Critique My HX35 Setup

[WES_393]

Now that my suspension overhaul is complete, the time has come to replace this small 16g. It was fun while it lasted, but I want 450-500hp. However, I want to keep the spool quick and the price down (around $1.5K). What better option than an HX35? So I was hoping for some feedback on my parts list.

(Future Parts)
-Holset HX35 (8-blade)
-BEP .55 A/R housing (Clicky)
-MAP O2 housing w/ TS wastegate (Clicky)
-FP Oil Feed Line. Will feed from head, planning on using black filter/restrictor (Clicky)
-Oil drain adapter (1/2" NPT) and 3/4" hose barb Shown here. Then I'll just use the 3/4 hose that is already connecting my 16g and 2g oil pan.
-Cams. I was thinking 264's or 264/272 combo. I don't want to lose spool, but I don't want to choke the engine either. Wouldn't mind raising RPM's a bit either. Open to suggestions.
-Tank to rail kit or possibly just a banjo delete kit. Open to suggestions.
-I hope to keep at least the stock engine fan as a puller, if not one 16" SPAL pusher should be enough.
-FP 4" intake (will use stock 2g MAF) Clicky

(Relevant parts I have)
-Ported 2g/Evo 3 exhaust manifold
-1150cc Injectors
-Walbro 255 (rewired should support ~60 lbs/min at 25psi)
-True 3" downpipe with 3" exhaust
-Punishment Racing FMIC (should be easily adapted)
-Built engine, built trans, ARP headstuds, SS/TZ clutch, DSMLink V3 etc etc (mods list is up to date)

So any suggestions, parts I missed, parts I'll want, cheaper and better parts, etc?

 

[TWOpointFORliter]

I'm pretty sure a TS setup would put him WAY over budget.

As for your list it looks pretty solid. I would personally stay away from the 264 cams all together and go with 272's instead. The injectors should be fine for pump gas but if you ever plan on e85 you will need a much bigger injector.

 

[WES_393]

Thanks for the advice Monet. Im really liking the price, spool, and ease of install with the BEP housing so that's definitely here to stay.

 

[1glaserfwd]

I would say if your looking for up to 500whp I would go with the 7 blade hx35. It has more potential at higher boost levels than the 8 blade. My hx35 was the 8 blade and at 30psi ran a 12.0 @ 119.

 

[WES_393]

^ I had considered that. If memory serves me, the 8-blade maxes out at around 50 lbs/min while the 7-blade was closer to 60 lbs/min. I know I'll never be able to max out the 7-blade compressor with the BEP housing, but better to be limited by exhaust housing than compressor size, right? I'll definitely look into the 7-blade more, thanks.

 

[agentorange313]

Now that my suspension overhaul is complete, the time has come to replace this small 16g. It was fun while it lasted, but I want 450-500hp. However, I want to keep the spool quick and the price down (around $1.5K). What better option than an HX35? So I was hoping for some feedback on my parts list.

(Future Parts)
-Holset HX35 (8-blade)
-BEP .55 A/R housing (Clicky)
-MAP O2 housing w/ TS wastegate (Clicky)
-FP Oil Feed Line. Will feed from head, planning on using black filter/restrictor (Clicky)
-Oil drain adapter (1/2" NPT) and 3/4" hose barb Shown here. Then I'll just use the 3/4 hose that is already connecting my 16g and 2g oil pan.
-Cams. I was thinking 264's or 264/272 combo. I don't want to lose spool, but I don't want to choke the engine either. Wouldn't mind raising RPM's a bit either. Open to suggestions.
-Tank to rail kit or possibly just a banjo delete kit. Open to suggestions.
-I hope to keep at least the stock engine fan as a puller, if not one 16" SPAL pusher should be enough.
-FP 4" intake (will use stock 2g MAF) Clicky

(Relevant parts I have)
-Ported 2g/Evo 3 exhaust manifold
-1150cc Injectors
-Walbro 255 (rewired should support ~60 lbs/min at 25psi)
-True 3" downpipe with 3" exhaust
-Punishment Racing FMIC (should be easily adapted)
-Built engine, built trans, ARP headstuds, SS/TZ clutch, DSMLink V3 etc etc (mods list is up to date)

So any suggestions, parts I missed, parts I'll want, cheaper and better parts, etc?

That is a bad idea, that restrictor is for ball bearing turbos, not journal bearing like the HX35 is. Orifice hole is .030"vs a .125 for journal bearing they offer.

Choose a feed from a source(head or OFH), find the pressure at source, add a restictor if needed.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/tur...l-feed-supply-locations-all-turbo-brands.html

 

[WES_393]

Thats good to know. My only dilemma is I believe my OFH will over feed the turbo. Holset stated that 60psi was max, 80 psi is OK on cold starts. I have well over 100psi on cold starts and up to (if not over) 80psi at WOT. This is with no balance shaft, front shaft left in, and no porting to the OFH. So I will check oil pressure at the head to see if it falls within the guidelines, if so I'll run unrestricted from the head. If it's too low, I'll port the OFH/cut the spring and feed from the OFH with the necessary restrictor if needed.

Thanks for the input!

