HKS Cams Installed!!!

[L2RTSiAWD]

Well the cams went in today. So far everything is cool with idle. I noticed a little difference but I didn't really get on it yet. Tommorow I am gonig to be tuning them up and then we will see what they can really do. I will post back with an update.

Later,

 

[90tsi]

what grind did you get?

 

[L2RTSiAWD]

264/272.

Later,

 

[Claud99gsx]

Im thinking of getting the same ones John, looking forward to hearing your feedback on them.

 

[L2RTSiAWD]

I about to head out now to see what these can do. I'm very hopeful I can tune some mean power from them w/o a dyno. I got my logger so will see what happens. Be back later today with an update.

Later,

 

[Z1500]

John,

Do you have the DSM link? Are you still on the _SW list? We did 272/272 on Pete's 97GSX last weekend, they turned out awsome. They idle better than Web's 'street grind' and have sick top end past redline. Even with the stock 2g head, intake, and TB it was pulling hard to 8k. The DSM link is a totally bad ass tuning tool. We had him dialed in 30min.

Kevin
www.agpturbo.com

 

[L2RTSiAWD]

Hey,

I'm still on the list but since the mods took of the html becasue of that virus going around I can't reply at work from hotmail. I don't DSMlink just AFC. I didn't log anything just trying to break them in for about 50 miles. I got in at about 3/4 throttle and I 4-4.5k I could feel it start to pull. When i shifted at 5k the car said to me "! I want to pull all the way to redline slam that throttle down!!!" In a little bit I'm going to actually do some runs at full throttle and see what she feels like.

Later,

 

[Black95GSX]

Originally posted by Z1500


idle better than Web's 'street grind' www.agpturbo.com

Ouch Kevin I think my car idles damn good for what it has done to it... got 99% of my problems figured out (problems that existed prior to cam install, for the record).... Now I just need to get that FPR. I'm posative that will fix the last of my idle problems!

As far as the difference Cams make... It was UNREAL. Car's best trap prior to cams was 111mph... after cams 119mph. Even then I'm not close to useing the full potential of this turbo, as you have pointed out.

Can't wait to get a 6 bolt in here, ARP's.... Metal HG and crank boost to 27-30psi.... that'll just be SICK.


Then again, I'll need new tires first... already spinning first and second

 

[L2RTSiAWD]

Holy Schnikes!!! afte some minor tuning I was pulling like a mofo!! I even saw 26degrees advance at one point in first gear. I'm going to run some more logs tommorw on the way to work and see if I can't get it fully butt-dyno tuned.

Later,

 

[Black95GSX]

Originally posted by MuttedTSiAWD
Holy Schnikes!!! afte some minor tuning I was pulling like a mofo!! I even saw 26degrees advance at one point in first gear. I'm going to run some more logs tommorw on the way to work and see if I can't get it fully butt-dyno tuned.

Later,

For my car anyway, I noticed that I get more power out of 18 degrees of advance over anything else -- since the DSMLink lets me change timing, I get to play with it often.....
It also seems this works for a lot of other 2g owners.... I know Pete's car saw a full second drop off his car when I adjusted his timing to 18 degrees of advance at top of third.


MuttedTSiAWD -- have you been to the track yet?

 

[L2RTSiAWD]

Ya I'm going to tune more for 18-20 degrees. It's just I never saw my timing go so high at WOT. No I have never been to the track. It's my daily driver so breaking things at the track is not an option for me. eventually I will make my way down there.

Later,

 

[Black95GSX]

Originally posted by MuttedTSiAWD
No I have never been to the track. It's my daily driver so breaking things at the track is not an option for me.

Mine is my daily driver too

Infact, when I ran my 12.0 at 119... I drove 140+ miles to the track.. then drove home.

I beleive in tuning and treating the car nicely, not beating it to hell.....

 

[L2RTSiAWD]

Originally posted by Black95GSX
I beleive in tuning and treating the car nicely, not beating it to hell..... [/B]

Exactly my thoughts. I like to drive quickly but I don't lauch hard at every stoplight and go WOT all the time. I do more spirtied driving.
I know I have the power on tap to win a race or impress someone but I don't feel the need for a ticket or an accident.


Later,

 

[Kevin Jewer]

I believe there is a difference between adjusting a DSMlink to 28 psi, and letting you ECU advance timing to 25. Without DSMlink, that would mean adding knock. I dont think that has ever made me faster ) DSMlink s a bit different since you start with no advance (16 degrees?) and add to it.

 

[niterydr]

Any valve retainers or springs with those or just stock?

 

[Black95GSX]

Originally posted by 95GSXracer
I believe there is a difference between adjusting a DSMlink to 28 psi, and letting you ECU advance timing to 25. Without DSMlink, that would mean adding knock. I dont think that has ever made me faster ) DSMlink s a bit different since you start with no advance (16 degrees?) and add to it.

That is ineffect untrue.

What the DSMLink does for your "base timing" is compensate for injectors. In that I mean.... With an AFC, when you tell it to pull fuel, which hides air counts... which inturn adds timing to compensate for the lower air count.

That is why "everyone" suggests running 660s with an AFC on a 2g.... for max timing. You have to pull quite a bit of fuel to get the best air/fuel ratio, which in turn hides a lot of the "air count" from the ECU, therefore adding timing based off the seen airflow at the ECU.


DSMLink on the other hand, compensates for the 660s directly, without hiding the air counts, you simply change pulse with and a few other goodies to make the 660s run like the 450s did stock (still rich... mind you).

