Hosted by ImageShack.us"/></a><br/><a href="http://g.imageshack.us/img223/newbitmapimage3qz1.png/1/"><img src="http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/newbitmapimage3qz1.png/1/w485.png" border="0"></a>

 

[bane3d]

Do your research. If you are looking for a spoon fed solution, you will end up spending way too much money. Try 2GNT.com - home for one place and start determining your budget. Then keep reading up as much as possible. You won't trully learn until you pop the hood and start putting in some wrench time.

d

 

[mnr88talon]

hollllllllllaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa 420A!!!!

im kinda wasted right now but check out modernperformance.com... they have alot of 420A internals

 

[allwheeldrizive]

Figure out what kind of build you want to do, such as a N/a or a turbo'd 420A.

Oh and just so you know they make different sets of wiesco pistons for your car, as far as the bore and compression. So again figure out what kind of build you want to do to it. And what kind of goals you wamt to have for it as far as 1/4 times and or HP #'s.

 

[420aNEWB]

Figure out what kind of build you want to do, such as a N/a or a turbo'd 420A.

Oh and just so you know they make different sets of wiesco pistons for your car, as far as the bore and compression. So again figure out what kind of build you want to do to it. And what kind of goals you wamt to have for it as far as 1/4 times and or HP #'s.

forget about the 300hp maybe 200? haha!

 

[420aNEWB]

Modern Performance Racing Products is this one good or can i get it cheaper? im tryingto save up as much as i can

 

[bane3d]

300HP max?!!!! Save your nt for your daily driver and go buy a gst or gsx. It'll be cheaper to meet your goals with that as a starting point.

d

 

[420aNEWB]

hollllllllllaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa 420A!!!!

im kinda wasted right now but check out modernperformance.com... they have alot of 420A internals

300HP max?!!!! Save your nt for your daily driver and go buy a gst or gsx. It'll be cheaper to meet your goals with that as a starting point.

d

maybe not 300hp but i just want a good running motor and one that can handle a decent turbo

 

[red97tib]

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/art...uild-420a-stage-2-turbo-kit-under-1000-a.html
This is a link for building a cheap but effecient turbo kit. Another good place for 420A parts is CI Motorsports in our vendor section. A good way to learn is to just start opening random threads in the 420A section and reading them. May seem pointless if it doesn't relate to what you are doing, but you may run into it in the future. And please don't give this to a mechanic and say have fun, you will truly get nothing out of this. Oh, bane3d, I believe Luda posted something a while back asking people not to come into the 420A sections and telling us to just go by turbo cars.

 

[rstare]

4g63 owners,
STOP telling people just to sell their 420a and get a 4g63. The 420a is just as capable as the 4g63, it may take a little more work, but its just as capable, when your talking about 300hp

OP, if you want 300hp you pretty much need to go turbo. So do some research on turboing the 420a. You can probably get 300 crank hp, without a built bottom end. But 300whp your probably looking at getting a built bottom end.

slowboyracing.com
howellautomotive.com
and especially..
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/search.php

 

[rstare]

For 4g63 guys
--->http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/420...-read-before-you-post-420a-forums-warned.html

 

[bane3d]

That's fine. The only reason I made my suggestion is the 300HP reply from him. I believe it would easier and cheaper for someone to make that kind of HP from a GST or GSX. If the goal was a fun unique car that has some go, then the recommendation would have been turbo the NT.

I personally like the idea of a 200-250HP NT w/ turbo. Hitting that 300HP range can be difficult for many on an NT car and there is a clear upgrade path on the GST/GSX to hit that mark with plenty of support.

Now if he was just throwing a number out there, then the answer would be to research, put together a budget, put together a project plan, and build towards that. I apologize if it sounded like some pompous answer of "You'll never reach those goals in an NT." I fully believe that the 420A has just as much potential in it as the 4G63. It's just that it seems like most of the people that are able to get that performance out of an NT are people who know their cars inside and out.

Judging by his amount of posts and the general tone of his questions, I'd say he is relatively new to the scene and doesn't know the pros and cons of each kind of car yet. This is definitely the right community to learn, but just don't jump in and start modding first. Research, maintenance, and planning is a must or you are likely to have a half-finished project that you are forced to sell. I know I've made many mistakes on my car and I would not wish that on anyone. Still, all in all, it's a lessoned learned.

d

 

[420aNEWB]

4g63 owners,
STOP telling people just to sell their 420a and get a 4g63. The 420a is just as capable as the 4g63, it may take a little more work, but its just as capable, when your talking about 300hp

OP, if you want 300hp you pretty much need to go turbo. So do some research on turboing the 420a. You can probably get 300 crank hp, without a built bottom end. But 300whp your probably looking at getting a built bottom end.

slowboyracing.com
howellautomotive.com
and especially..
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/search.php

yes i know i have to go turbo but first im going to build the engine to withstand the turbo bottom end u mean pistons and rods right? and top end is crankshaft right?

