My name is WildDsm and I had a question about individual throttle bodies and having them installed on my 92 GS I did a search and came up with forums talking about how they don't make a kit for 1st gen 4G63's but they make them for avengers and 420A's
mainly, neons, and I was wondering are there companies out there that could fabricate and tune an induction system like that for me? and if so, what kind of stand=alone engine management system would yall suggest? Has anyone pulled off 11:1 compression yet? its been on my mind lately, and like to see if its been done and how to do it. Anything else pertinent would be great, especially suggestions, hopefully if i can pull this off with good horsepower, my target is 180hp to the wheels, and give everyone else a road map if there isn't one already.Not bad for my first project! Be easy

Im not sure about individual throttle bodies being installed. But 11:1 compression has been used. There are people running even higher compression than that, I dont know if theyre on this site or not tho. Im running 10.5:1 but havent gone higher because it gets expensive. Higher compression means higher octane, at some point you have to switch to race gas.

there is a lto of fab work and tuning involved. you need tapered velocity stakc on a 4g63 head flange with 4 throttl bodies that actually coletively are bigger then a 64mm tb but flow good and keep port velocity.

you have to get a cam set and all tuned in the try to get flow specs the figure otu collectively the size all 4 have to be to match a 64mm tb and be a little bigger without overkillgin it.

im tryin to find a 4g63 setup but havent yet

I was contacted by someone that had built this type of setup fo a turbo dsm, and wanted to sell them on my na site. It was a big $$$ investment, and hadn't been tried on a na yet, only the turbo model and they had some tuning issues with that.

I passed on the project for now, but am going to take a look at it again once it's been a little further developed.

TC

and id gladly test em and purchase first set. if i get those itll make my project so sick. ive been tryign to find somewhere who would make this setup for abtou 2 years now.

na90dsm said:

and id gladly test em and purchase first set. if i get those itll make my project so sick. ive been tryign to find somewhere who would make this setup for abtou 2 years now.

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ITB's for the 4g63 are available at www.haywardperformance.com . they are not on the site yet, so call them, pictures can be emailed to those interested. N.A. and turbo models, 50m/m throttles per port on up to 54m/m per port .
There have not been any tuning problems with them.
There have been transmission durability problems, ((More torque)) and far superior throttle responce for street driving. LHP

where does the maf plug into. i emailed em and im waiting for a response. i wanan knwo the price of the whoel deal.

On ITB systems, a vacuum tree is used, which hooks to all the manifold runners to a small plenum of sorts that you can hook up power brakes/ map sensors etc, but with the amount of throttle area it can be hard to tune via map sensors as you lost vacuum signal fast as you open the the throttles, example: 4, 50m/m throttles = 1, 100m/m throttle, this is the airflow advantage of ITB's, throttle area total.
LHP

The single injector per port ITB system is $2030.oo usd, this includes a tps and vacuum tree. Email hayward performance directly for pictures of NA system. LHP

i emailed them about the product and there very awesoem peoepl. very good communications also. i got 5 pics of product. $2030.oo usd isnt bad for the setup. its sick

::gets on phone with bank loan officer::






















also they said i can messure my application and shorter air horns are avalible. this is gonan be a sick setup. i need a loan.

looks allot like the setup on my all motor 420a...but im using a longer plenum for better lower and mid range...im current running 12:1 comp pistons and a .020" milled with machined valve reliefs...im probably ~12.4:1 comp ratio right now and yes you do need race gas to go that high...but on C++ and a fully built head im able to run full igniton advance and 550cc injectors and crower drag grind cams with no problem....8800 rpm rev limiter and a lil over 270hp all motor makes for a fun run...and im currently running PIG rich...cant wait to get to the dyno

what did you do to your intake ports to flow that much air. close to stock or port job. im thinking stage 1 port to keep velocity

punishment said:

I was contacted by someone that had built this type of setup fo a turbo dsm, and wanted to sell them on my na site.

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How would a quad throttle body setup be even remotely helpful for a turbo car? I'd really like to know. :laugh:

throttle response issues, it eliminates the maf sensor as it has to be used with a aftermarket ecu, bolts on without really any issues, the tps is made for the car unliek the 75mm tb setups.

the turbo model is encased in a aftermarket intake manifold and has a pipe welded to it thats 4 inches od pipe comin in. thats a inch bigger then the 75mm tb setups.

see where im goin with this

na90dsm said:

throttle response issues, it eliminates the maf sensor as it has to be used with a aftermarket ecu, bolts on without really any issues, the tps is made for the car unliek the 75mm tb setups.

the turbo model is encased in a aftermarket intake manifold and has a pipe welded to it thats 4 inches od pipe comin in. thats a inch bigger then the 75mm tb setups.

