Is this another timing belt issue?

[Rich A]

I've searched this forum and found several posts regarding botched timing belt replacements. I'm pretty sure from what I've read that I now have a timing belt problem.

This is my 2nd Eclipse (a 92 GS) My first one (a 90 model) never ran correctly after the Mitt. dealership replaced the timing belt. Classic problem with rough idle etc.,after the repair - where it ran smoothly before the repair. I ultimately ended up junking the car. (didn't know about this forum back then)

So here I am with my 92 model 16v which runs like a top. 126K miles and needed some work (brakes, clutch etc.) But the engine was still strong, quiet and you couldn't tell it was running when idle.

Having had a bad experience at (I guess you guys call them Satan?) I went to a mechanic I've known for some time who has worked on my other cars and truck. A very honest and decent gent. I explained my problem with the dealership and my former Eclipse and asked him if he could handle the work (including a new timing belt) on my 92.

When I got the car back he told me right off that he had a lot of trouble getting the timing marks to line up. He admitted it was a pain and to let him know if everything worked okay. (I'm still amazed at his honesty) Well here's how it runs. (I think he knows there is still something wrong)

It seems to run at a cold idle too high. When warmed up it idles at 1,000 RPM. (also high?) Then, once in a while, when fully warmed up and idling, the idle will raise to 1100 then drop to 900 then raise back to around 1100 then drop to 800 and keep rising and failing with each drop lower than the next until it stalls. I believe if it was able to idle at 800 or so it would be very rough. But can't tell as it's really idling at just a tad over 1K.

Plus the exhaust "seems" more throaty than normal.

But what has me stumped is that the idling problem (up and down and stalling) doesn't do it all the time. Seems that it normally just idles too fast and the up and down idling doesn't always happen. I could stop at maybe 10 traffic lights with no problem and then the 11th (if I'm stuck there long enough) will result in my having to goose the gas to keep it going.

I've printed out the full instructions for timing belt replacement that was listed on another thread about this "similar" problem, and will be going back to him soon. I'm hoping the "screw driver" check listed in step 24 will help him out. Frankly I love this car as it's quite peppy and handles nicely.

Does this sound like a timing belt issue I've read about here? Also as a footnote, the original dealership went out of business a few months ago.

 

[Aurora-Hybrid]

it sounds like it is off a by a tooth. I'll tell you a trick to getting your teeth lined up. Take the blade of a hack saw and lay it across the groves in the gears. There is a grove in each gear. And if it is lines up right then it should go straight through the middle and hit both groves with no problem.

 

[DSM90AWD]

Installing the belt is pretty easy if you know what you're doing.. and just as easy to screw up if you don't.

Print the below out and bring to the mechanic:
http://www.vfaq.com/mods/timingbelt-1G.html

 

[Rich A]

Thanks for the docs. Gave them to the mechanic. Another few weeks and the car is back. Same problem. All that has happened is the cold engine idle was reduced.

Is there a chance this could be un-related to the timing belt change? I haven't talked to the mech. yet (I'm kinda agrevated). But when I picked up the car the "other" mechanic says the timing and all are perfect.

There's another place on the other side of the state who deals with mitsu's and says he can fix it for 350 bucks. (says that is what he would charge to "re-install" the timing belt).

I'm already out $1,500 bucks .. (clutch, brakes, battery, and timing belt) The problem really seems to "come and go". sometimes it will idle almost normal with what feels like a "miss". And some times the idle starts to raise and lower and eventually gets low enough to stall the engine.

I've lost confidence in the garage where I've now had the thing "stored" for 4 months while they try to fix it. I really need to get this fixed before winter. Note the dealer (a large Mits. dealer where I bought it) has gone out of business.

The place I'm concidering hauling the car to is on the other side of the state .. called "Pruven Performance". Anyone had dealings with them ??

 

[DSM90AWD]

Pruven is a pretty well respected DSM shop. IMHO $350 is worth them doing it right and you not having to worry.

BTW.. if you want to verify yourself that the T-Belt is correct do the following:
1.) remove the #1 sparkpug, upper timing belt cover and plug from the D/S splash shield (exposing the crank pully).
2.) insert a long screwdriver into the sparkplug hole
3.) with the car in neutral /p-brake on (car is not on) rotate the crank pully with a 1/2" drive socket wrench/breaker bar until the screwdriver is at it's highest position. This is TDC. You can turn your wheel all the way left which will give you ample access without having to jack the car up.

4.) Now check the timing marks on the cam sprockets.. they should be exactly facing each other at 3(exhaust) and 9(intake) oclock.

5.) Now check the Ignition timing scale and the crankshaft pulley's timing mark alignment. Should be at TDC on the scale.

If 4 or 5 is not true you need to re/re the TBelt as is not installed correctly.

BTW.. since the ignition is driven by the CAS on the intake cam.. a misaligned Tbelt will cause your ingition timing to be off as well.

In the ST you may be able to correct your idle probs by correcting the Base Ignition timing (if it is indeed off) and dialing in your base Idle by adjusting the BISS screw on the throttle body.

 

[Rich A]

Thanks, I think I'll take your lead and at least check the belt timing to insure it's indeed off. If so, I'll truck it on down to Pruven. No time here for me to really fool with it. My engine tweaking days are long gone. Now I just want to enjoy the ride.