E85 Tuning w/ AFC NEO... Do I really have to get a DSM link?

[Turbo-addicted]

Ok , my original fuel set up for the this e316g was gasoline but E85 is now just in FL and now I changed plans.... I know I need bigger injectors, my 550s are not even installed and I'm getting 1000cc instead. The 255HP rewired fuel pump should be enough for now, but I run out of money to get the DSM link... I have a brand new AFC NEO but I don't know if I should try to make it work w/ the new fuel set up... I only hear bad things about it when getting bigger injectors, they say it's ok till 650s but the same goes for E85? What should I do?

 

[bluetlr2001]

The afc want tune good with the 1000cc. Plus on some of the neo's they have had a problem with them using them on our cars, or any car that uses a karmen type sensor. I would just run the set-up you have til you can get link or a stand-alone. Heres a link to the write-up of the neo problem.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/art...294820-apexi-neo-karmen-airflow-problems.html

 

[dropt4]

Why are so many people swapping to E85? I know it is cheaper gas, but does it perform better in the Eclipse or something?

 

[gsxtasy]

Why are so many people swapping to E85? I know it is cheaper gas, but does it perform better in the Eclipse or something?

It's like cheap race gas. You just have to use more of it....all of which could have been found out with a search.

 

[jemsoccer]

Why are so many people swapping to E85? I know it is cheaper gas, but does it perform better in the Eclipse or something?

E85 gives you more power. However, it also reduces your MPG. A guy on here said he gets like 18 on the freeway and like 16 or so in town, but with gas he's getting 28 highway and 18 city. So he said its not worth it for the long hull, but he likes the added power in the city. Not to mention its a dollar cheaper.

 

[gsxtasy]

E85 gives you more power. However, it also reduces your MPG. A guy on here said he gets like 18 on the freeway and like 16 or so in town, but with gas he's getting 28 highway and 18 city. So he said its not worth it for the long hull, but he likes the added power in the city. Not to mention its a dollar cheaper.

E85 doesn't "give you more power". The added boost and timing you can run with it does. Putting in a high octane fuel by itself doesn't make a difference in power over pump gas.

 

[jemsoccer]

Here is the link I was referring to...

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/300817-e85.html#post151549884

 

[dropt4]

It is crazy hard to find E85 gas where I live out here.. I think one place has it and it is out of the way to get it before you go to the track.. And thanks gsxtasy, was browsing and thought I would just ask since the question was up about E85..

 

[dropt4]

Here is the link I was referring to...

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/300817-e85.html#post151549884

O yeah right on I read some of that yesterday.. Seems like way too much work redoing everything to save a dollar on gas when you can just get race gas as needed at the track instead..

 

[jemsoccer]

E85 doesn't "give you more power". The added boost and timing you can run with it does. Putting in a high octane fuel by itself doesn't make a difference in power over pump gas.

True... let me rephrase... it allows you to obtain more power over pump gas. Thanks for the clarification.

 

[dropt4]

E85 doesn't "give you more power". The added boost and timing you can run with it does. Putting in a high octane fuel by itself doesn't make a difference in power over pump gas.

So running straight E85 is kind of like putting some 111 in your regular 91 octane than?

 

[dropt4]

True... let me rephrase... it allows you to obtain more power over pump gas. Thanks for the clarification.

Gotcha.. Thanks

 

[gsxtasy]

O yeah right on I read some of that yesterday.. Seems like way too much work redoing everything to save a dollar on gas when you can just get race gas as needed at the track instead..

The purpose of using e85, in my opinion, is not to save money on gas. I wouldn't be driving a high-performance car if that were my goal. It is rather, to have the best performance I can get out of my car on a daily basis. I can drive a block away and fill up for $3/gal, and run a race gas tune everywhere I go. Although, my car is not my DD, so my views would probably be different of those who drive it to work and back.

 

[jemsoccer]

So running straight E85 is kind of like putting some 111 in your regular 91 octane than?

Depending on composition and source, E85 has an octane rating of 100 - 105. So yes it's like dropping 100-105 in your 91 octane.

 

[dropt4]

right on, I just never really thought about using E85 since I read when they first started to sell it that it only gets about half the gas mileage or so, so it is like you actually spend like $6 a gallon to get the gas mileage you would out of regular unleaded gas.

 

[dropt4]

The purpose of using e85, in my opinion, is not to save money on gas. I wouldn't be driving a high-performance car if that were my goal. It is rather, to have the best performance I can get out of my car on a daily basis. I can drive a block away and fill up for $3/gal, and run a race gas tune everywhere I go. Although, my car is not my DD, so my views would probably be different of those who drive it to work and back.

