Using your old T25 with your new HKS SSQV bov

[crazykid]

Yeah I know the topic sounds funny, but I just wanted to give those of you having issues with your HKS SSQV "fluttering" an idea. Ive noticed most people that have this issues with this BOV dont have it on its own vac line for one reason or another (usually to tie in for a MBC). Now, the T25 has a pressure source nipple for the wastegate directly on it, unlike most new turbos lack a pressure source at all, which is why most people result to teeing various vac lines. Well since I wanted to do this the "proper way", I removed the pressure source nipple from my T25, and taped it into my FMIC piping directly after the turbo, and use that as the source for my MBC (which we all know its the closer your pressure source the easier it is to control boost). For now I just used some JB Weld and it holds fine, no leaks. Ill eventually weld it in the proper way. Now I have a "close to the pressure source" place to connect my MBC to the wastegate, a dedicated line to my SSQV, and short lines all around.

I know this has probably been done before or people have done other things for a dedicated vac source for their SSQV, but I just thought I throw this out there. Oh and btw, I have no fluttering issues

 

[TSIMonsteR]

So you have the MBC connected to your IC pipe after the turbo?

 

[Bigglesworth87]

I think pictures would clear up any confussion because I am lost as hell. Sorry!

 

[crazykid]

So you have the MBC connected to your IC pipe after the turbo?

Exactly... I put the nipple in the IC pipe right after the turbo outlet, Its actually kinda right under the turbo I guess, I dont see how there is any confusion. I dont have access to a digital cam right now, but when I do ill put a pic up.

I'm sure people have done it before, but was just stating for those of you that havent, and are having problems with your SSQV, and have a old T25 laying around, this is a simple thing to do. Hell, you could really tap it into the outlet of your new turbo, but I already had mine installed and it was just easier to take the IC pipe off and put it there.

 

[spoolup]

Me and a few others tapped the ICP AFTER the FMIC since there is a pressure drop at the IC, it gives you better boost control by allowing you to reference the boost AFTER the IC without tapping into the BOV line (which is a idea I have always frowned on). The BOV, FPR, Boost gauge and controller all have their indepent lines to prevent problems. Congrats to you for giving it a go and reporting back your findings. Should make it easier for other in the quest to solve their problem.

 

[Bigglesworth87]

OOH wait, I get it now. Sorry I misinturpreted it.

 

[TSIMonsteR]

Ok, I get it now as well. I misunderstood. Definately helpful info for me, eventhough I don't have the SSQV yet, but will (stupid leaky crushed 1gBOV) or a T2Small. Still helpful to me about the MBC

 

[nanokpsi]

Just wanted people to know that t-ing the vac lines aren't going to make/not make your BOV flutter. Its the nature of certain valves and thier spring pressures. I've also run boost control from t-ing the bov line and directly off the compressor cover. I didn't have any change in boost spiking either way. How long do you think it takes pressurized air to move through a vac line?
One of my earliest mods was a HKS SSBOV, even before a boost controller. It had its own dedicated line for a long time and still fluttered on the t25. Sure I could go wot, build boost and let off really abruptly and it wouldn't flutter. It sure fluttered plenty of other times.

 

[crazykid]

Just wanted people to know that t-ing the vac lines aren't going to make/not make your BOV flutter. Its the nature of certain valves and thier spring pressures. I've also run boost control from t-ing the bov line and directly off the compressor cover. I didn't have any change in boost spiking either way. How long do you think it takes pressurized air to move through a vac line?
One of my earliest mods was a HKS SSBOV, even before a boost controller. It had its own dedicated line for a long time and still fluttered on the t25. Sure I could go wot, build boost and let off really abruptly and it wouldn't flutter. It sure fluttered plenty of other times.

True & Not True, you are correct about spring pressures and valves and such, but the SSQV needs to be on its own line and it DOES make a difference, and I know this from my personal expierence. Not to mention if you do a little bit of research on it, A LOT of people (not only DSM people), have issues with this BOV and highly suggest it being on its own line. Actually, even with mine being on a dedicated line, if I boost to only like 1-2 psi, and let off, there is a very faint flutter (which is normal, and is the smaller of the 2 valves letting off for low boost). But nothing huge like going partial, mid, full throttle and get a huge flutter that sounds like shit (this is related to not enough vac, "disrupted vac", from teeing the line going to the BOV, therefor not being about to open the valve for large amounts of boost), and some have suggested this may be causing partial compressor surge???? (never looked into it much but would make sense since the compressed air is not all being let out at once and is more like a open/close/open/close... type deal).

As far as your issue with your T-25 and the SSQV, I think you answered your own question. What is stock boost? Around 6psi? maybe 8? Plus the fact the the T-25 just does not flow as much as this psi as bigger turbos. Just not enough pressure for the BOV to let off properly. I would not recommend this BOV to people using smaller turbos or any low boosting application. This BOV seems to be for the higher boosting guys with larger turbos

 

[nanokpsi]

True & Not True, you are correct about spring pressures and valves and such, but the SSQV needs to be on its own line and it DOES make a difference, and I know this from my personal expierence. Not to mention if you do a little bit of research on it, A LOT of people (not only DSM people), have issues with this BOV and highly suggest it being on its own line. Actually, even with mine being on a dedicated line, if I boost to only like 1-2 psi, and let off, there is a very faint flutter (which is normal, and is the smaller of the 2 valves letting off for low boost). But nothing huge like going partial, mid, full throttle and get a huge flutter that sounds like shit (this is related to not enough vac, "disrupted vac", from teeing the line going to the BOV, therefor not being about to open the valve for large amounts of boost), and some have suggested this may be causing partial compressor surge???? (never looked into it much but would make sense since the compressed air is not all being let out at once and is more like a open/close/open/close... type deal).

