TDO5H-14b Turbo Rebuild and Possible Upgrade Hybrid

[sparticus13]

Hi All,

Recently a purchased a 91 Talon TSi AWD A/T. The previous owner said the turbo had been swapped for a stock turbo off another car, but he did not know what it was. I am in the process of rebuilding everything and I'm working with the turbo. I am wondering besides just doing a rebuild if any hybrid setup could be done with what I have.

The Comp Housing is cast with TDO5H and has another number of 49178-01030.

According to:

TDO5H - Mitsubishi - Catalog - TurboMaster

This is a sock TDO5H-14b Turbo. So I assume the comp housing/center section/comp wheel are all 14b.

The turbine hot side is cast with 78-11830.

I keep getting mixed results as to what that is on google so I'm a little unsure.

I have taken it all apart and am soaking/cleaning it all. I plan to get this full rebuild kit.

Mitsubishi TD05 TD06 Major Turbocharger Rebuild Kit

Now aside form just the rebuild I was thinking maybe I could do some hybrid upgrading at this time. I do plan to do a major upgrade later on but for now I don't mind spending some money on a small upgrade if possible.

I know you can get kits that have a TDO5H Comp Housing Machined with a 20G Comp Wheel. These only work with a 16g center section correct? Not a 14b like mine.

Can I do any sort of Comp Wheel upgrade with a machined TDO5H Comp Housing using my 14b Center section and w/e my hot side is? If not then I will just settle for rebuilding this as is for now.

Thanks
Chris

 

[black91awdturbo]

Check the freelancer section of this website there is some one who builds "hybrid" turbos from 05h's he would be the man to ask.

 

[brian9397gsx]

They are not hybrids its simply a tdo5 (designates the turbine shaft) then you can have the 14b,16g or 20g comp wheels.

You have to have the chra machined for the comp wheel and also the comp cover.

 

[sparticus13]

They are not hybrids its simply a tdo5 (designates the turbine shaft) then you can have the 14b,16g or 20g comp wheels.

You have to have the chra machined for the comp wheel and also the comp cover.

So the Cartridge/Center Section would need to be machined as well. Not just the Comp Housing, correct? I know there are kits sold that have the machined Comp Housing with your choice of 16, 18 or 20 Comp Wheel.

If I have to mess with modifying the center section then I think I will just do a rebuild of what I have for now and upgrade later.

 

[9!'clipseDOHC]

Recently a purchased a 91 Talon TSi AWD A/T. The previous owner said the turbo had been swapped for a stock turbo off another car, but he did not know what it was.

1g automatics, which your car is, originally came with a TD04 13g (and 390cc injectors), you have a TD05 14b which was swapped in from a manual trans 1g.

The turbine hot side is cast with 78-11830.

I keep getting mixed results as to what that is on google so I'm a little unsure.

A popular 14b upgrade is swapping out the 6cm2 turbine housing for the larger 7cm2 for a little more flow and top end power. However if your hotside says 11830, then you already have the 7c2 housing. The 6cm2 housing is designated by 060 or 11820.

 

[sparticus13]

Thanks for the help with the hot side. I was thinking the turbo was from a 1G Manual but wasn't sure what my hotside was.

 

[Bud92gsx]

Yep Nathan was correct..1g auto's came with tdo4 13g turbo..As well as tan or grey 390cc injectors..

Also 1g auto's came with a very small manifold..So just because they are cheap I would look into getting either a manual manifold or a 2g manifold..

Also if you want there are a couple other stock upgrades for 1g auto's..450 manual injectors, manual fpr, and manual ecu..The manual ecu allow you to brake boost as long as you want without retarding the timing..

 

[pj91gsx]

Here are some pictures of a 20g inside a 14b housing. You have to have the 14b center sections machined, then you can convert the center to all 20g parts. If you want the tdo6 compressor housing it fits right on after having the center section machined. A 14b to 20g conversion is great for people going for OEM appearance because they still retain the 14b stampped numbers on them. You have to press a pipe in them but i think they look great.

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[pos4g63]

Wow never would have thought you could do that. So you machine the center section and the compressor housing?

 

[agentorange313]

What was the BEP housing fitted for before you machined it to fit a td06 wheel? Is that the old or new FP green?

I am all about machining covers to get larger turbine wheels. i have a 20g with a 16g cover right now, works out well because I wont have to change any of my intercooler piping when I upgrade.

great work on the 14b cover.

