woould cut bump stops throw off the rear camber?

[DevilSperm]

my tires are SCREWED on my 2g and its all stock...i had it lowered once and had to cut the bump stops off a little...would that mess it up or do i need to look at something else?

 

[Module Unknown]

Maybe your toe in/out is out of whack. That will eat up tires.

Your suspension doesn't rest on the bump stops (at least I would hope it doesn't ) so I don't see having cut bump stops doing anything to affect your camber under normal driving conditions.

You said the car was lowered once? When you put it back to stock did you get an alignment done?

 

[DevilSperm]

Maybe your toe in/out is out of whack. That will eat up tires.

Your suspension doesn't rest on the bump stops (at least I would hope it doesn't ) so I don't see having cut bump stops doing anything to affect your camber under normal driving conditions.

You said the car was lowered once? When you put it back to stock did you get an alignment done?

yeah i wouldnt think it would do anything but its noticably off...i didnt get an alignment done....way too cheap for that i spose i should but all they can adjust is toe right? i didnt think you could adjust the camber on a stock setup...im a suspension noob

 

[LousyDriver]

Alignment is usually less than a pair of tires, get it done.

There's always a way to adjust it if it's off, you can use offset bushings and other tricks. If it's been lowered than that is probably what messed it up, but if you cut the bumpstops off without checking the suspention tavel, then you might have bent or broke something if you bottomed out the car.

 

[DevilSperm]

ive replaced the shocks since then though, everything looks to be ok otherwise....ill get it aligned this week and see if that helps

 

[Forced4]

It's all wheel drive... You have front toe / rear toe + camber. Cambolts can be installed to make camber adjustable. But the bolts yourself and install them. about $15 each. Then go to a shop and it should be about $50-$60.

Rich
Forced 4

 

[jtmcinder]

For the umpteenth time: camber isn't the problen. He is eating his tires because he altered the height and didn't fix the toe. And you can stare at the car all you want; very few people can see non-zero toe unless it's outrageous. If I were forced to guess, I'd say that the jnd for toe is up around .2".

- Jtoby

 

[DevilSperm]

It's all wheel drive... You have front toe / rear toe + camber. Cambolts can be installed to make camber adjustable. But the bolts yourself and install them. about $15 each. Then go to a shop and it should be about $50-$60.

Rich
Forced 4

actually its a fwd n/t next paycheck i plan to get it aligned and hope that cures the problem....i dont drive it enough to pay attention to it...bad on my part

 

[Forced4]

actually its a fwd n/t next paycheck i plan to get it aligned and hope that cures the problem....i dont drive it enough to pay attention to it...bad on my part

Sorry... I was looking at your profile on the left there. I guess I missed the "2G" in there so I thought you were talking about the 1G.

For the umpteenth time: camber isn't the problen. He is eating his tires because he altered the height and didn't fix the toe. And you can stare at the car all you want; very few people can see non-zero toe unless it's outrageous. If I were forced to guess, I'd say that the jnd for toe is up around .2".

For the first time: Sorry if I offended you by my post. Lord knows I wouldn't want to do that. Are you aware that CAMBER affects toe as well? But I will admit I have not seen his tires or his car, so I would have no idea what (is) wearing his tires. I can only speculate as evreryone else did. I'm sure that your intentions are for the best but starting your post (first one in this thread) with sarcasm, as if you know all and we know nothing, can be quite rude.

Thank you for you time.
Rich
Forced 4

 

[cait sith]

Are you aware that CAMBER affects toe as well?

No, it doesn't.

 

[jtmcinder]

For the first time: Sorry if I offended you by my post. Lord knows I wouldn't want to do that. Are you aware that CAMBER affects toe as well? But I will admit I have not seen his tires or his car, so I would have no idea what (is) wearing his tires. I can only speculate as evreryone else did. I'm sure that your intentions are for the best but starting your post (first one in this thread) with sarcasm, as if you know all and we know nothing, can be quite rude.

Camber affects toe??? Let's assume that this was a typo and what you meant to say was that camber affects tire wear. And it does, but not in the way that the search-challenged often think. Camber affects tire wear by concentrating it on a sub-section of the tire. But, for umpteenth plus one time, camber does not increase tire wear. It is non-zero toe (and toe-out in particular) that increases tire wear by causing the tire to scrub across the pavement.

