need more details... what turbo... 500 on race or pump?

CYrUs0k5 said:

need more details... what turbo... 500 on race or pump?

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Ill be running on 93 octane, and will have 14B turbo for a bit, then upgrade when needed to an EvoIII 16G or possibly bigger if I need to, and in the 500ish range like any where from 400-500+HP

Neither is nescescarily "better" by definition when comparing one to the other. It is really a matter of specific circumstances and personal preferences. Ill do a little copy/add/paste action from a few of my previous posts on the subject to make a comprehensive guide of you will.

First off, the typical kit can spray whatever you put into the tank, however, methanol isnt recommended. Methanol (or race alcohol), as an additive or otherwise, is not a practical choice because it is more prone to pre-ignition, is not as safe to handle and is not as easily attainable as its counterparts. Although it can make more power then all of the others, I personally wouldnt consider its drawbacks enough to warrant its use in a daily driving scenario although alot of people do.

Denatured (ethanol) alcohol, typically 95%, is cheap and is available in paint, hardware, and Home Depot type stores in gallon containers for about $10.00. Isopropyl alcohol can also be used but it is often 30% or more water by content. Most people run somwhere around a 50/50 mixture of this with distilled water (tap water has impurities). A 50/50 ratio of alcohol to water strikes a good balance between the maximum anti-knock capability of water and maximum supplemental fuel.

Some people just run straight washer fulid (the blue stuff). Although most contain some glycol and detergent (soaps and detergents are bad), most windshield washer fluids are up to 50% alcohol (ethanol, isopropanol) and work great. Be sure to read the label first.

Neither nescecarily increase horsepower just by themselves. They both can add small amounts of octane as well as lower charge temperatures by up to 300% allowing both increased timing, and much higher boost levels on pump gas, witch in turn, create more power. These results can be duplicated and bettered with racegas, (C16, etc.) but who wants to pay $6 dollars a gallon for racegas when you can spray $1 a gallon washer fluid and mix it in with your $1.95 93 octane for alot cheaper.

Your engine also gets a nice steam-cleaning effect from the water/alcy removing carbon and deposits from you intake manifold/valves/cc chamber/pitsons etc.

The only real ill effects are the chance of a clogged nozzle not spraying the predetermined amount your preffered mix when you are running 25-28psi on pumpgas, creating a super lean condition (the top of the line kits have implemented safeguards against this). Also, the constant increased peak cylinder pressures will wear your bore/rings more than normal and put extra stress on rods/bearings, but you have to expect a tradeoff from running such higher boost levels on a daily basis. Theoretically it is pretty safe if all the proper precautions are taken.

Not to be mean, but realistic, 500hp is quite a number to be aiming at when you havent even modded your car very much. Like I tell everyone, you should start out with small goals and learn as you go. Youll be better off in the end. Everyone says they want 500hp, but it isnt very easily attainable and doesnt always fit everyones budgets and needs.

I hope that helps.

Here are some links for you to read up on.

If you have any questions, shoot.

http://www.automotosports.com/magazine_articles3.asp
http://www.geocities.com/rad87gn/tech/alcohol.html
http://www.smcenterprises.com/faq's.htm
http://www.turbomirage.com/water.html
http://home.att.net/~alkycontrol/page8.htm
http://www.snowperformance.net/faq.asp
http://www.rbracing-rsr.com/waterinjection.html
http://www.turbofast.com.au/racefuel2.html
http://www.ext.colostate.edu/pubs/farmmgt/05010.html

Thanks Eric, that...well sums everything up nice and neatly for me, and yes I know 500 is a pretty high # and I am not planning on just shooting up there, I figure it will take a year or 2 or more if needed, I was mearly asking this question which you awnsered very nice just to figure out which one I will go with so I can make sure to get modds that will support it very well. I think that Ill go with alcohal injection, seems a little better since it doesnt go BOOM, and since its cheaper, but still get good results. I like the 50/50 on 93 octane that sounds like it has worked nicely for other people, and where is the $1.95/gal of 93 octane coause I sure would like to get my hands on some that cheap, yeah I know its from a way earlier post of yours thanks again for the help.

Damn eric why you always beating me to these posts? How am I supposed to help people? . Anyway once again I would have give you reps but it still says i have to spread the love around first. To the OP listen to this guy he knows his shit.

You will not decide between alcohol or water, it will decide for you. First, start out with 100% water, and then do a dyno run. Then try 10% methanol and 90% water, and do another pull. Keep going in 10% increments, being sure to purge the lines to the injector(s) each time, and stop at 50%. Every car is different, but most end up liking about a 25/75 meth/water mix.

Methanol works extremely well for injection. It produces great results, and is not too corrosive, allowing any quality kit to be compatible.

Denatured will eat your pump in 2-3 months top, no ifs ands or butts. It is some nasty stuff.

Not trying to step on anyones toes, just sharing my experiences.

Thanks for the posts guys.

EngineRunup said:

You will not decide between alcohol or water, it will decide for you. First, start out with 100% water, and then do a dyno run. Then try 10% methanol and 90% water, and do another pull. Keep going in 10% increments, being sure to purge the lines to the injector(s) each time, and stop at 50%. Every car is different, but most end up liking about a 25/75 meth/water mix.

Methanol works extremely well for injection. It produces great results, and is not too corrosive, allowing any quality kit to be compatible.

Denatured will eat your pump in 2-3 months top, no ifs ands or butts. It is some nasty stuff.

Not trying to step on anyones toes, just sharing my experiences.

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All the of the cars I have had experience with including my car soon will/have run a 70/30 meth/water mix by volume and it works out great.