 

[agentorange313]

Thats good to know. My only dilemma is I believe my OFH will over feed the turbo. Holset stated that 60psi was max, 80 psi is OK on cold starts. I have well over 100psi on cold starts and up to (if not over) 80psi at WOT. This is with no balance shaft, front shaft left in, and no porting to the OFH. So I will check oil pressure at the head to see if it falls within the guidelines, if so I'll run unrestricted from the head. If it's too low, I'll port the OFH/cut the spring and feed from the OFH.

Thanks for the input!

I wouldn't cut anything, I would do the oil relief port mod on the OFH to help reduce oil pressure.

I would feed the turbo from the OFH, use an inline pressure gauge to see what the pressure is at start up, idle, and wot, then I would add a restrictor if needed. Holset and and upgrade MHI thrust bearing turbos like "enough" oil.

I would follow these guide lines:
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/turbo-system-tech/244467-holset-hx-35-oiling.html#post151402191

 

[jpmxrider489]

Thats good to know. My only dilemma is I believe my OFH will over feed the turbo. Holset stated that 60psi was max, 80 psi is OK on cold starts. I have well over 100psi on cold starts and up to (if not over) 80psi at WOT. This is with no balance shaft, front shaft left in, and no porting to the OFH. So I will check oil pressure at the head to see if it falls within the guidelines, if so I'll run unrestricted from the head. If it's too low, I'll port the OFH/cut the spring and feed from the OFH with the necessary restrictor if needed.

Thanks for the input!

Why not feed from the ofh and restrict it?

 

[WES_393]

I wouldn't cut anything, I would do the oil relief port mod on the OFH to help reduce oil pressure.

I would feed the turbo from the OFH, use an inline pressure gauge to see what the pressure is at start up, idle, and wot, then I would add a restrictor if needed. Holset and and upgrade MHI thrust bearing turbos like "enough" oil.

I would follow these guide lines:
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/turbo-system-tech/244467-holset-hx-35-oiling.html#post151402191

Alright then, OFH it is. Any good sources for the necessary feed line and restrictors. I have an OFH feed (I believe -3 an) going to my 16g as of now, so I'm assuming I could use that along with a restrictor between the line and turbo feed inlet?
(sorry for the noob questions, my brain is still racked from compatible wastegates, manifolds, and O2 housings. )

 

[agentorange313]

Alright then, OFH it is. Any good sources for the necessary feed line and restrictors. I have an OFH feed (I believe -3 an) going to my 16g as of now, so I'm assuming I could use that along with a restrictor between the line and turbo feed inlet?
(sorry for the noob questions, my brain is still racked from compatible wastegates, manifolds, and O2 housings. )

I would just source a line from a reputable vendor.

here is a restictor that will allow you to change the size:
https://www.rtmracing.com/xcart/product.php?productid=17848&cat=0&page=1

I personally bought a -4an inline strictor off of ebay, .04, it was too small, so I just drilled it out to .07.

 

[WES_393]

^ Sounds like a plan. I'll check out some feed lines and restrictors. I have every size of drill bit you can imagine, so I may just do as you did and get an inline restrictor and bore it out if necessary.

Thanks for all the help, I'll be sure to update if I have anymore questions!

 

[agentorange313]

^ Sounds like a plan. I'll check out some feed lines and restrictors. I have every size of drill bit you can imagine, so I may just do as you did and get an inline restrictor and bore it out if necessary.

Thanks for all the help, I'll be sure to update if I have anymore questions!

No problem, we dont want you to come back a week or how every long, saying that your turbo is shot because of lack of oil

You can always drill out the black FP filter, .030 to a bigger size. i have done that before, I drilled it out to a .075 to run with a MHI turbo from the OFH.

Also, holset like large drains, I wouldn't go with -10an, it has worked in the past for people, but I just went to -12an so it wouldn't be an issue. The stock drain line on our cars have a ID that larger than most -10an lines.

 

[Devilsfutbol17]

I'm pretty sure a TS setup would put him WAY over budget.

As for your list it looks pretty solid. I would personally stay away from the 264 cams all together and go with 272's instead. The injectors should be fine for pump gas but if you ever plan on e85 you will need a much bigger injector.

He will need bigger injector for e85 on that turbo setup? I don't know if I agree with that. http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-tuning-ecu/253452-e85-injector-max-lb-min-calculations.html

 

[ncdirtrider249]

On a tuning note, why not go speed density, rather than using a stock 2g mas?

 

[WES_393]

Also, holset like large drains, I wouldn't go with -10an, it has worked in the past for people, but I just went to -12an so it wouldn't be an issue. The stock drain line on our cars have a ID that larger than most -10an lines.

Well I should be good there, right? I'm using a 3/4 hose with the stock oil pan flange and a 1/2" NPT to 3/4" barb. A have close to zero blowby and wouldnt do anything silly like use RTV on the flange gaskets and clog up the line. If I need -12an line an fittings it wouldn't be a problem, I'd just like to use what I have a much as possible. 3/4" silicone hose ain't cheap!


Devilsfutbol- According to DSMLink wiki, my injectors would support 60 lbs/min on E85, so I believe your correct. However, my fuel pump and lines won't so that's out of the question for now unfortunately.

