Well, here's my dyno results...

[Phoenyx]

All:

After adding 3" turboback exhaust, and a SAFC-II with fuel pump for fuel. I got the car tuned today at Vishnu Performance. My earlier dyno was with K&N cone and boost at 13psi. I got 153WHP and 172WTQ. It's interesting that Shiv at Vishnu couldn't get much more out of the car without making the engine knock. Second pass with 3" exhaust, etc.. was 164WHP and 166WTQ @15psi on pump gas.

From the images and comparisons, you can clearly see that the car is tuned much better than before. I asked him why the car was knocking and why he wouldn't turn up the boost with me having the fuel for it. The big lesson I learned today was that it's not the *quantity* of fuel but the *quality* of the fuel that prevents detonation (on top of cylinder temperatures). He also told me that he felt the car's timing couldn't be retarded to allow for more boost. So, what do you guys think?

My next mods will be: Apexi ITC and a front-mount intercooler.

Here's the dyno charts from before and after the exhaust and fuel mods:

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-M

 

[DrZiplok]

A couple thoughts.

It's sometimes considered a good tradeoff to go with less boost and more timing, once you hit the knock barrier.

Your second run (.018) you're running a bit too rich around 5500rpm. You really want some datalogger numbers to know whether it'd be safe to lean back out again.

I'd hazard a guess that you're heatsoaking on the dyno, too.

One more thing to look at; with the sort of mileage you've got, crud in your combustion chambers will increase the likelihood of knock. The cure would be a couple cans of MCCC.

 

[Phoenyx]

Originally posted by DrZiplok
A couple thoughts.

It's sometimes considered a good tradeoff to go with less boost and more timing, once you hit the knock barrier.

Your second run (.018) you're running a bit too rich around 5500rpm. You really want some datalogger numbers to know whether it'd be safe to lean back out again.

I'd hazard a guess that you're heatsoaking on the dyno, too.

One more thing to look at; with the sort of mileage you've got, crud in your combustion chambers will increase the likelihood of knock. The cure would be a couple cans of MCCC.

Yea. I asked Shiv about this and he said he had to keep the mixture very rich at that range because that's when the car wanted to knock.

Heatsoak - definitely. But doesn't all cars that get on the dyno?

My mileage is 84,100 which isn't too shabby for a 90, but I'll definitely look into that.

Thanks for the input!

-M

 

[TRBOTSI]

That's really not much better than stock numbers...

 

[EvoSix]

That dyno is one strict puppy. I dyno'd my car at the Febuary DSM meet. I wasn't expecting my numbers to be on the low side; 191 whp at 17 psi.

 

[JayHass]

Originally posted by TRBOTSI
That's really not much better than stock numbers...

That's worse than my stock numbers. (No offense!)

My car sat in a holding yard for about 2 years with a window smashed out, we got it running, tossed it on the dyno stone stock and it belted out 168whp to all four wheels in 103K as it sat for years tune.

Oh yea and it was so rich it bottomed out the scale on the dynojet.

 

[Turbo]

Don't ya hate it when you put your car on the dyno , strap it down .....daydreaming of big numbers....... & then the letters appear across the screen ....."WEAK , GO HOME !"
Jk

 

[rdrkt]

Vishnu uses a completely different dyno than everyone here in America uses 4 wheel dynapack vs dynojet. It usally skews figures 20% low. Also 91 octane just sucks for turbo cars. That is going to make tuning MUCH harder.

However I dont know how much I would trust him tuning DSMs.

 

[Thalomos]

It usally skews figures 20% low.

So your saying he's looking at over 190whp?

 

[rdrkt]

Originally posted by Thalomos
So your saying he's looking at over 190whp?

LoL

How much power do you think a well worn 14b powered DSM makes on 91 octane? Its not going to knock your sucks off I can tell you that much.

 

[JayHass]

Originally posted by rdrkt

LoL

How much power do you think a well worn 14b powered DSM makes on 91 octane? Its not going to knock your sucks off I can tell you that much.

I made 245awhp on the 14b with 94 octane pump gas and no fuel or timing control and some "issues" that surely held the car back. (Like a bad misfire on top)

 

[Phoenyx]

Originally posted by JayHass


I made 245awhp on the 14b with 94 octane pump gas and no fuel or timing control and some "issues" that surely held the car back. (Like a bad misfire on top)

JayHass,

I'm glad you like your car, but the point is Vishnu's dyno is about 15% lower than a conventional dyno jet. That would put me at ~188WHP on a regular dyno. It's easy to make more HP with better octane gas. I'm quite sure you didn't make that figure with just 15psi on a 14b.

In any case, since my car will eventually see over 300WHP on Vishnu's dyno, I'm not really sweating it. I'll have the money to continue to mod it in the direction I'm looking at..

-M

 

[ASZRAEL1266]

That dyno really low balls you. I remember talking to Brett and him saying they had a guy run a WRX on a dyno jet and put out like 270ish on it then come over to his dyno the same day about 20 min diffrence in time and on Vishnu's dyno it put out around 220ish. That is a pretty big diffrence.

 

[JayHass]

Originally posted by Phoenyx


JayHass,

I'm glad you like your car,

Eh, it's okay. Just a $1200 beater I got in trade for some web development. I much prefer my 409whp 2500lb Nissan.

but the point is Vishnu's dyno is about 15% lower than a conventional dyno jet.

Fair enough but that's not what I was replying too.

