IGNITION SYSTEM (400hp level) ??

[Jason_Crowe11]

Hey all...

I'm getting close to tuning my Laser>>(baseline pull tonight>>dynotuning in August).

I will be tuning for 400hp>>however it may come>>it will come.

My question is:

Will the stock ignition system be ok for 400whp??

I run magnacore 8.5mm wires, and ngk bpr7es plugs at .028 gap(otherwise stock ignition)>>

Anyways....if anyone out there has experience with a 400hp dsm>>and has some input>>it would be greatly appreciated.

THANKS!!
Jason.

 

[ArtOfSpeed]

I am in a similar situation. I posted a query awhile back about ignition systems.
If 400 WHP requires more of your ignition than stock can deliver, what are the options? I know the MSD DIS-2 is a favorite and features 2-step rev limit and multispark capabilities, but what other options are out there? I plan on running the AEM EMS when it is available for the 1G, so I don't really want all the extras most ignition boxes offer as the EMS will provide all the control I need. Extreme now offers a 4-coil Nippondenso setup, but it's rather expensive. What other, less expensive options are out there for us? Anyone?

 

[1QWK4]

Here is a write up from a DSM guru (Rick Shindley)in MN about MSD ignition, he built a 400hp 1G.


MSD = "Multiple Spark Discharge". It's not only the name of a
company, it's also a concept. Some weenies were sitting around
eating donuts when they figured that they could sell a funky ignition
system that fired a spark plug a whole bunch of times in a row in
hopes of better-igniting your engine's fuel/air charge. Better?
Humph.

If you REALLY want a hotter ignition on your 4-cylinder DSM, choose a
four-coil setup and gap the plugs wider. That's all!

Imagine lighting off the fuel/air charge with an initial spark. O.k.
Now the flame front is starting to move away from where the spark
occurred. Now another spark happens. So what? Is there more
fuel/air to light off? MAYBE. That is if the flame front hasn't
progressed very far and the turbulence in the cylinder has blown the
flame front away from the plug gap so new fuel/air can be lit off.
If so, now you have two independent flame fronts, and another, and
another as the turbulence continues and the sparks keep coming.
While this is all very well and good, it will not be consistent as
the turbulence in the cylinder varies with boost and rpm (and other
things). Then, too, with increasing cylinder pressure it is more and
more difficult to even light off a spark (it's a physics thing).

Better there be one big mother spark and then sit back and let the
larger flame front progress naturally, IMHO of course. I believe it
would provide a more consistent result.

I had an MSD in my car once. It didn't make the car faster but I
believe it made the exhaust note a little different at times. I
swear I could hear the multiple discharges in the exhaust note every
once in awhile during deceleration (when unburned gasses would be
plentiful on the exhaust strokes). Other than that, I was down
several hundred dollars and Buschur made another payment on his big
screen TV with my money!

As far as going fast, the MSD people say they pump 480 volts into the
coil primary instead of just 12. Well, that's just crap. They have
to do that to get the lame coil to respond at all to the multiple
whacks it gets from the MSD driver. It's sort of B.S. for the
masses. The bottom line is that they beat the hell out of the coil to
get it to make a bunch of sparks in a short time. They have to
overdrive the primary with a high voltage to get the coil to respond
that often! What they are selling is the multiple spark concept, not
a billion volt spark.

My argument is that MSD is less desirable than single,powerful spark
jumping a large gap. There it is.

 

[Revenant]

The stock ignition system (if in reasonably good condition) will support 400 HP. End of story.

 

[Jason_Crowe11]

THANKS guys.

That's what I was hoping I'd hear.

Reason I came up with the question was due to a local here who dyno'd 345hp or so on a 1G with a 20G, etc....

and the guy at the dyno said he was in need of an ignition. Who knows.

I think I'll be fine...and that just helps re-assure me.

If I do ever decide to upgrade I'll probably do the Extreme 4 coil setup.

(of course they don't give any kind of pictures>>has anyone got a picture of one on a dsm??)_

Laters
Jason.

 

[ArtOfSpeed]

The Extreme 4-coil is the way I am leaning as well. Just wondering if I cannot put something together cheaper than that. Even going with 2 GM DIS (two output towers each) coils with a high output transistor maybe. Any other ideas?