 

[tegster1]

I must say I agree completely with bane3d. First off, he didnt say to sell it, just to use it as a dd which makes sense considering the OP just wants to hand everything to his mechanic and let him do everything. I dont think he realizes what all is involved with it and if something goes wrong, he will just give up and sell the car to some other kid. There have been many many many topics regarding brands and what you need to turbo your 420a so he obviously didnt search well.

I usually dont like it when someone just responds by saying "search," but since all he wants to do is hand it over to a mechanic and not even try to figure things out or learn how anything works by himself, he should probably buy a 4g63 and there ya go. Instant power without even having to take it to a mechanic.

 

[420aNEWB]

I must say I agree completely with bane3d. First off, he didnt say to sell it, just to use it as a dd which makes sense considering the OP just wants to hand everything to his mechanic and let him do everything. I dont think he realizes what all is involved with it and if something goes wrong, he will just give up and sell the car to some other kid. There have been many many many topics regarding brands and what you need to turbo your 420a so he obviously didnt search well.

I usually dont like it when someone just responds by saying "search," but since all he wants to do is hand it over to a mechanic and not even try to figure things out or learn how anything works by himself, he should probably buy a 4g63 and there ya go. Instand power without even having to take it to a mechanic.

well i dont really know much about mechanics thats why im saying i would just give him the stuff to put it on i think i would mess up the car if I would put it on myself you think i can do this work on my backyard?

 

[tegster1]

Giving it to a mechanic is fine. A lot of people have to do that because of space, time, mechanics, etc.. but adding a turbo to a n/t car involves more than just installing and driving it forever without having to do anything. Most people who do it themselves learn A LOT such as myself. I have learned more by doing things myself than I ever could if I took it somewhere to have done.

There have been a few threads started regarding turbo kits/parts in just the last few weeks so they are up at the top of the turbo section as long as bolt-on section. I rebuilt my engine last year just on reading alone. I didnt make one post regarding how to do anything because it was already answered and I knew I would learn more by reading. As you can see I have only 62 posts...this making 63, ha, and I have been here for almost 4 yrs.

I am also planning on putting a turbo on my car of which I am hoping to be doing this next week but it took a while to learn how things work and the parts I wanted/needed for the best price and so they all work with each other. I still have tons to learn about having a turbo of which will come, but thats why I am keeping it basic for now until I learn what I need in order to push it further. Going from 140hp to 300hp isnt easy and if something breaks you better be prepared just a fyi.

 

[420aNEWB]

Giving it to a mechanic is fine. A lot of people have to do that because of space, time, mechanics, etc.. but adding a turbo to a n/t car involves more than just installing and driving it forever without having to do anything. Most people who do it themselves learn A LOT such as myself. I have learned more by doing things myself than I ever could if I took it somewhere to have done.

There have been a few threads started regarding turbo kits/parts in just the last few weeks so they are up at the top of the turbo section as long as bolt-on section. I rebuilt my engine last year just on reading alone. I didnt make one post regarding how to do anything because it was already answered and I knew I would learn more by reading. As you can see I have only 62 posts...this making 63, ha, and I have been here for almost 4 yrs.

I am also planning on putting a turbo on my car of which I am hoping to be doing this next week but it took a while to learn how things work and the parts I wanted/needed for the best price and so they all work with each other. I still have tons to learn about having a turbo of which will come, but thats why I am keeping it basic for now until I learn what I need in order to push it further. Going from 140hp to 300hp isnt easy and if something breaks you better be prepared just a fyi.

how long did it take u to rebuilt it on your own?

 

[bane3d]

Thank you tegster1. I just didn't think 420ANewb really understood what he was getting in to. I hate it when people say, "Buy this part." or "Go to this performance shop". I've gotten bit by advising people by what to by in my profession and even though I tell them what can happen and to be wary, they still get mad when it happens to them. My advise is freely given and freely ignored, but I try to prevent/minimize people having to sink money in to a long shot. So 420ANewb lets do a quick flow chart:

1. Are you in your teenage years/this is one of your first vehicles?
If the answer is yes, then don't get attached to it. Just enjoy it while you have it and do your best to keep the maintenance/insurance/speeding tickets paid for. Don't play your stereo too loud because you will be saying "hunh" and "what" a lot after the age of 25 since you have hearing loss.

2. Do you have a wife or kids?
If yes, this is an expensive hobby, maybe you should take up horseshoes.

3. Do you have your own garage and your own set of tools?
If no, I hope you get paid well and you are going to buy a cheap beater for when your car is not running.

4. Do you have patience and a true love of cars?
If yes, then take your time, research, do the maintenance, put together a budget, put together a project plan with plenty of padding because it will ALWAYS COST MORE THAN YOU EXPECTED.

d

 

[420aNEWB]

yeah im 19 yes my first vehicle no i dun have my own garage nor tools and well i have to patience and no i dont get paid allot but i can save about 500$ a month or more because i live with parents and work and go to college and i know all the bad comments about the 420a engine but i think its better just to keep it and make it a project and no i dun have wife and kid not in the near future

 

[tegster1]

It took me about three months to take it out, rebuild it, and put it back in. That was a little longer than what it shouldve been since I had some complications with the machine shop that worked on my block. That took about an extra month or so. This was while I was working so not much got done during the weekdays, just during the weekends. It was also my first time so I took it nice and slow and didnt rush through things.