I was actually reading a thread last night, Jus actually fit a 7-Fin GT30R compressor wheel shoe-horned into a Small 16G compressor cover. Now thats just nasty

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http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/turbo-system-tech/276540-maxing-out-13g-turbo.html#post151344457

 

[pj91gsx]

What was the BEP housing fitted for before you machined it to fit a td06 wheel? Is that the old or new FP green?

I am all about machining covers to get larger turbine wheels. i have a 20g with a 16g cover right now, works out well because I wont have to change any of my intercooler piping when I upgrade.

great work on the 14b cover.

This is a newer green, it has a tdo6h turbine. i never fited it with a tdo5h turbine i just machined it.

 

[skatershawn]

What exactly do you have to machine on the center section? I thought that used the same turbine wheel/shaft!
I was under the impression that you could get a 16g compression cover and wheel, and then swap it onto the 14b!

 

[JusMX141]

I could be wrong, but i maybe the first to ever machine A Stainless BEP housing for an fp green.

Bullseye sold turbine housings for TD05H and TD06H turbos in their day.

Also, I don't believe we allow Freelancers to use the tech forums as a place to showcase the parts and services they offer, so please keep any personal business out of the tech forums.

 

[jb2zero0six5]

It wasn't a "showcase" as much as it was an example of how this kind of thing works. Don't hate.

 

[sparticus13]

What exactly do you have to machine on the center section? I thought that used the same turbine wheel/shaft!
I was under the impression that you could get a 16g compression cover and wheel, and then swap it onto the 14b!

Yha that's what I was thinking and where I am confused. I though the turbine wheel was the same for 14b, 16g, 18g, 20g and that you could just machine the TDO5H Comp Cover and get w/e Wheel you waned. If that's true then I would pickup a larger Comp Wheel and machined Cover.

 

[bastarddsm]

Yha that's what I was thinking and where I am confused. I though the turbine wheel was the same for 14b, 16g, 18g, 20g and that you could just machine the TDO5H Comp Cover and get w/e Wheel you waned. If that's true then I would pickup a larger Comp Wheel and machined Cover.

no. the exducer of the 16g and 20g is bigger than the 14b. the 20g is around 68mm, and the 14b is like 65 or somthing. look it up on vfaq. Anyway the center housing is machined for the compresor housing to fit down into it. You need to "bore out" the hole for the 20g wheel it fit into it.

 

[agentorange313]

The CHRA also needs to be machined to use the larger compressor wheels (big16g evo3 16g, 20g). The CHRA has a grove or an indentation for the compressor wheel design.

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Most rebuild kits come with the back plating that has been tapered to allow for the new compressor wheel design

Then you can machine the cover to fit.

 

[JusMX141]

It wasn't a "showcase" as much as it was an example of how this kind of thing works. Don't hate.

I appreciate you trying to help me do my job, but the post which was removed had nothing to do with installing larger compressor wheels on 14B's. No hating- only one off-topic post was removed.

 

[sparticus13]

Ok thanks everyone for the great info!

I understand now that there are Flat Back and Super Back Comp Wheels and that the Exducer size needs to match up with the CHAR Center Section. I think I have make a good list of parts needed to change my 1G DSM Manual 14b Turbo with 7cm2 Hot Side to a 20G Hyrbid (bastard 20g or w/e it's called ).

Keeping my 7cm2 78-11830 Turbine Housing.

Replacing the CHAR Cneter Section with:
Turbo Bearing Housing Eclipse Talon TD05H TD06 16G 18G | eBay

Replacing my Comp Wheel and TDO5H Housing with:
Turbo Compressor Housing TD05H + Wheel 20G DSM 1G EVO 3 | eBay

Keeping my Turbine Wheel/Shaft

Getting a Rebuild Kit:
Mitsubishi TD05 TD06 Major Turbocharger Rebuild Kit

If I got my homework right I think this should work.

The rebuild kits has both Flat Back and Super Back parts.

The Comp Housing is machined to fit the 20G Wheel with a 68mm Exducer.

The CHAR/Center Section is good for 18G and the same seller has a 18G Comp Wheel and machined Housing. The 18G wheel is listed with the same 68mm Exducer size. So I am thinking this 18G CHAR is 68mm and will fit the 20G Comp Wheel.

My Turbine housing is 7cm2 and the Turbine Wheel is that same for 14b,16g,18g,20g.

Let me know is I'm wrong abut anything or what you think.
Thanks

 

[agentorange313]

Ok thanks everyone for the great info!

