filter help!!!!!!

[scorpio87m1]

does it matter what kind of intake Filter........ i have a aftermarket system that is killing the Filter. The turbo is sucking the life out of the filter

 

[spoonman]

There are three different types of filters. Paper which come on stock oem cars, they are very restrictive, flimsy, and can not washable. Foam which is easily washable and has very little restriction, I believe though that they do not filter very well. And then woven filters (K&N filters) which are very strong, are washable, and are not restrictive.

 

[Drubble]

The K&N FIPK was the first mod I did. In fact, I put them on pretty much all the cars I've owned in the past. It's a great product!

 

[DougR]

To everyone But Pure Track guys!
Dont take this as a Flame. Its not!
This is information 80% of Every Racer and daily driver should know and use!

If you DAILY Drive and run a K&N Filter OR any type of washable Filter, Get a Pre filter! aka Filter Bag! You can even use panty hose if your cheap.
Want to know why? Go clean your filter and Let the water drain. Hold it up inbetween you and a bright light... look into the filter. you will see hundreds of HOLES! Those twinkly specks of light you see are HOLES! some are big enough to slide a straight pin right through with NO resistance! Heck even a dirty K&N type filter will still have Holes even after thousands of miles!
These types of filters are nice for track use. But are HORRIBLE for Daily street use!.
I dont care what you say about the filter spray it DOES NOT fill all of the HOLES! O and while you have that filter off. Take your hand and reach into the intake track, wipe your hand around and feel the Dust that has collected. Now imagine the pounds of that same dust that your Engine has ingested! since you installed that filter.
Ever wonder why that fresh engine has blow by only after a few thousand miles??? The filter is why!
BAG THOSE FILTERS!

Links
Disposable Bags
K&N's Reusable Wraps

 

[crimsondragon]

And then there are those track cars that don't even run a filter. Have you ever had a similar experience to the one you're talking about?

 

[DougR]

Yes, I have personal experience with K&N filters killing rings. Due to to mutch dirt passing through them.

One of the Engines I have built was a 2.8 liter chevy V6. after break in and a few hundred miles with absoluty no problems or compression loss. I decided I wanted alil more power. so I tossed on a K&N, Properly lubed!.
The engine lasted 1300 miles or so before the blow by and compression loss was so bad. I ended up selling the entire truck and started fresh with a 4.3 liter S-10.
Which I still drive today! I use a simple cheap cotton guaze filter now WITH a filter bag on it! yea there is power loss, there is trottle response loss. But the engine is still running with over 200K miles!!! and trust me I beat the Dog S#^T out of it daily. But it is fully studded, Blue printed. etc etc....compression? how about 10.8-1
been like this for over 5 years now!

Another example is my brothers camero. Fully built BEAST! He also used to run a exposed K&N filter.. What happend? Same damn thing. Intense Blow buy with in a few hundred miles after installing the K&N!. After a rebuild, He still uses the K&N, but now with a filter Bag! and its been running strong for over 3 years!
this is just 2 examples out of many! vehicals that myself, family members and friends have dealt with, when running exposed K&N's or ANY open element filter of that type.

And no this is Not on dusty roads... This is mid town Houston!

If your a track guy, shure run them exposed or none at all.. but for a Daily driver! BAG IT! or dont use it!

Just my 2 cents on the filter thing...

 

[DougR]

Get what makes You happy.

Just be aware of the Possible problems with High Flow air filters. And if you do go the high flow route. Get the bag!
And never think about it again. just stay up on the mintenance on the air filter and you will ok..

My only point in this thread is to warn, about the dangers of sutch a high flow filter if not used properly...

Im not saying they are bad. Just to take precations.

 

[DSMunknown]

EXTREME PSI : Your #1 Source for In Stock Performance Parts - Vibrant Performance "Open Funnel" Air Filter (4.5" inlet I.D.) - Chrome Cap

 

[crimsondragon]

Yes, I have personal experience with K&N filters killing rings. Due to to mutch dirt passing through them.

One of the Engines I have built was a 2.8 liter chevy V6. after break in and a few hundred miles with absoluty no problems or compression loss. I decided I wanted alil more power. so I tossed on a K&N, Properly lubed!.
The engine lasted 1300 miles or so before the blow by and compression loss was so bad. I ended up selling the entire truck and started fresh with a 4.3 liter S-10.
Which I still drive today! I use a simple cheap cotton guaze filter now WITH a filter bag on it! yea there is power loss, there is trottle response loss. But the engine is still running with over 200K miles!!! and trust me I beat the Dog S#^T out of it daily. But it is fully studded, Blue printed. etc etc....compression? how about 10.8-1
been like this for over 5 years now!