That would put me at ~188WHP on a regular dyno. It's easy to make more HP with better octane gas.

Actually, now that I think of it my stock numbers might have been on 87 octane that got tossed in just to get it running. :laugh: I have no idea what went in the tank, just that it came from the pump and the cheap ass at the recovery lot paid for it.

Either way, 91 to 94 octance is not going to change the world. It'll help no doubt but it's not like we are talking 116 octane C16 with a low specific gravity.

I'm quite sure you didn't make that figure with just 15psi on a 14b.

16-17psi and the 14b and I think it was 93 octane in the tank.

It was just for kicks as I was hanging around Pruven with some friends who were dynoing their Supra (697whp) 3Si (550awhp) and 300z (330whp just a cat back and boost) I hung with the Z on the highway on the way there so we were all curious to see what my car would lay down.

In any case, since my car will eventually see over 300WHP on Vishnu's dyno, I'm not really sweating it. I'll have the money to continue to mod it in the direction I'm looking at..

Dude, I sincerely hope you do. Honest. I wasn't trying to put you down, just give you some other "real world" numbers to go by. If my car put down what yours did, and I paid for the tuning I would slap someone upside the head.

Either way, something isn't right with your numbers. I would look into it if I were you.

 

[Phoenyx]

Originally posted by JayHass

Either way, something isn't right with your numbers. I would look into it if I were you.

That's where you are wrong. If you wanna say that the dyno reads very low, then say that. But if we are comparing the numbers when the car was stock with K&N cone and 13psi, I *did* get some increase in WHP with adding the exhaust and 14-15psi on 91 pump.

-M

 

[Phoenyx]

Originally posted by JayHass


That's worse than my stock numbers. (No offense!)

My car sat in a holding yard for about 2 years with a window smashed out, we got it running, tossed it on the dyno stone stock and it belted out 168whp to all four wheels in 103K as it sat for years tune.

Oh yea and it was so rich it bottomed out the scale on the dynojet.

Btw, that translates to 142WHP on Vishnu's dyno bone stock. Which is about correct. Going by your figure, I gained 22AWHP by adding the exhaust and turning up the boost to 14psi on 91 pump.

-M

 

[JayHass]

Originally posted by Phoenyx


Btw, that translates to 142WHP on Vishnu's dyno bone stock. Which is about correct. Going by your figure, I gained 22AWHP by adding the exhaust and turning up the boost to 14psi on 91 pump.

-M

Okay and I gained 77awhp by putting on an exhaust and turning up the boost to 16-17psi.

last time I checked that's about 55whp for 2-3psi of boost difference. Your car is sick, face it and find the problem.

 

[JayHass]

Originally posted by Phoenyx


That's where you are wrong. If you wanna say that the dyno reads very low, then say that. But if we are comparing the numbers when the car was stock with K&N cone and 13psi, I *did* get some increase in WHP with adding the exhaust and 14-15psi on 91 pump.

-M

Okay I'm wrong. Nevermind, enjoy your low powered POS.

Have a nice day.

 

[Phoenyx]

Originally posted by JayHass


Okay and I gained 77awhp by putting on an exhaust and turning up the boost to 16-17psi.

last time I checked that's about 55whp for 2-3psi of boost difference. Your car is sick, face it and find the problem.

! You've got to be kidding me! Do you actually think *anyone* is going to believe that *ANY* car will gain 77All-Wheel HP by just adding exhaust and turning up the boost 5psi?????

Yea, my car is sick alright...

-M

 

[Phoenyx]

Originally posted by JayHass


Okay I'm wrong. Nevermind, enjoy your low powered POS.

Have a nice day.

Yep. It's a low powered POS. I will have many nice days...... as long as the mula continues to flow....

Oh, btw, come to Cali with full weight and fill er up with 91 pump. I'll run ya!

-M

 

[ASZRAEL1266]

Dr Ziplock had his car dynoed there he has a 16G fuel AFC and exhuast the basic stuff he put down in the area of 170ish AWHP. There isn't anything wrong with his car its just that Vishnu's dyno is made for tuning, not throwing up big numbers like a dyno jet. The main advantage of Vishnu's dyno is it shows you real time your fuel curves where with a dyno jet you have to wait till after the run for it to display that info. This way if somthing is way wrong they can abort the run befor its to late and it lets them dyno it on the fly. Just my .02

 

[airbrat]

I put down 200hp and 240tq w/ my current mods. I guess thats ok :dunno:

 

[Phoenyx]

Originally posted by airbrat
I put down 200hp and 240tq w/ my current mods. I guess thats ok :dunno:

Mods are? Dynojet? @ what Psi?

In fact, anyone who is on this thread that put their cars on the dyno at Vishnu's on the last dyno day give your numbers and mods, please!

-M

 

[Thalomos]

All cars are different... some dyno's are different... Temps, humidity, etc all change, and all have to do with the numbers...

Go to the track, see what u run with it...

My car only tested 130psi at best in the cylinders (100psi in one)

But 12-13psi, intake/exhaust, NO TUNING, and the car runs a [email protected] pulling timing on the top-end...

So, just take your car to the track, because thats all that matters in the end

 

[DSMJim]

A lot of hating going on in here whoah..

Dude if your happy with your car then super. I would probablly recommend that you goto a Dynojet and just do a pass and see what numbers you pull with your car if your concerned.

I wouldn't be though, just go to the track and make a few passes, if it's running what it should then your all set to go...