After which point, yes, you see the same timing advance as a bone stock DSM would see (granted it will be a little slower due to the extreme air counts)

If you had a bone stock dsm compaired to a stock dsm with, 550s and a dsmlink, they both would advance timing the exact same. The reason that a DSMLink may not advance as fast as a stock ecu, is that the ecu sees the true airflow, which is a huge difference over a stock airflow with a turbo, let's say the size of a green -- unlike an AFC.

That is why you add timing in the dsmlink, is to compensate for the very conservitive factory spark advance. (Which you are blindly doing with an AFC by installing larger injectors when you are infact not maxing out your stock injectors).

By the way, dsmlink doesn't incease boost (psi)


For the record, I ran an AFC for years prior to the DSMLink. Car runs much better with the DSMLink then it ever could of with an AFC. Not only was WOT improved, but part throttle operations improved.
The best part, is I'm not changing my AFC settings when the weather changes, because your changing rather then hiding..... everything is much more constant and reliable for daily driving, or track days.

 

[Black95GSX]

Originally posted by MuttedTSiAWD
at one point in first gear.

I just now realized you were referring to timing in first gear... missed that the first time I read it.


Timing in first gear is no big deal.... since everything happens so fast (hopefully) that your datalogger isn't able to get an accurate reading. (because rpms are moving too fast)


What kind of timing advance are you seeing in the top of third?... that's the "big deal"

 

[BoostinAWD]

How much did they cost?

Any plans on taking your car to the track any time soon?

 

[BryanK]

Wow... reading some of your posts truly makes me understand what a novice I am. I think I'm gonna go sulk in the newbie section for a while until my confidence is somewhat recovered. Maybe then I can think about deciphering some of what Rob just said about dsmlink. Trying to learn.... but wow, thats about all I have to say.

 

[Kevin Jewer]

I meant to say 18 degrees, not 28 psi. I think a combination of working 12 hour night shifts and wearing two layers of gloves all the time screws up my replies. Hopefully what I said makes more sense now. Adding timing with the DSMlink to 18, or getting knock and having the ECU pull it down to 18 psi are two different things. That is my point in how they work differently. I have never run faster at 18-20 degrees than I do at 25-26 degrees advance. I dont see how that would differ by the method used to achive that level of timing advance. In other words, I dont see how you could run faster with the DSMlink at 18 degrees than you would if it was at 25 degrees. If that was the case then everyone would be retarding thier base timing, not advancing it. Unless it is because you can run leaner at 18 degrees, and you are not necessarily getting knock if it is at that level (as in my setup, 18 degrees would mean knock). Maybe you're on to something I have never heard of. I appreciate the good discussion.

 

[Black95GSX]

Originally posted by 95GSXracer
I meant to say 18 degrees, not 28 psi. Adding timing with the DSMlink to 18, or getting knock and having the ECU pull it down to 18 psi are two different things. That is my point in how they work differently. I have never run faster at 18-20 degrees than I do at 25-26 degrees advance. I dont see how that would differ by the method used to achive that level of timing advance. In other words, I dont see how you could run faster with the DSMlink at 18 degrees than you would if it was at 25 degrees. If that was the case then everyone would be retarding thier base timing, not advancing it. Unless it is because you can run leaner at 18 degrees, and you are not necessarily getting knock if it is at that level (as in my setup, 18 degrees would mean knock). Maybe you're on to something I have never heard of. I appreciate the good discussion.

For the record... 1.7 bar (about 25psi) on 18 degrees of timing = no knock .... if you want to try more timing then that on that much boost, feel free to.... but I suggest buying a spare motor.

When your talking about timing.... are you talking about timing as a whole? The reason I ask, is because then you would see 25-26 degrees of timing in the top of third, don't forget about base timing (which is 5-7 degrees). I'm referring to spark advance only.


I don't get how 18 degrees would give you knock in your "setup" -- the less timing you run, the less prone you are to knock. That's the point of the knock sensor pulling timing. When you get knock, it pulls timing to prevent knock.

 

[L2RTSiAWD]

OK well to put all your questions to rest. I leaned out a little.

Here some logs this morning.

Same afc settings. All 2nd gear. All 18psi. All 91 octane.


Run 1:

5416 16deg
6036 16deg
6324 19deg

Run 2:

5044 17deg
5620 14deg
6192 17deg
6688 [email protected] volts

Run 3:

Logger acting weird

5944 20deg
6832 18deg

Run 4:

5076 17 deg
5652 14 deg
6212 16 deg

I can see I have a flat spot a 5.5k I might move a NE-point there and see what happens.

 

[Black95GSX]

Originally posted by MuttedTSiAWD
I can see I have a flat spot a 5.5k I might move a NE-point there and see what happens.

What are your current high/low settings (threasholds)... and what do you have your 8 adjustments at..

I had the best results with 1k,2k,3k,4k,4.5k,5k,6k,7k and where high throttle was 80% and low was 35%..


Also keep in mind, the longer you've been going WOT, the more innacurate your O2 sensor will be, due to heat.

When Kevin did my exhaust, he relocated my o2 sensor further on the downpipe. I thought he was crazy at first, but my o2 readings are super accurate now, unlike before.

 

[L2RTSiAWD]

Those are where my Ne-Points are now. And I'm at 30% low 60% high
I'm not sure if my exact settings. Have to check on break


Later,

 

[Black95GSX]

Originally posted by MuttedTSiAWD
Those are where my Ne-Points are now. And I'm at 30% low 60% high
I'm not sure if my exact settings. Have to check on break


Later,

You might wanna try 80% for your high threashold....

Just a suggestion