As far as your issue with your T-25 and the SSQV, I think you answered your own question. What is stock boost? Around 6psi? maybe 8? Plus the fact the the T-25 just does not flow as much as this psi as bigger turbos. Just not enough pressure for the BOV to let off properly. I would not recommend this BOV to people using smaller turbos or any low boosting application. This BOV seems to be for the higher boosting guys with larger turbos

Just an fyi, my t25 spiked to 20-21psi and fell down to 11-12 w/o a boost controler, just the bcs restrictor removed.
Yah, I know nothing about runing large turbo and the SSBOV. I've also run it with its own line from day untill just recently when I teed the line to install my AEM 5 bar sensor. From experience the bov flutter is worse the bigger turbo you get. The bov does't need "x" amount of airflow to open. Its the delta in the line that causes it to open so a fast spooling turbo will have less of a problem with the issue. Slower spooling turbos flutter more, untill you get so big that they don't really build boost unless you are really trying, so they don't flutter much at all. Thats where it sites with the pt67 on a 2.0.

As soon as the throttle is closed and the restriction is back, there is vaccuum in the mani and vaccuum lines. T-ing the lines only makes them a little longer, which is why some people think shortening the line will solve the flutter. In the real world, its not going to help the spring/valve form being to stiff and its not going to do much.
Just for the record I have run the t25, scm50, scm61, and my current pt67.
Having driven a scm50 car for about a year and a half with the SSBOV, I can garuntee you you have some flutter. Its not that big of a deal.

 

[crazykid]

Just an fyi, my t25 spiked to 20-21psi and fell down to 11-12 w/o a boost controler, just the bcs restrictor removed.
Yah, I know nothing about runing large turbo and the SSBOV. I've also run it with its own line from day untill just recently when I teed the line to install my AEM 5 bar sensor. From experience the bov flutter is worse the bigger turbo you get. The bov does't need "x" amount of airflow to open. Its the delta in the line that causes it to open so a fast spooling turbo will have less of a problem with the issue. Slower spooling turbos flutter more, untill you get so big that they don't really build boost unless you are really trying, so they don't flutter much at all. Thats where it sites with the pt67 on a 2.0.

As soon as the throttle is closed and the restriction is back, there is vaccuum in the mani and vaccuum lines. T-ing the lines only makes them a little longer, which is why some people think shortening the line will solve the flutter. In the real world, its not going to help the spring/valve form being to stiff and its not going to do much.
Just for the record I have run the t25, scm50, scm61, and my current pt67.
Having driven a scm50 car for about a year and a half with the SSBOV, I can garuntee you you have some flutter. Its not that big of a deal.

I never said I didn't have a little flutter, but it is only if I really try to make it do it, as in, partial throttling and trying to hit only 1-2, maybe 3 psi. Anything more and the flutter is not there. Now, with teeing the vac line, this is a whole different story. The flutter is much more apparent and all different throttle positions and also still very noticable at a higher psi. Don't believe me if you dont want to, but Ive dont my research on it, and done a lot my own little tests trying to figure out why it does it, why some people have bigger issues than others, and what can be done to reduce it. In other words, trying to find the ideal setup while using the SSQV.

 

[crazykid]

Just an fyi, my t25 spiked to 20-21psi and fell down to 11-12 w/o a boost controler, just the bcs restrictor removed.
Yah, I know nothing about runing large turbo and the SSBOV. I've also run it with its own line from day untill just recently when I teed the line to install my AEM 5 bar sensor. From experience the bov flutter is worse the bigger turbo you get. The bov does't need "x" amount of airflow to open. Its the delta in the line that causes it to open so a fast spooling turbo will have less of a problem with the issue. Slower spooling turbos flutter more, untill you get so big that they don't really build boost unless you are really trying, so they don't flutter much at all. Thats where it sites with the pt67 on a 2.0.

As soon as the throttle is closed and the restriction is back, there is vaccuum in the mani and vaccuum lines. T-ing the lines only makes them a little longer, which is why some people think shortening the line will solve the flutter. In the real world, its not going to help the spring/valve form being to stiff and its not going to do much.
Just for the record I have run the t25, scm50, scm61, and my current pt67.
Having driven a scm50 car for about a year and a half with the SSBOV, I can garuntee you you have some flutter. Its not that big of a deal.

I never said I didn't have a little flutter, but it is only if I really try to make it do it, as in, (as stated in my last post) partial throttling and trying to hit only 1-2, maybe 3 psi. Anything more and the flutter is not there. Now, with teeing the vac line, this is a whole different story. The flutter is much more apparent and all different throttle positions and also still very noticeable at a higher psi (I dont really remember exact figures, cause it was a bit ago I tested this all out, but there was a VERY noticable difference). Don't believe me if you don't want to, but Ive done my research on it, and done a lot my own little tests trying to figure out why it does it, why some people have bigger issues than others, and what can be done to reduce it. In other words, trying to find the ideal setup while using the SSQV. Which is why I made my original post, to let people know from my personal experience, how to setup the SSQV properly to work how it is supposed to.