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Road Course & Autocross Autocross, Road Race, and Open Track Event discussions. Preparation, technique, tips, and stories from the events. Tell us about your last event.

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Old 05-01-2008, 12:00 PM   #1 (permalink)
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The new setup

Back out on track and this time for a different purpose…setup. It was time to put some laps on the new setup and begin the process of sorting things out. The new additions in question are:

- Muellerized JICs
- SPC upper control arms (camber and caster adjustment)
- new compression and lateral control arms (with flipped driver’s side bushing)
- Evo Brembos w/ Carbotech XP-12 pads
- Toyo R888

First impressions…very impressive. Going with this many changes at once really had me wondering if all the new variables would cause the car’s feel and behavior to take a step back. The Konis and H&Rs were a potent setup out of the box and the real reason for the change was due to the lack of adjustability to prevent tire rub with the fender. Otherwise they were nicely sorted out of the box. With no adjustability, they were simply bolt on and have fun. I didn’t want to loose that stability under breaking or neutral feel mid corner. Those combined with the RM sways were a great combination.

The weekend prior to the event, the Eclipse came off the jackstands with the JICs and Brembos in place with some pizza sized rotors and Centric Posi-Quiet Brake Pads from RRE. With a quick tape measure alignment I went for a little drive around the block. Immediately the first thing you feel is just how direct and quick the steering response is. In comparison with my previous setup, this was almost like driving a go-kart. Quick succession rights and lefts showed how flat the car felt. There was very minimal body roll and quick transitions where the car settled quickly. The Brembos also showed a huge improvement over the stock OEM setup. Once again there were concerns whether or not the balance would be right or if the master cylinder would be up to powering these massive calipers, but the ‘street’ pads almost felt like they could run with the Porterfield R4-Es and were a huge improvement over the stock 2 piston setup. Braking distance was noticeably shorter and very confidence inspiring. But enough of the street stuff, that’s not the environment for its intended use.

That Tuesday I took the car up to Curt at Track Time Performance for an alignment and to get the R888s mounted. Curt has a long standing reputation with the S2KCA community and was recommended to be by more than one instructor from various rac organizations. After filling up the tank to competition level and mounting the R888s, we noticed that the rear tires were rubbing and the front SPC arms were contacting the shock tower mounts. A quick call to John gave me the settings I needed to readjust the ride height and we were set. He also gave me a little advice about being tentative of my turning points

Sat. morning rolls around and it was time to see how it would all interact with one another. After a few warm-up laps to make sure nothing fell off, I dropped off the front straight into turn one and get on the brakes. First thing I notice I’m about a 100ft. short of where I should be. Furthermore I’m doing 70mph where I should be at 90. And holy crap do these Brembos and Carbotechs work. They were very predictable and repeatable through out the weekend. Another feat to attribute to the combination is that they are able to lock up the 255 R888s. Prior I’ve never had to worry about brake modulation. Traqmate would confirm that entry speeds were still within 1-2 mph of my previous setup, but the time needed to bring the car down to speed shaved off a few tenths.

The JICs were an absolute joy and really made the car come alive. Most of Sat. was spent with tape to check for rubbing and body contact, but after getting the rears adjusted to the right height, man was it a thrill to throw around. Essentially the JICs and the R888s compliment one another. Without the grip from the 888s the JICs would over drive a street tire. And without the JICs a 255 tire and the grip they provided, the JICs could not be utilized to their full potential (limiting factor is still the brain behind the wheel). The R888s handled well in both the dry and the wet. Temps rose 4-5psi in comparison to the 9-11psi from the Potenzas. When they got to their operating temps the grip was amazing. I was even confident enough to throw the car and let it slide a little on corner entry. Tire temps show that I’m not fully utilizing the fronts and the rears need a little camber removed. Best lap times only dropped by a 1.7 sec, but my average lap times are the noticeable difference. Previously I was consistent in the 2:07 range where now I was turning multiple laps in the 2:04s. There’s more sorting out to do, but its was a fun weekend dialing in the car. I’ll be taking it back out again this weekend for more data collection before turning it over to John and Curt for more tweaks.
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Old 05-01-2008, 12:11 PM   #2 (permalink)
 
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Sounds like the new setup is working well for you. I noticed that same change in feeling when went to a "real" suspension system. Looking to make the jump to R888's or NT-01's when my current tires die off.