- Jtoby

 

[Forced4]

That is not corrct. However, I do not wish to get into a big debate over this. I will make this as simple as possible...
When correcting an alignment on ANY car that has more than just toe adjustments. CAMBER AND CASTER(when possible) are ALWAYS adjusted first because they affect the toe setting. Yes camber will affect tire wear in the fact that you increase the pressure on one side or the other verses center tread. Toe in/out is the MAJOR cause of uneven tire wear because it focuses the wear at a minimal area (the shoulder) or edge of the tire. This is as you put it "scrubbing" the tread. Camber with toe in/out will therefore wear the tire even quicker. The only non tire wearing angle is caster. This angle will affect a pull as well as wondering or the inability of the steering wheel to return to center after a turn. Camber can also affect a pull, however, Toe in/out does not. Toe affects tire wear and the center of the steering wheel. I will end by saying you are all welcome to check this info and verify it as to be correct, or jsut ignore it and believe what you will.

Long story short... He needs an alignment and a qualified person will be able to correct what angles need correcting.

Rich
Forced 4


Quote:
Originally Posted by Forced4
Are you aware that CAMBER affects toe as well?

No, it doesn't.


Yea it does.

 

[jtmcinder]

If you had said that *changing* the camber or caster on our cars would *change* the toe, then no-one would have disagreed. Problem is, that isn't what you said. If your skin is thin, then be careful how you say things.

Cliff notes: camber and caster are independent of toe (since these are the three orthogonal axes of a wheel), but adjusting your camber or caster on a DSM will change the toe (but not v.v.), which is why camber and caster are set before toe when you get an alignment.

- Jtoby

 

[Forced4]

If you had said that *changing* the camber or caster on our cars would *change* the toe, then no-one would have disagreed. Problem is, that isn't what you said. If your skin is thin, then be careful how you say things.

Cliff notes: camber and caster are independent of toe (since these are the three orthogonal axes of a wheel), but adjusting your camber or caster on a DSM will change the toe (but not v.v.), which is why camber and caster are set before toe when you get an alignment.

- Jtoby

That is waht I was trying to get across. My whole point was that if there is an alteration in the suspension and camber was affected it would affect the toe. If the word "changing " was needed to make that clear then that's my fault.

I don't have " thin skin" I just thought it odd that starting your first post in this thread with...
For the umpteenth time: camber isn't the problem.
...was not needed, due to the fact there were mearly 3 mentions of alignment before that post.
I have been all over this place since then and I see where you got that phrase. Now I understand that you have posted "umpteen" times about alignments. But for the sake of people asking questions being polite and simply pointing them to those posts would have maybe been a better choice.

That's just my opinion, I could be wrong.
Rich
Forced 4

 

[jtmcinder]

Here's the background to my attitude. If we spent less time on repeat questions, we could spend more time on really useful stuff. One of the most-often-repeated questions in this forum concerns tire wear. One of the most-often-repeated *incorrect* answers to this question is to blame it on camber. When I first saw this thread, I was very happy to see that the first answer to the original post was spot-on: Module Unknown said "maybe your toe is out of whack." If that had been the end of the thread, that would have been OK. Yes, we answered a repeat question without suggesting that a search be done, but at least we didn't waste a whole lot of time on it.

Unfortunately, the thread starter, Devil Sperm, didn't listen to the answer he got and went off about camber. And then a few posts later you reinforced this by bringing up camber bolts. That was the last straw for me. Here we were, giving the wrong answer in a thread was a repeat question.

Maybe I should have gone back and told Devil Sperm that Module Unknown gave him the answer and then added that he should do a search (as well as stop being cheap, because it always costs more in the long run), but I was already in a red fog, so I responded to the last post in the thread, which was yours.

I'm sorry if you knew what you were talking about but just didn't say it very well. The reason that I inferred that you did not know what you were talking about is that you talked about camber in a thread about tire wear. I normally save my sarcasm for people who write as if they know something, but don't. For good examples, look for exchanges between me and igs and/or slugracer.

DevilSperm: get your car aligned. Most of all, fix the toe. And do a search next time, OK? There's now a sticky on exactly this issue.

Mods: lock the thread, please.

- Jtoby