Boost Leaks!

[RiceKiller_TSi]

Got some, need to make a detector...
I didn't find the info at vfaq.


GOT LINK?

 

[oldman]

http://www.vfaq.com/mods/ICtester.html

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

Thank You Oldman! So fast too!

 

[oldman]

Thank You Oldman! So fast too!

You're welcome, it always pleases me when someone is doing a leak test, especially for the first time. Have fun.

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

Leak found!
Throttle body shaft seals are blown. Yikes! I've just purchased a ton of extra ones so if anybody else is having a hard time tracking them down (Mitsu wants you to purchase the whole throttle body) just hit me up and I will sell you some.

Thanks again Oldman! I will post pics of my modified pressure tester later.

 

[oldman]

should have asked me, I also bought a bunch of them in case if anyone needs them, I have the smaller one for 90 TB as well.

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

should have asked me, I also bought a bunch of them in case if anyone needs them, I have the smaller one for 90 TB as well.

ha ha ha! Its all good though because the guy at Motion Industries hooked me up nicely!
I wouldn't have believed that those little gaskets could leak so much boost if I didn't see it for myself. I lose 10psi continuously through there!

 

[wallyman]

Where did you get the throttle body seals at. I could really use some as well on my 91 TSI.

 

[oldman]

Where did you get the throttle body seals at. I could really use some as well on my 91 TSI.

I've just purchased a ton of extra ones so if anybody else is having a hard time tracking them down (Mitsu wants you to purchase the whole throttle body) just hit me up and I will sell you some.

I also bought a bunch of them in case if anyone needs them

Take it off Rice's hand as he was nice enough to get more for everyone else.

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

Where did you get the throttle body seals at. I could really use some as well on my 91 TSI.

PM me and I'll drop you a pair in the mail!
Here's the link if you want to get them directly from them.
https://www.motionindustries.com/motion3/jsp/mi/index.jsp

I picked mine up locally.

 

[dnhieu]

do the seals come with the metal casing as well as the gasket? whats the diffrence between using just using a regular rubber gasket and the oem gasket?

thanks
david

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

do the seals come with the metal casing as well as the gasket? whats the diffrence between using just using a regular rubber gasket and the oem gasket?

thanks
david

The casings are not included from M.I. you have to reuse your old casings.
As far as rubber goes, not all rubber is created equal. Those rubber seals need to be able to withstand gas and oil without turning into brittle plastic or breaking. The material that is needed is called "vitton"(sp) and the o-ring is called O-12. That is the EXACT size if ordering from M.I.

 

[dnhieu]

damn wish someone would have told me that before i just put some regular rubber seals in my throttle body! them seem to be holding up pretty well tho. its been about 6 months since i took my thottle body apart and replaced the shaft seals. anyways how much are you selling them for i might have to pick up a couple hahaahaha.

 

[oldman]

The ones I got are from Chicago Rawhide which is the entire seal not just the rubber oring. PM me if you guys want them.

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

I'll drop you a pair in the mail for $3 (gas to the post office+shipping ).

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

My home made modified leak detector.


Oh, it attaches to the stock lower intercooler hose.

 

[90gsxmesaaz]

The ones I got are from Chicago Rawhide which is the entire seal not just the rubber oring. PM me if you guys want them.

Oldman, I need throttle body seals like the ones you have with the entire seal. I sent you a PM. Thanks!

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

Problems, problems, problems...

I am still unable to build any boost after replacing my throttle body shaft seals. I pressure tested the intake up to 24psi (the stock bov pops off at 24psi) and it held the pressure like it should for about 30 seconds before reaching zero.

What else would cause a "no boost" condition? Here are some of the symptons the car has.

1. Poor idle when coming to a stop from a roll. It surges up and down.
2. Upon start up the rpms shoot through the roof (above 3k) before coming back down.
3. It stumbles upon acceleration and gets high knock counts with no boost pressure.

Here is what I have checked out to attempt to remedy this problem.

1. Turbo wastegate. I removed the arm and the flapper moves freely. Also the wastegate control keeps it shut tightly. I have not done a visual inspection to the flapper to see if it is sealing.
2. Eyeballed any obvious hoses unplugged.
3. Checked engine compression. Its good because I tested it with the engine cold (Early in the morning and didn't want to wake neighbors)and got 150psi across the board.
4. Checked all plugs. They look fine. No fouling.
5. Pressure tested intake. Held 24psi no problem.

I have not checked my pcv valve because it connected to a hose that runs to the ground and didn't think it would have an effect on my problem or not. Thats why I'm here in this forum asking for advice. Thanks in advanced.

Notes: There is no EGR, the B.I.S.S. is brand new, and the ISC works.

 

[ddavisaf]

I am still unable to build any boost after replacing my throttle body shaft seals. I pressure tested the intake up to 24psi (the stock bov pops off at 24psi) and it held the pressure like it should for about 30 seconds before reaching zero.

Did you gauge actually sit on 24psi for 30 seconds, and THEN start going to zero. You want it to hold steady for 30 seconds before any pressure is released at all.

