Cyclone Intake manny with American ECU

[GSX1G]

As the title says I am running a cyclone intake manifold with the american ecu. Everything seems to be running fine but I have a chance to pick up a ### ecu for a good price. Should I go ahead and do it? Since I'm running fine right now, should I not even mess with it? What would the advantages or disadvantages in performance be, would it make a difference since i'm ruinning fine without it? Thanks for any thought on this

-Dane

 

[98TsiAWD]

I think the cylcone intake has some mechanism in them that open the runners up wider on full throttle. That is controlled by the JDM ECU. With the US ECU it probly just doesnt open and the 1g intake would probly flow better.

 

[GSX1G]

Originally posted by 98TsiAWD
I think the cylcone intake has some mechanism in them that open the runners up wider on full throttle. That is controlled by the JDM ECU. With the US ECU it probly just doesnt open and the 1g intake would probly flow better.

With that being said would it be a good idea to get the japanese ecu then? I how the manifold is supposed to work but just how to do it? Is it typical for sombody to use the cyclone with the american ecu and be running fine like I am? If i do get the jspec ecu is it a direct replacement or do I need to do something else? Is it a lot of trouble? Thanks again

 

[GSX1G]

bump

 

[DrZiplok]

You'd need to add wiring and the vacuum-related parts as well. Plus you'd need to make sure that the J-spec ECU you're looking at actually came from a Cyclone-equipped vehicle in the first place, as there are plenty of those ECUs shipped in Japan for non-Cyclone cars.

 

[Gooberlog]

i had a cyclone engine put in my '91 GSTwhen i had it after my timing belt snapped. Do you have the ### throttle body? it has less vacum lines on it, i think 3 instead of 4, i've never heard of a 4cyl mitsu Intake manifold having the internal flapper for the runners like the 3000GT's are but there might be. When i had my cyclone in my GST my main problem was a fuel cut type of problem when i hit full boost. I think this is because the ### engine has different fuel system for the US ecu. As for just the manifold you might be ok, but if it does have the internal flapper it prob is hurting your performance and i would get the ### ecu.
Gooberlog

 

[CR95GST]

I'll try and answer all your questions....

First off, the actuator on the cyclone manifold is not supposed to feel vac...just boost. If it gets vac, it will ruin the diaphragm and cause a huge boost leak which will give you fuel cut as in Gooberlog's situation. Second, GSX1G, you will need the vacuum canister (acts as a check valve and pressurizes) and the JDM purge solenoid for the canister. The cyclone manifold is set to where it does not open the shorter set of runners until around 6 psi or so (uses low end torque to build the boost and then the short runners for top end). When the ECU feels around 6 psi it will activate the solenoid and the stored air in the container will actuate the "actuator" on the manifold. It really is a pain in the ass to set up. There is one additional way it can work. You can make an MBC that is pressure tested to about 6 psi and put it between the actuator and the manifold. Not sure how the performance is but theoretically it should have the same effect as an MBC vs an elec boost controller. I screwed up the actuator on mine but hooking it up directly to a vacuum source so I ended up ditching it for a US spec manifold. Much easier to deal with and saves a shitload of room under the hood.

 

[Gooberlog]

CR95GST,
So when it uses the short runners at a low RPM, is that like avoiding lag? When it uses the short runners does it do so, in order to create presure easier because there is less space to pressureize? Just trying to get a hold of the whole intake runner theory. Thanks for any info. PS i didn't even know that the JDM manifold had controlled runners when it was on my car. sometimes i feel like a shmuck.
<Gooberlog>

 

[GSX1G]

So you are saying its more trouble than its worth, to get the japanese ecu and getting it working?

 

[DrZiplok]

YES!

 

[GSX1G]

Originally posted by Gooberlog
i had a cyclone engine put in my '91 GSTwhen i had it after my timing belt snapped. Do you have the ### throttle body? it has less vacum lines on it, i think 3 instead of 4, i've never heard of a 4cyl mitsu Intake manifold having the internal flapper for the runners like the 3000GT's are but there might be. When i had my cyclone in my GST my main problem was a fuel cut type of problem when i hit full boost. I think this is because the ### engine has different fuel system for the US ecu. As for just the manifold you might be ok, but if it does have the internal flapper it prob is hurting your performance and i would get the ### ecu.
Gooberlog

Well the engine was shipped from Japan so I'm pretty sure it is the Japanes throttle body, i'll double check

 

[ItsStockOfficer]

It uses the longer runners at low rpms to create a higher port velocity and increase tq. I know that may sounds ass-backwards to you but a long narrow tube will flow alot of air and low rpms because of harmonics and velocities.

Hooking it up is cake with an emerican ecu. hook it up so that it opens at positive manifold presuure, easy to do that. Then put solenoid on the vacuum line so that it opens at 10 psi usinga hobbs switch. By the time your reach 10 psi you want it full open no matter what.

 

[GSX1G]

Interesting, I keep hearin different opinions on the cyclone intake as far as it being a pain in the a$$ to make work properly. Is there nyways to make your suggestion on hooking it up a little clearer, I'm not a newbie but nor do I know enough about this manifold.

 

[ItsStockOfficer]

first, lets make it clear that I think its a dumb thing to waste your time on. With that said, were all allowed to make our own choices, and if your into auto-x it may be helpful.