I understand now that there are Flat Back and Super Back Comp Wheels and that the Exducer size needs to match up with the CHAR Center Section. I think I have make a good list of parts needed to change my 1G DSM Manual 14b Turbo with 7cm2 Hot Side to a 20G Hyrbid (bastard 20g or w/e it's called ).

Keeping my 7cm2 78-11830 Turbine Housing.

Replacing the CHAR Cneter Section with:
Turbo Bearing Housing Eclipse Talon TD05H TD06 16G 18G | eBay

Replacing my Comp Wheel and TDO5H Housing with:
Turbo Compressor Housing TD05H + Wheel 20G DSM 1G EVO 3 | eBay

Keeping my Turbine Wheel/Shaft

Getting a Rebuild Kit:
Mitsubishi TD05 TD06 Major Turbocharger Rebuild Kit

If I got my homework right I think this should work.

The rebuild kits has both Flat Back and Super Back parts.

The Comp Housing is machined to fit the 20G Wheel with a 68mm Exducer.

The CHAR/Center Section is good for 18G and the same seller has a 18G Comp Wheel and machined Housing. The 18G wheel is listed with the same 68mm Exducer size. So I am thinking this 18G CHAR is 68mm and will fit the 20G Comp Wheel.

My Turbine housing is 7cm2 and the Turbine Wheel is that same for 14b,16g,18g,20g.

Let me know is I'm wrong abut anything or what you think.
Thanks

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If you look at the picture above, you will see what the exducer and inducer is. Now these measurements do not corrilate to whether the compressor wheel will mate with the CHRA. MHI evo16g, 18g, 20g all have the same compressor size wheels. They will all fit with the same CHRA, its the compressor housing that will need to be changed.

Just to clarify, 7cm housing by MHI are made for TD05 turbine wheels (I am sure that there are exceptions). TD05 turbine wheels can we used with a 14b,16g,18g,20g. They can also be mated with TD06 turbine wheels. It doesn't matter the compressor, it has to do with the turbine wheel size. There are some 20g with TD06 turbine wheels

I have heard ebay CHRA have cracked due to heat, I would get a MHI CHRA and start to build the turbo:
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/414823-20g-ebay-turbo-glowing-red.html

 

[Bud92gsx]

Since you said something about the ebay cartriges cracking...

I will tear mine apart in the spring and take a look...

Mine is an ebay 16g tho.But it did blow..Never had a problem with boosting untill it died..Also never had the manifold turbo or downpipe glowing red...

I have had a manifold and turbo glowing red but that was on a 13g, drifting in the snow..

 

[agentorange313]

Since you said something about the ebay cartriges cracking...

I will tear mine apart in the spring and take a look...

Mine is an ebay 16g tho.But it did blow..Never had a problem with boosting untill it died..Also never had the manifold turbo or downpipe glowing red...

I have had a manifold and turbo glowing red but that was on a 13g, drifting in the snow..

The ebay CHRA is probably like every other ebay component, a gamble. I bet some are good CHRA's and dont crack and some do.

Damn that quality control in China, my people suck sometimes.

 

[Bud92gsx]

A gamble is the best way I've heard to describe ebay turbo's..

But I can rip it open in the spring and find out if it cracked..

I also just ordered and ebay 7cm turbine housing..I'm giving it a 50/50 shot at being ok, and me not having to send it back for a replacement..When I checked out they reminded me, if it was defective to send it back..And Paul 99gstracer has a parts feedback thread/article on them.

I also heard from one other guy, that he had to send his back..

 

[agentorange313]

A gamble is the best way I've heard to describe ebay turbo's..

But I can rip it open in the spring and find out if it cracked..

I also just ordered and ebay 7cm turbine housing..I'm giving it a 50/50 shot at being ok, and me not having to send it back for a replacement..When I checked out they reminded me, if it was defective to send it back..And Paul 99gstracer has a parts feedback thread/article on them.

I also heard from one other guy, that he had to send his back..

Is you ebay turbo water cooled? If it is, it would leak coolant if it was cracked, you would defiantly know it was cracked without having to remove it. The coolant system is pressurized and would be forcing coolant out when warm.

Make sure its not the user that 99gst_racer bought from:
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/art...1680-china-ebay-7cm-td05-turbine-housing.html

definitely good luck with the housing.

 

[Bud92gsx]

Yep the ebay 16 I had was indeed water cooled..So then no cracked center housing then..


Yes that was the article and person I was talking about..Like I said I know of another guy that bought the same one and his was bad too..Which that guy happens to be on this thread as well..

I've got time..JusMX141 is the one who is gonna be mad if I tell him the housing came and I have to send it back..