Self Tuning. (fuel and timing)

[leecavturbo]

are alot of you guys heading towards self tuning?
i.e using dsmlink and making fuel and timing adjustments?
if so what devices do you use to monitor:
Knock
Afr
Egt
and is that the minimum you should monitor?

 

[1992awdlaser]

I use Dsmlink. I datalog wideband, knock, timing, coolent temp, intake temp, boostest, mafraw, stft, ltft low, ltft mid, ltft hi, airflow, tps%, injector duty, etc. Go onto DSMLink Homepage and take a look at their site. You can view screenshots of datalogs and view all the features of it.

 

[leecavturbo]

I use Dsmlink. I datalog wideband, knock, timing, coolent temp, intake temp, boostest, mafraw, stft, ltft low, ltft mid, ltft hi, airflow, tps%, injector duty, etc. Go onto DSMLink Homepage and take a look at their site. You can view screenshots of datalogs and view all the features of it.

logging is good, but do you tune yourself?
i.e you just fitted a bigger turbo or fmic or
injectors and now you need to run and adjust
till everything is correct.
normally you would pay a tuner and put it on a RR/dyno
?

 

[lazyazzdaddy]

I personaly use a vdo egt gauge and boost gauge as well as a aem wideband o2 gauge which i also have tapped into my dsm link, knock is read through my dsm link " at least it is with my set up. (6bolt) other than that i pretty much log the same things as
1992awdlaser. good luck!

 

[1992awdlaser]

logging is good, but do you tune yourself?
i.e you just fitted a bigger turbo or fmic or
injectors and now you need to run and adjust
till everything is correct.
normally you would pay a tuner and put it on a RR/dyno
?

Yes, I tune my car myself on the highway. Look at the mods in my profile to see what I put on the car. I put everything on at once and then tuned it. There is no reason to pay somebody to tune your car when you know how to. Even if you don't know how to you can put your logs on the dsmlink forums and they will help you tune it instead of paying somebody.

 

[leecavturbo]

but logging is of no use when your engine will
blow in 3secs when detting due to lean conditions etc!!!!
you need to let off full throttle instantly and then
make your adjustments on the street! ??
i can understand logs for reviewing say
water temps or charge temps to see what
trends there are etc tho

 

[1992awdlaser]

but logging is of no use when your engine will
blow in 3secs when detting due to lean conditions etc!!!!
you need to let off full throttle instantly and then
make your adjustments on the street! ??
i can understand logs for reviewing say
water temps or charge temps to see what
trends there are etc tho

You datalog this stuff so you know what to change in the tune. The only advantage the dyno has over the street is that it will show power and you don't have any other cars around. The dyno isn't magic like you are making it sound. You have the same chance of blowing your engine on a dyno as you do on the street. If you know what you are doing there is no reason to pay somebody to tune like I already mentioned. This means you won't be blowing your engine on the street due to the tune. If I were you though I would pay somebody to tune it. Why are you asking these questions?

 

[leecavturbo]

You datalog this stuff so you know what to change in the tune. The only advantage the dyno has over the street is that it will show power and you don't have any other cars around. The dyno isn't magic like you are making it sound. You have the same chance of blowing your engine on a dyno as you do on the street. If you know what you are doing there is no reason to pay somebody to tune like I already mentioned. This means you won't be blowing your engine on the street due to the tune. If I were you though I would pay somebody to tune it. Why are you asking these questions?

yes i'm totally in agreement about the dyno and road.
but what i'm saying is the logging is no good when your
engine has already blown!
so it boils down to do you have the knowledge to self tune really
i suppose!
i'm asking becasue i'd like to tune my own

 

[lazyazzdaddy]

I have to agree with 92awd the dyno is great if your tuning for max power but for most of us who are looking for a street tune there not all that great, just because you have more power dos'nt mean it's going to be useable power.. if you have or are getting dsmlink they give you instructions for setting a base tune once you get that done you can use the dsmlink to fine tune every thing. dsmlink also reads knock so just keep an eye on your knock and when you start seeing knock back off the gas and add some fuel or pull timeing untill you can get it to between 10.6 and 11.1 afr and no knock. then your good.

 

[1992awdlaser]

If you know how to tune there is no reason to have somebody else do it. Like I said the logging is so you know what to change. How are you going to tune the car without logging? By listening to it and making adjustments till it sounds right? If you don't know how to tune then have somebody else tune it.