Dirtrider- I would love to go SD, but I would have to upgrade to V3 full and purchase the IAT and MAP sensor and install them both. I'm already over my 1.5k budget and the 2g MAF is good for much more than 500hp, so why not keep it for now.

 

[agentorange313]

Well I should be good there, right? I'm using a 3/4 hose with the stock oil pan flange and a 1/2" NPT to 3/4" barb. A have close to zero blowby and wouldnt do anything silly like use RTV on the flange gaskets and clog up the line. If I need -12an line an fittings it wouldn't be a problem, I'd just like to use what I have a much as possible. 3/4" silicone hose ain't cheap!


Devilsfutbol- According to DSMLink wiki, my injectors would support 60 lbs/min on E85, so I believe your correct. However, my fuel pump and lines won't so that's out of the question for now unfortunately.

Dirtrider- I would love to go SD, but I would have to upgrade to V3 full and purchase the IAT and MAP sensor and install them both. I'm already over my 1.5k budget and the 2g MAF is good for much more than 500hp, so why not keep it for now.

-4an = 1/4
-6an = 3/8
-8an = 1/2
-10an = 5/8
-12an = 3/4

You should be fine with a 3/4" oil drain.

 

[WES_393]

^ Awesome. I'll do what I can to enlarge the barb fitting as well since that will likely be the biggest restriction.

And might I add, holy $&@? the external wastegate O2 housings are pricey. Cheapest I can find (that's not Ebay junk) is Punishment's MVS at $550. But you gotta pay to play, right?

 

[agentorange313]

^ Awesome. I'll do what I can to enlarge the barb fitting as well since that will likely be the biggest restriction.

And might I add, holy $&@? the external wastegate O2 housings are pricey. Cheapest I can find (that's not Ebay junk) is Punishment's MVS at $550. But you gotta pay to play, right?

MAPerformance is cheaper, you can also buy it without a wastgate (not recommended since its almost impossible to get the gate on the housing). I personally like there fitment better, the Punishment also uses a thicker downpipe flange, but my MAP housing has never warped. I am also running that set up.

Now you could run the 38mm two bolt flange wastegatet and that will be much easier to get off and off. And you can source a wastegate from somewhere else, maybe classifieds.

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check this out:
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/tur...t-racing-vs-map-o2-housing.html#post152565630

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/turbo-system-tech/417630-hx40-bep-55-mvs-o2-housing-fitment.html

 

[WES_393]

MAP's O2 housing wastegate is 325 + 300 for the waste gate + 10 to recirculate it. So unless I'm looking at the wrong part, Punishment's MVS is nearly $100 cheaper. But the fitment does appear to be much better, so if it saves me from buying a SPAL fan it might be worth it...

 

[TWOpointFORliter]

He will need bigger injector for e85 on that turbo setup? I don't know if I agree with that. http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-tuning-ecu/253452-e85-injector-max-lb-min-calculations.html

In a perfect world with perfect fuel and a perfect tune and perfect injectors that would be a prefect injector sizing chart. Since non of those thing exist in the real world I stand by my original statement. That chart is a good reference point but if the op really wants to push the turbo it's better to error on the side of caution.

 

[agentorange313]

MAP's O2 housing wastegate is 325 + 300 for the waste gate + 10 to recirculate it. So unless I'm looking at the wrong part, Punishment's MVS is nearly $100 cheaper. But the fitment does appear to be much better, so if it saves me from buying a SPAL fan it might be worth it...

Oh, wow, my mistake. I guess they upped the price, when I bought mine last year it was cheaper than the Punishment by 45 bucks. That was the reason I bought it. The better fitment was a bonus.

I even run the FAL shroud with fans, everything fits great. So there should be enough room for slim fans.

EDIT: just checked out the new MAPerformance o2 housing, looks like they are using thicker flanges.

 

[WES_393]

Ah, so now that Punishment's housing is less than or equal to theirs, they can charge $150 more than they were.

Well I have a lot of research and bargain shopping to do, so Ill check back later for anymore advice and opinions. I appreciate the help so far!

 

[Tyeler18]

As far as your oil feed line Glenn (turboglenn) has a great write up on installing his hybrid holset. He's using an unrestricted -4an feed from the OFH and said it works as the perfect restrictor. He's got the balance shafts deleted and the OFH ported, I believe he did have to cut 1 coil off his spring, but I don't believe that was for feeding the turbo, it was for other reasons. I'd also suggest the 7 blade, if you haven't got your 8 blade yet I can hook you up with the guy I got my 7 blade from in Aurora, he's got another 7 blade thats supposedly mint (mine was) he sells for a good price. It came off his cummins.

 

[JusMX141]

-FP Oil Feed Line. Will feed from head, planning on using black filter/restrictor (Clicky)

Guaranteed failure if you run that filter and the feed line from the head.

Use the black FP filter, punch the restrictor out with a 7/64" bit, and feed from the filter housing. Good buddy of mine has been running that exact setup on his HX40 for the past year- works perfect and not a bit of shaft play.

Blurry pic- flash wasn't working:

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