Yeah, but I just go the the track to race, so I never need a "Race tune" fr DD around town.. Never really have the urge to romp on a honda on the highway.... But I see what you mean about it though.. How much did it cost you to convert your whole systme to where you can run it without trouble? I have a pretty built up GST right now, that is why I ask..

 

[Turbo-addicted]

Why are so many people swapping to E85? I know it is cheaper gas, but does it perform better in the Eclipse or something?

Allows more boost, Therefore making more power... cleaner fuel, better than race gas! Cost per mile compared to 93 gas is not cheaper.... but compared to race gas it is. Here in FL 1 galon of 93 gas costs 4.49, E85 costs 3.79 per galon. But MPG on E85 sux... worth the power though!

 

[gsxtasy]

right on, I just never really thought about using E85 since I read when they first started to sell it that it only gets about half the gas mileage or so, so it is like you actually spend like $6 a gallon to get the gas mileage you would out of regular unleaded gas.

It uses roughly 30-ish% more fuel, so it wouldn't be double the cost.

Yeah, but I just go the the track to race, so I never need a "Race tune" fr DD around town.. Never really have the urge to romp on a honda on the highway.... But I see what you mean about it though.. How much did it cost you to convert your whole systme to where you can run it without trouble? I have a pretty built up GST right now, that is why I ask..

I have a 255 in tank feeding a 255 inline, fuelab filter, -6AN from filter to rail with 1600cc injectors and an Aeromotive AFPR. You can get away with a lot less than that. Depending on what turbo you're running, you can get away with a 255, AFPR, pretty big injectors and someway to control them. Just depends on how much fuel volume you need to supply.

 

[dropt4]

Well I have a Evo III 16G with 750cc injectors and a 255 pump.. Do I need more than that to do it? O and my tuning is from a Translator pro tuner..

 

[Turbo-addicted]

The afc want tune good with the 1000cc. Plus on some of the neo's they have had a problem with them using them on our cars, or any car that uses a karmen type sensor. I would just run the set-up you have til you can get link or a stand-alone. Heres a link to the write-up of the neo problem.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/art...294820-apexi-neo-karmen-airflow-problems.html

Yeah... Thanks for that link, Neo really sux.... WTF I mine as well sell the neo and the 550s and save up for a DSM link... Anything else that I might need? My list of parts is listed on my profile...

 

[gsxtasy]

Well I have a Evo III 16G with 750cc injectors and a 255 pump.. Do I need more than that to do it? O and my tuning is from a Translator pro tuner..

You could get a ways with that. Your injectors will be the holding point of your setup, although they would probably due. According to the calculations here: http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-tuning-ecu/253452-e85-injector-max-lb-min-calculations.html

You would have to run closer to the 100% IDC range, but could probably work.


Edit: Holy thread hi-jack batman, I thought i was discussing with the OP, I was mistaken. Sorry, Turbo-addicted

 

[Turbo-addicted]

You could get a ways with that. Your injectors will be the holding point of your setup, although they would probably due. According to the calculations here: http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-tuning-ecu/253452-e85-injector-max-lb-min-calculations.html

You would have to run closer to the 100% IDC range, but could probably work.


Edit: Holy thread hi-jack batman, I thought i was discussing with the OP, I was mistaken. Sorry, Turbo-addicted

That's ok gsxtasy. Works the same!

I was thinking in getting bigger than 1000cc but this is a daily driver... I don't wanna push it too far... Mpg will suck already on the 1000cc...

 

[gsxtasy]

That's ok gsxtasy. Works the same!

I was thinking in getting bigger than 1000cc but this is a daily driver... I don't wanna push it too far... Mpg will suck already on the 1000cc...

Yeah, I've never messed with S-AFC's period, so I have no idea their limitations or anything. Maybe someone with more knowledge on the subject can chime in on that aspect. If you ever got dsmlink or something similar, it would be no problem running some 1150's-1200's, even 1600's if you really wanted to.

 

[Turbo-addicted]

Yeah, I've never messed with S-AFC's period, so I have no idea their limitations or anything. Maybe someone with more knowledge on the subject can chime in on that aspect. If you ever got dsmlink or something similar, it would be no problem running some 1150's-1200's, even 1600's if you really wanted to.

Do I need a logger and a wide band O2?

 

[gsxtasy]

Do I need a logger and a wide band O2?

I think a logger is a must. You can technically get by without a wideband, but it's as close to a must as you can get. They're very nice to have, and I wouldn't tune without one. That is, if you plan on altering your fuel maps and such, like it seems you are planning on doing. But it's your money and car.