Ummm, the only bad comments about the 420a will come from the 4g63 guys. ha. Like I said, some people need to take it to a shop when they dont have the proper space, tools, etc. so in this case it would be wise to use one. 99% of us probably have one anyway just in case. But, you still should research into what you are buying and what will be going on your car so when its on you know whats happening. The shop can install it but you wont be able to rely on them all the time to maintain it.

 

[cs82685]

he should probably buy a 4g63 and there ya go. Instant power without even having to take it to a mechanic.

well i dont really know much about mechanics thats why im saying i would just give him the stuff to put it on i think i would mess up the car if I would put it on myself you think i can do this work on my backyard?

^you won't, everything except the machine work can be done in your backyard. There are people who have built their motors in their basements or living rooms. Personally, if I was you I'd invest in some tools and lots of research. Pull the motor out yourself. Bring the machine shop the block and let them build it so you don't have to worry about screwing it up. Then put it all back together yourself, then once you do that you'll know you'll be able to boost it on your own and will be able to fix problems.

I was in a similar situation a couple years ago. Wanted my timing belt changed, was too apprehensive to do it myself, took it to a mechanic. Long story short got the car back 3 months later with an oil leak and ####ed up timing so it idled like crap. I decided I was going to fix it myself and read all I could on replacing the headgasket (thought this was where the oil leak was comign from) and doing the timing. I pulled it apart, found the leak (turned out to be a cam seal). I put it all back together fixed the timing and it idled and ran like a champ after I was done with it. When I looked back, not one step was particularly a hard concept to grasp. It's just many steps and that's what makes it daunting. BTW I did all this in my parents driveway with a basic socket set, the necessary puller rented from autozone, and a borrowed torque wrench. You really don't need a lot of specialty tools to work on the car.

I've also boosted my car and by doing that yourself you will have a much better understanding of how the system works and will therefore be able to diagnose issues much better and fix them yourself instead of having to take the car back to a mechanic everytime there's a stupid little issue.


Oh and the bottom end is crank, rods, pistons. You don't replace the crank (you could if you want but there's not really a need) The head is your valvetrain (cams, valves, springs, retainers, etc.) You don't really need to do anything to the head as far as build wise because it's pretty decent to begin with. However, if you're having the motor rebuilt, you should have the machine shop resurface the head (i.e. make sure it's flat and if not they smooth it out so you don't run into problems with a HG leak

 

[Flipboi89]

hmm my advice is that you search alot and are willing to learn about the 420a. 300 bhp? you will need to upgrade your fuel system also. also it took me like 8 months to rebuild mine since i was so broke haha but if your have the money it will be alot faster.

 

[rstare]

Okay, sorry baned. Most 4g63 guys come in here and just say sell the 420a and buy the 4g63. I took your post the wrong way.
To the OP, im saying that you can run up to 14psi on the stock bottom end. (Not recommended for everyday, but im just stating whats been done). At that much boost you will be putting out 300 crank hp.
Its up to you if you want to rebuild it or not. Theres no downside to rebuilding it, except it costs money of course, but if your not shooting for high numbers then you dont really have to rebuild your bottom end.

 

[PCD_RS]

Dude, you're a poor college student. Don't think about making this a project car unless you gots the doh for a used beater. I'm working on rebuilding my bottom end right now and catching rides to and from work so if you really want to do this. THINK ABOUT IT FIRST!!! Don't get all hyped up about your brand spankin' new car (or used or whatever). If you do plan to turbo it, you're in for a helluva ride, man. There is so much that goes into it than just slapping on a turbo-kit. Next thing you know you get a little too boost happy and something goes wrong. You have fuel to account for (injectors, fuel lines, pump, FPR, FMU, SAFC, etc..) Oil feed/return lines, drilling and tapping, and more fun.

Like the guys have said already. DO YOUR RESEARCH!! I spent 2 years researching for my 96 RS (now turbo). RESEARCH! RESEARCH! RESEARCH! RESEARCH! It's your best friend! Other than that good luck!

 

[420aNEWB]

Dude, you're a poor college student. Don't think about making this a project car unless you gots the doh for a used beater. I'm working on rebuilding my bottom end right now and catching rides to and from work so if you really want to do this. THINK ABOUT IT FIRST!!! Don't get all hyped up about your brand spankin' new car (or used or whatever). If you do plan to turbo it, you're in for a helluva ride, man. There is so much that goes into it than just slapping on a turbo-kit. Next thing you know you get a little too boost happy and something goes wrong. You have fuel to account for (injectors, fuel lines, pump, FPR, FMU, SAFC, etc..) Oil feed/return lines, drilling and tapping, and more fun.

Like the guys have said already. DO YOUR RESEARCH!! I spent 2 years researching for my 96 RS (now turbo). RESEARCH! RESEARCH! RESEARCH! RESEARCH! It's your best friend! Other than that good luck!

so did u turbo it first instead of rebuilding?....thats what i understood