Another example is my brothers camero. Fully built BEAST! He also used to run a exposed K&N filter.. What happend? Same damn thing. Intense Blow buy with in a few hundred miles after installing the K&N!. After a rebuild, He still uses the K&N, but now with a filter Bag! and its been running strong for over 3 years!
this is just 2 examples out of many! vehicals that myself, family members and friends have dealt with, when running exposed K&N's or ANY open element filter of that type.

And no this is Not on dusty roads... This is mid town Houston!

If your a track guy, shure run them exposed or none at all.. but for a Daily driver! BAG IT! or dont use it!

Just my 2 cents on the filter thing...

That's very interesting. I'd expect more from K&N.

 

[Defiant]

Aw, what a bunch of crap.
Unless you live up ten miles of dirt road, you're not going to see enough dust high enough up off the ground to worry about.
Pre filtering? And all the customers are at sea? What the hell sea are they on? I didn't see much dust out there during my time aboard.
Yes, K&N filters are more open than stock. That's where their "benefit" comes from. Chances of getting anything of any consequence through their more-open weave? Almost none, and as the filter is used, that likelihood decreases as the debris it's filtered adds to the effectiveness of the filter itself.
K&N got started with guys running Baja. If they'd had issues, we'd never have heard of them.

As far as an aftermarket intake "killing the Filter", I'd like to know what the hell kind of botchjob is hanging off that intake.

DougR, you sound an awfully lot like you're selling something. Anything you'd like to tell us about your relationship with these sock people, if there is any?

 

[bmoha2]

I like it! I like that it's maintenance free. I had a K&N fipk kit before and had to clean it approx every 10k. The Talon would start running sluggish.

 

[ummdsmwhat]

Foam Filters

 

[scorpio87m1]

Does it really matter how much hp i have to see which one i want. Cause i want alittle over 300

 

[crimsondragon]

You're fine with a regular K&N.

 

[DougR]

No Defiant, Im not selling anything. Merely passing on information I have had dealing with high flow filters and the problems associated with them.

Shure some ppl will go a Lifetime with out damage from a high flow filter. I guess im one of the unlucky ones.
Some ppl are alil more anal as I am when it comes to keeping dirt out of a good engine.
Theres no harm in useing these bags. No harm in telling the stories about my experiences with high flow filters.

Call it what you want.. Its just a good preventative measure.

And BAJA!? dear god man, those guys replace engines more then you change socks! There is NO comparison between the average DSM guy and a BAJA Team! WTF

You want to Test that Filter?
Get a bucket put a cup full of sand in it. Now fill it with water. Dunk that OLD clogged high flow filter into it with the opening up. so that it fills and hold the water. Now lift it out fast. Tell me what color that water is as it flow through the filter!? clear or brown? Exactly. All of that sediment passing through is going to be 10x times larger then what is injested while driving down the road. If that thick a$$ soup passes through it. What do you think road dust does? It never even feels that Clean High flow filter. You might as well not even have one!
Now take into consideration that we are Forced induction engines, who suck down hundreds of cubic feet of air per minute vs a NA engine. Im sorry buddy. I will forever bag my filters, If it helps keep my Multi Thousand dollar engine running strong.

Anyways. Its ultimatly Your decision on how you treat Your engine.

 

[DSM1G90]

I can see the value of the filter "socks" simple due to that I used to do custodial/construction work and using plenty of large shop vacs to draw up construction dust (and we know how fine concrete dust can be-why you wear a face filter/respirator working around this stuff..) that this dust would plug up a reusable filter in a heartbeat IF we didn't put a sock over the filter - an these were of the cloth/paper variety.

It was very easy to wash and rinse out a sock - let it dry while using other washed out socks, and after a good day's vacuuming, then wash and rinse the filter as well.

BUT, to do a filter that was plugged due to someone didn't use a sock, let alone having to clean out the entire vacuum due to the fine dust from just 15 minutes of vacuuming, was the absolute PITS!

What I easily notice that when doing air filter maintenances in stock aircans, is that the accumulation of larger particles that has settled down inside the aircan, and it makes me wonder "if this accumulation of this, makes me wonder how much smaller particles would have gone into my motor if that filter didn't capture it all?

I heard that just a teaspoon of fine sand will not hurt us (maybe make us sick some, but the sand will eventually pass through us, BUT, with that same spoon of sand will take a motor down in a hurry.

One just doesn't know how much dust is in the air especially when we drive - the tires kicking up the dust on the roads even in town. And when a vehicle is recording that negative number of pounds that is recorded on our vacuum gauges hooked up to our intake manifolds, it can be amazing how much suction that a motor can produce and that can be some pretty powerful draw there - major Vacuum Cleaners there...

-DSM

 

[Defiant]

Then I guess you should use two socks. No, wait. Six. Ten. Fifty.

You're not going to get 100% filtering, so long as you have flow. However, that dip test may mark a new level. I won't mention of what, some are having breakfast.