There is a canister that comes with the manifold, its white with a purple top. When boost reaches that canister, the manifold goes into high rpm/boost mode. All you have yo do is control when boost reaches that canister.

A Hobbs switch is a switch they sell at napa that bridges a circuit at a preset boost level. There normally adjustable from 5-20 psi or some similair range.

A solenoid is just a gate that opens and closes when you give it electricity.

So you hook up a vacuum line to the little canister and the car will go into high rpm mode anytime you don't have vacuum. Thats means if you floor the car at 2k rpm the car will still go into high rpm mode and we dont want that.

so you go:

boost source->vacuumline->solenoid->vacuum line->canister

Now the solenoid can control if boost actually reaches the canister with the solenoid. However you don't wanna drive around with a button and press it at high rpms!

So you ground one side of the solenoid, then run a poisitive wire to the hobbs switch, then a positive wire from the other side of the hobbs switch to the positive battery terminal. Set the hobbs switch for 10 or 12 psi. Now when you hit 10 psi or so the hobbs switch bridges the positive wires, the solenoid opens, boost reaches the canister, and your in high rpm full throttle mode.

Sean

 

[GSX1G]

Originally posted by ItsStockOfficer
first, lets make it clear that I think its a dumb thing to waste your time on. With that said, were all allowed to make our own choices, and if your into auto-x it may be helpful.

There is a canister that comes with the manifold, its white with a purple top. When boost reaches that canister, the manifold goes into high rpm/boost mode. All you have yo do is control when boost reaches that canister.

A Hobbs switch is a switch they sell at napa that bridges a circuit at a preset boost level. There normally adjustable from 5-20 psi or some similair range.

A solenoid is just a gate that opens and closes when you give it electricity.

So you hook up a vacuum line to the little canister and the car will go into high rpm mode anytime you don't have vacuum. Thats means if you floor the car at 2k rpm the car will still go into high rpm mode and we dont want that.

so you go:

boost source->vacuumline->solenoid->vacuum line->canister

Now the solenoid can control if boost actually reaches the canister with the solenoid. However you don't wanna drive around with a button and press it at high rpms!

So you ground one side of the solenoid, then run a poisitive wire to the hobbs switch, then a positive wire from the other side of the hobbs switch to the positive battery terminal. Set the hobbs switch for 10 or 12 psi. Now when you hit 10 psi or so the hobbs switch bridges the positive wires, the solenoid opens, boost reaches the canister, and your in high rpm full throttle mode.

Sean

I really appreciate you taking the time to explain that to me. I'm gonna try to give it a shot but if I run into problems I'll just forget about it. Thanks you again for your time.

 

[ItsStockOfficer]

setup up the vacuum line system and run the racuum line into the car and make sure thats all working before you swap intake manis....remember the cyclone IM has 3 im gaskets, and if you blow one, your completely ####ed, so whys that a good idea?


Sean

 

[GSX1G]

, who said anything about swaping manifolds, I already have it on and have had it on for months, i just don't have a japanese ecu

 

[ItsStockOfficer]

! so you butterfly are always closed? Your car must have shit for topend!

Sean

 

[GSX1G]

hahah well yeah you could put it that way, The car came with the JDM engine and the cyclone intake, I don't know what I can do with it other than either try to make it work, or pitch it and get an extrude honed normal 1g intake, or venom or what?

 

[ItsStockOfficer]

Nah, yours is fine, You can make it work or you can even just zip tie the butter flys open and have the same power as a 1g intake.

Extrude honed intake are lame, the flow a bit more air but dont change runner length and thats where real power is.

Venoms are prett shitty.

The best manifold are magnusmotorsports.com

and the automotorsports manifold


Sean

 

[GSX1G]

Originally posted by ItsStockOfficer
Nah, yours is fine, You can make it work or you can even just zip tie the butter flys open and have the same power as a 1g intake.

Extrude honed intake are lame, the flow a bit more air but dont change runner length and thats where real power is.

Venoms are prett shitty.

The best manifold are magnusmotorsports.com

and the automotorsports manifold


Sean

It it hard to zip tie the buttryflies? Where do I look to do that? If I go for a Different Manifold all together to I need to change anything else? I'm pretty stock right now, a few things here and there, there listed in my profile. Thank you so much again, you're really helping me a lot

 

[BoostinByU]

ok i have the lancer evo 3 motor (cyclone) i also have the cyclone ECU but when i tried to install it i found out that i would need somebody from MIT to do it or find the jdm wireing harness. my question is where do i find the harness?

 

[ItsStockOfficer]

juts use the american harness and a evo3 motor will oly fit in a 2g.

Sean

 

[BoostinByU]

Originally posted by ItsStockOfficer
juts use the american harness and a evo3 motor will oly fit in a 2g.

Sean

1: there i a big difference in the numbers of connectors between the cyclone eco and the american ecu

2: the evo 3 motor fit just fine in my 1g

 

[ItsStockOfficer]

Use a american ecu and an american harness. The Evo 1-3 engine is like a 2g with 3 tranny mount's and one engine amount above the tbelt. It has a small intake manifold, smaller head ports and is nothing impressive. Has a nic compression ratio of 8.2:1 for the Evo 3. Only bolts into a 2g

The typical cyclone engine is from a Galant VR4