 

[leecavturbo]

If you know how to tune there is no reason to have somebody else do it. Like I said the logging is so you know what to change. How are you going to tune the car without logging? By listening to it and making adjustments till it sounds right? If you don't know how to tune then have somebody else tune it.

thats what i'm getting at then "can i do it" if i have the right equipment?
listening yes but with the correct equipment i.e for knock detection you
use headphones yes/no?
afr a wideband ?
i guess these 2 are the most crucial in getting correct or close
to avoid a pretty early engine death?
then fining tuning with data logs after your out of damage territory?

 

[lazyazzdaddy]

just get a wide band o2 and dsm link and you'll be fine

 

[1992awdlaser]

The car comes with a stock knock sensro. Dsmlink allows you to DATALOG knock. You add a wideband to the car like the one I have (AEM Eugo) and then you can DATALOG that also via Dsmlink. Do you see why I am mentioning datalogging so much now? Because datalogging gives you all the readings including knock and air/fuel ratio so you know what to change. This is the process for tuning these cars. Tuning by sound is left to professionals and not many people can do it.

 

[90laserRSfwd]

Unless your Nic Cage "the left bank is running lean (from gone in 60 seconds) you should not tune by ear, on the other hand if you were serious about needing headphones to listen for knock take your car to a professional... And to answer your question, no you don't use headphones to listen for knock....

 

[architechnik]

With dsm link you just hook up the computer and check the screen. Don't go WOT first thing out of the driveway. If you have a wideband O2 setup with a display then you'll know if you've gone lean.

With even just a wideband, AFC, and pocketlogger you can get the vehicle pretty well setup for mild track or DD assuming you're within the standard operating range of the AFC. (No, 1000cc injectors cannot be tuned without an eprom or engine management system.)

For beginners it may be helpful to start with minor modifications. Do as much research as possible on each modification and find out what the acceptable limits are for readings (knock, temps, pressure, etc) and how those modifications will effect the status.

NOTE: Before doing any modifications, make sure the vehicle does not have any existing problems that could cause catastrophic failure from adjustments. Example: do not throw on a bigger turbo and turn it up to 16psi without checking the fuel flow or revving to 8k on a timing belt with 60k miles on it.

 

[turboglenn]

You datalog this stuff so you know what to change in the tune. The only advantage the dyno has over the street is that it will show power and you don't have any other cars around. The dyno isn't magic like you are making it sound. You have the same chance of blowing your engine on a dyno as you do on the street. If you know what you are doing there is no reason to pay somebody to tune like I already mentioned. This means you won't be blowing your engine on the street due to the tune. If I were you though I would pay somebody to tune it. Why are you asking these questions?

Exactly, a dyno isn't magic and a lot of times you will get more load on the street that could turn a "on the edge" dyno tune into a motor shattering lean condition or too much timing. There's a shop here locally that's known for blowing cars up on the dyno. When i started my job working on the Porsche's, i mentioned that import shop's name and the first thing the new boss asked was "how many cars has mike blown up on the dyno now?" There was another thread here recently where a guy ranted on and on about "no professional tuner would tune without a dyno" I didn't reply there as there's no need to argue with the mis informed when they swear they are correct. But, a note about that in general, any professional tuner will know that you can and will experience more load on the track/street than you can get on the dyno, also a dyno doesn't offer real world results in the manner that the car isn't moving so things that depend on air speed ( like intercoolers) and extra load from wind resistance aren't accounted for on a dyno tune

The "self tune" i use is on AEM and ACCELL units, i don't trust it for WOT pulls, but it's nice to have for all your cruising ranges. I let it set fuel only, i do the timing manually, and honestly haven't seen the self tune feature for timing.

I log all pertinent data (long and short fuel trims don't apply on a stand alone though) i monitor timing, IDC, front o2 and wide-band, then most other data is recorded too but these are the ones i look at the most. When you're tuning and see a lean condition you should let off right then and richen all areas where you were in and all ranges above that just to be safe, then once you're overly rich you can start making long data logged pulls and going back through the log to see exactly where you may want to pull or add fuel or timing.

 

[2gGSX]

Many people tune their cars themselves with great results. To echo everyone else, my setup is DSMLink, 3 bar MAP sensor, and a wideband.

You will not blow your car up instantly from trying to tune it yourself if you're smart about how you do it. E.g.--throwing everything on your car and then making pulls while ignoring the fact that you're seeing 10 degrees of timing retardation will definitely hurt your motor. People on the DSMLink forums and here will be more than willing to help you out though.