see where im goin with this

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So you're telling me people pay this insane amount of money (manifold/throttlebodies/ecu) just to have slightly better throttle response? Wouldn't putting the GM MAFT set up for blow-through close to the throttle body be good enough? :laugh:

depemds on boost levels, insanely high boost levels with a huge head need insane flow. liek say you wanted 30psi on a stage 5 head, crower stage 3 cams and that itb setup would flow insanely good. instead of being limited to one 75mm tb you have a 4 inch intake and 4 50mm tb.

itb setups are for serious race only. you have to be runnign an insane turbo to gain anythign from that setup.

na90dsm said:

depemds on boost levels, insanely high boost levels with a huge head need insane flow. liek say you wanted 30psi on a stage 5 head, crower stage 3 cams and that itb setup would flow insanely good. instead of being limited to one 75mm tb you have a 4 inch intake and 4 50mm tb.

itb setups are for serious race only. you have to be runnign an insane turbo to gain anythign from that setup.

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Or you could just put an insane intake manifold on it, because that's basically what the purpose of the thing is. Even the most badass turbos don't need more than a 3 inch throttle body.

This thread is to do with non turbo performance, and this intake system is a good as your going to get for non turbo power, In any performance application you have to eliminate all the restrictions and if your serious about making power, you don't run a MAF as it will be a restriction to airflow.
For turbo perfomance, airflow is where you find it, single large throttles are well known to have poor off idle and low speed responce, this equates to drivability, torque down low, ITB's help to eliminate this,better throttle responce with the added airflow for mid range +top end power, some people want more than the average power adders and have superior drivability to go with it. LHP

yea witha n/t a single tb setup will have some restriction as will the maf. eliminating these to will let tons more air in the motor making more power. now i need to get my credit a little better then go to the bank and ill have fundage.

LHP said:

This thread is to do with non turbo performance, and this intake system is a good as your going to get for non turbo power

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Well someone mentioned that this was originally on a turbo.

LHP said:

if your serious about making power, you don't run a MAF as it will be a restriction to airflow.

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What? There are plenty of MAFs out there that cause an incredibly small restriction (namely 3.5" GM MAF) and there are plenty of people running 10s with them. But I guess they aren't "serious" about making power.

LHP said:

For turbo perfomance, airflow is where you find it, single large throttles are well known to have poor off idle and low speed responce, this equates to drivability, torque down low, ITB's help to eliminate this,better throttle responce with the added airflow for mid range +top end power, some people want more than the average power adders and have superior drivability to go with it. LHP

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How many fast DSMs are running a single throttle body? How many are running this quad throttle body setup? Think about that. And your low end, off idle, and drivabilty are going to suck no matter what you do if you have that thing. The runners are super short and huge, you will get no low end torque from that thing at all, especially if you have cams.

this is mainly a drag setpu dude, this is for all out hp and nothign else. top end strict performance.

no driveability here on the road, this is a strip setup

na90dsm said:

this is mainly a drag setpu dude, this is for all out hp and nothign else. top end strict performance.

no driveability here on the road, this is a strip setup

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When you say no driveability, exactly what do you lose? I planned on using the throttle bodies for better road race/autocross performance.

leakyfaucet said:

Well someone mentioned that this was originally on a turbo.

What? There are plenty of MAFs out there that cause an incredibly small restriction (namely 3.5" GM MAF) and there are plenty of people running 10s with them. But I guess they aren't "serious" about making power.

How many fast DSMs are running a single throttle body? How many are running this quad throttle body setup? Think about that. And your low end, off idle, and drivabilty are going to suck no matter what you do if you have that thing. The runners are super short and huge, you will get no low end torque from that thing at all, especially if you have cams.

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Sorry your wrong, everbody that driven the cars with this system have remarked at how good the throttle responce is compared to all other throttle setups they have driven on 4g63's, and the off idle and low speed is better NOT worse.
I was contracted to build these systems for a customer who wanted more, so if you don't want them that's fine, but don't make statements that are incorrect, and If some one wanted even more bottom end I can put on smaller throttles but this will kill off some top end.
And yes there are alot of cars using single throttles and large MAF's but if they want to go even faster the maf and single blade will become a restriction sooner or latter.
I have never had a customer call and complain about losing throttle responce/HP/ torque etc yet.
And larger cams can be used with ITB's because at low speed the intake port kick back is dampened by the throttles, less problems with cross talk as compared to plenum manifolds. LHP

either way there insane and im gettin em. itb setups are insane for throttle response. plus itll compliment my head nicely


any suggestions for a n/a head setup using these

LHP said:

I have never had a customer call and complain about losing throttle responce/HP/ torque etc yet.

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I'm sorry, I didn't know you were in the business. Still, you can't honestly tell me that with runners that short and wide you are not going lose low end. But you're actually telling me you GAIN low end. How is this possible? What magical materials are you using that increase low speed intake velocity?

Maybe the customers didn't complain because the cars have no low end torque anyways, and if they're willing to pay that much for something they're probably only interested in all out WOT and high rpm performance.