1. Poor idle when coming to a stop from a roll. It surges up and down.

This would be caused by a bad ISC.
http://dmtalon.v8eaters.com/ISC.html

2. Upon start up the rpms shoot through the roof (above 3k) before coming back down.

Depending on how cold it is, this is normal and caused by the FIAV.

3. It stumbles upon acceleration and gets high knock counts with no boost pressure.

This sounds like a fuel or ignition related problem.
-Check your coil pack's primary and secondary coils for ohms and make sure they are within spec.
-Check your spark plugs and make sure they're NGK BPR6ES gapped at .028" and they're not fouled.
-Check your spark plug wires
-Check your fuel filter
-Check your air filter.
-If you haven't rewired your fuel pump yet, now would be a good time to do so.

I have not checked my pcv valve because it connected to a hose that runs to the ground and didn't think it would have an effect on my problem or not. Thats why I'm here in this forum asking for advice. Thanks in advanced.

Are you sure it's not the valve cover vent? Your pcv is located at the top left corner of the valve cover and should run to a nipple on your intake manifold via a small S-curved hose.
If this is not how it's ran, you want to fix it.

Notes: There is no EGR, the B.I.S.S. is brand new, and the ISC works

Check your EGR and make sure you're not leaking air due to a bad seal.
Re-check your ISC.

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

Did you gauge actually sit on 24psi for 30 seconds, and THEN start going to zero. You want it to hold steady for 30 seconds before any pressure is released at all.

First off, thanks for the reply. No my intake didn't hold the boost for 30 THEN start leaking out... it started leaking out of there faster than that.

This would be caused by a bad ISC.
http://dmtalon.v8eaters.com/ISC.html

Idle was fine before this "no boost" problem.

Depending on how cold it is, this is normal and caused by the FIAV.

This sounds like a fuel or ignition related problem.
-Check your coil pack's primary and secondary coils for ohms and make sure they are within spec.
-Check your spark plugs and make sure they're NGK BPR6ES gapped at .028" and they're not fouled.
-Check your spark plug wires
-Check your fuel filter
-Check your air filter.
-If you haven't rewired your fuel pump yet, now would be a good time to do so.

The car's ignition system seems fine to me. I've got new injectors, new pump, and the coil pack seems good too. No rewire doh. I pushed 23psi before this no boost incident occured.

I have NGK BPR6ES gapped correctly and they are not fouled.

It kinda runs like a N/T Talon now... Once its all warmed up acceleration is pretty smooth minus boost. It runs pig rich too btw. I had to lean it out with the MAFT to stop it from burning a full tank in two days. The car only stumbles on acceleration in first gear at take off before its fully warmed up. Forgot to mention that.

Are you sure it's not the valve cover vent? Your pcv is located at the top left corner of the valve cover and should run to a nipple on your intake manifold via a small S-curved hose.
If this is not how it's ran, you want to fix it..

The valve cover vent is attached to a hose that runs to the ground. There is no filter or breather of any kind in place. The PCV valve is teed off to the valve cover vent and also runs to the ground.

Check your EGR and make sure you're not leaking air due to a bad seal.

Will do.

Re-check your ISC.

Word.

I will check out what you mentioned tonight and see what happens. I am about 3 hours from replacing every vacuum hose on the car and taking the turbo off to visually inspect the turbine side. Lots of fun.

Edit: I just noticed on my lunch break that I'm missing one nut from the exhaust manifold but I doubt that would kill boost 100%.

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

Depending on how cold it is, this is normal and caused by the FIAV.

I'm looking for this. I don't know what function this serves or where its located. I know what it stands for though. Fast Idle Air Valve or somthing.

Edit: I just replaced the PCV because it was no good. Still no boost pressure though.

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

Update: I blocked off the FIAV this weekend hoping that it was the cause of the problem and found out I was wrong again.

Yet more troubleshooting for me... yay. If I find out this is a simple problem I'm gonna slap myself.

 

[oldman]

What exactly was done to the car right before the no boost problem started? You mentioned high knock count when you give it throttle but I don't see a logger in your profile, how are you reading knock?

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

Thanks for all your help Oldman but I have finally found the problem!
I will have to update my profile but I do have a pocket logger. If this site will stay up long enough for me to post pictures of what the problem was that would be great.

 

[RiceKiller_TSi]

This is what happened. I forgot to bring my pics to work today.
The center divider on the exhaust manifold came off and found its way into the turbo!

It broke into two pieces and the larger of the two pieces wedged itself into the fins jamming up my spooling. Once I dissected the turbo the pieces fell right out and there appears to be no damage. The turbo still spins freely with absolutely no shaft play front to back or side to side.

You talking about carbon build up... the turbine side was all caked with black exhaust soot so thick that I had to use brake cleaner+ carb cleaner+ compressed air to get it all off.

Well thats it. I will post pics later on when DSMTuners becomes reliable again. Hope this thread helps someone else having no boost problems.