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Old 05-01-2008, 01:05 PM   #3 (permalink)
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For the first day with the new setup, cutting 1.7 off sounds great to me. From the look of it, there's more where that came from. Keep tweaking, keep posting.

Awesome read considering I just picked up a set of Brembos too..
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Old 05-01-2008, 02:07 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by asian312 View Post
I was even confident enough to throw the car and let it slide a little on corner entry.
Nothing more fun than a little overstear!!!

Have you looked into corner-weighting your setup? I know John probably sets them as close as possable but every car is a bit different.

Sounds like a killer setup!!!


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Old 05-01-2008, 02:23 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by UofACATS View Post
For the first day with the new setup, cutting 1.7 off sounds great to me. From the look of it, there's more where that came from. Keep tweaking, keep posting.

Awesome read considering I just picked up a set of Brembos too..
Hands down one of my favorite mods. I think I like to decelerate my car as much as I like turning . There's plenty more time in the setup and I've fended off the urge to up the power level. The engine is just begging, but times are dropping and I'm still at ~220HP @ 10-11 psi.

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Originally Posted by talonTSIDriver View Post
Nothing more fun than a little overstear!!!

Have you looked into corner-weighting your setup? I know John probably sets them as close as possable but every car is a bit different.

Sounds like a killer setup!!!
Curt's been dying to get the car on scales, but we needed a starting point on ride height. I'll take it back out this weekend (after some more fender rolling in the rear) and see if there are any more rubbing issues. Once that's complete I can hand it over and we know where our lower limit lies.

John's setup was amazing from the box and worth every penny. Other than adjusting ride height, everything else has been left untouched. I've got all the original settings recorded, should I need to revert back. Something to be said about piece of mind.
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Old 05-03-2008, 10:59 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Do you still have an issue with the SPC arms hitting the shock tower? I know some of the guys on the link forums grinded the arms down until they didn't touch the shock tower anymore.



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Old 05-04-2008, 12:14 AM   #7 (permalink)
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I wouldn't recommend doing that as that piece is designed to with stand the stresses placed on the upper control arm. On top of that the piece is made of cast aluminum. I resolved the fronts by bring bringing the ride height up matched with the proper sized bumpstops.
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Old 05-04-2008, 01:29 AM   #8 (permalink)
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POST PICTURES PLEASE!!! I want to see how those R888's look on that thing man .


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Old 05-19-2008, 09:21 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Update:

Took the new setup out one more time before letting Curt at Track Time back at it for its final tweaks. The track this weekend had just been wash green with the storm system that past through. I was working corners on Sat hoping that the track would rubber in. It was a nice sunny day with temps in the low-mid 80s.

I was able to turn a new personal best in the 2:02 range, but wasn't quite satisfied how the R888s felt this weekend. Pressures and temps were spot on, but I could not get them to bite on turn in. I tried slowing down my hands, applying a tap of the brakes in stead of just a lift, even changing lines, but nothing seem to work. Corners where normally I have sure fire grip, I found myself washing out. It was like terminal understeer all over again. Now in the tires defense, this was a sensation felt by many drivers (buddies running R1, NT-01, and RA-1). So it may have been the track. Anyways, it was a great weekend and will have some good footage to come. Last session of the day had our group running nose to tail for almost the entire session. We got into a comfortable rythem and just changed leaders when you bobbled or got tired. Forgot how much fun it is to just turn off the clock and drive
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Old 05-19-2008, 10:06 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Forgot how much fun it is to just turn off the clock and drive
I personally would rather chase a friend around a track than race the clock.

Looking forward to seeing some pics.


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Old 05-19-2008, 10:32 AM   #11 (permalink)
 
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I personally would rather chase a friend around a track than race the clock.

Looking forward to seeing some pics.
Ditto


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Old 05-22-2008, 12:02 AM   #12 (permalink)
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One better than pics for now:

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Old 05-22-2008, 08:47 AM   #13 (permalink)
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^^ Looks like a blast! it sure got me excited for this weekends track day at BHF.


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Old 05-22-2008, 07:15 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Thanks for the reminder Andy, I've even got a post-it on my calender. Must have just got used to seeing it and forgot what it even said. I may see you there, is it Saturday and Sunday?


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Old 05-23-2008, 08:15 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Thanks for the reminder Andy, I've even got a post-it on my calender. Must have just got used to seeing it and forgot what it even said. I may see you there, is it Saturday and Sunday?
Saturday. please come!


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