[RESOLVED] Can't Set Base Timing Using CAS

[snowborder714]

I originally thought that my timing was off, but that is not the case now that I have set it (http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/cylinder-head-short-block/301391-my-timing-off-2.html). After redoing the timing, I tried setting the base timing by adjusting my CAS. I have a 1g 7 bolt block and head with a 1g CAS. I grounded timing using DSMlink and left the laptop logging. We turned all electronics off, nothing was drawing power, it was up to operating temps, we hooked the inductive clamp on the spark plug wire coming from the #1 cylinder, and the timing mark had a fresh coat of white out.

While moving the CAS around, I can sometimes see the mark. Most of the time it is way below the guide marks on the timing belt cover. When retarded the whole way, it's the closest it gets to the guide marks, but is still about 15* away from the guide marks. We did make sure the CAS wasn't 180* out (it was the first time, but we fixed it). And we also checked the crank pulley and saw no signs of separation.

The reason I'm trying to reset my timing is that I replaced the o-ring on the CAS. One thing happened (that I just remembered tonight) to the CAS while it was off. It got knocked off of a mini-fridge onto a concrete garage floor. Would this cause my issue? Is there something stupid that I forgot to do or that I'm missing?

 

[Boosted98gsx]

Time to replace the CAS

 

[turbosax2]

How did you come to that solution? Is there a way the cas can be tested first?

 

[Boosted98gsx]

Yea, replacing it and seeing if it rectifies the issue

 

[turbosax2]

Let me rephrase: Is there a way to test the cas without spending money? We don't know anybody with a 1g around here so we can't swap another one on without buying one.

 

[Boosted98gsx]

Not that I know of. Replacing the CAS is going to give you less headache in the long run. Double check that your car's timing belt is done right. You may be a tooth off.

 

[turbosax2]

We just did the timing belt (see the link in the first post). The timing marks were verified several times before we put everything back together. After everything was together we checked the cam gear marks several times and they still line up fine.

 

[Boosted98gsx]

Did you spin the motor (by the crank sprocket) by hand 6 times then verify that everything was still lined up before starting the engine?

 

[turbosax2]

Yes sir, did that twice. Like said in his other thread, the gap between the tensioner and tensioner arm was smaller than the allowed limit but the belt tension felt good so we didn't worry about it. But the timing marks always lined up fine.

 

[Boosted98gsx]

The only thing I can recommend then is to replace your CAS with a known working one. I know not of a way to test a CAS. There has to be someone local (or a junk yard) that you can acquire a CAS from to find out.

 

[Freerevving]

wait... below, meaning counter-clockwise, that's really advanced... not sure what would cause that... as mentioned maybe the CAS

 

[turbosax2]

Correct, the mark is below (counterclockwise).

 

[Auto RS T]

How do you verify that the Timing is grounded through DSMlink? How does one know when the the ECU is still in control? I have my way, but I'm sure there is a better way.

I verify my connection on the ground plug on my 1G by having the motor running, then snapping on the grounded jumper wire and listening for the engine speed to change.

Could you guys do this with link on your 2g? Have it running then ground the ECU through link and listen for the change?

 

[r1991_4g63t]

you have to unplug the logger from the vehicle or it thinks your trying to set idle

 

[turbosax2]

How do you verify that the Timing is grounded through DSMlink? How does one know when the the ECU is still in control? I have my way, but I'm sure there is a better way.

I verify my connection on the ground plug on my 1G by having the motor running, then snapping on the grounded jumper wire and listening for the engine speed to change.

Could you guys do this with link on your 2g? Have it running then ground the ECU through link and listen for the change?

We do it the same way you do. Have the car running, click the button to ground timing through dsmlink, and you will hear the idle change.

 

[turbosax2]

you have to unplug the logger from the vehicle or it thinks your trying to set idle

Are you sure this is how dsmlink works? We have set the timing before with the laptop hooked up and it has worked fine.

 

[crimsondragon]

There's no instructions in Hayne's on how to test it with a voltmeter?

 

[Auto RS T]

Are you sure this is how dsmlink works? We have set the timing before with the laptop hooked up and it has worked fine.

This method is for a 1g only. Having the logger plugged in while the ignition timing adjustment connector is grounded out will put the car in "idle adjustment mode" on a 1g.

This isn't true for a 2g as it's a whole different animal, OBD II.

 

[snowborder714]

As an answer to someone's question on the link forums, at TDC, the mark on the crank pulley is NOT at 0* on the timing cover. Instead, it is around 8 o'clock. I compared this to my brothers crank pulley and his has the mark at about 10 o'clock, which would line up with the 0* mark. I inspected the dampener for any damage and it looked fine to me, but I now believe the dampener is damaged. What do you guys think?

The crank pulley on the car is the one I believe to be damaged, the one off the car is my brothers. These pictures were taken at TDC, with the cam gear marks in time.

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[1992awdlaser]

How do you verify that the Timing is grounded through DSMlink? How does one know when the the ECU is still in control? I have my way, but I'm sure there is a better way.

Hook up the timing light and watch the activity when it is not grounded. The timing will be jumping around some. When ground timing is checked it should stay in one spot. The ground timing just stabalizes the timing basically.

 

[Auto RS T]

Take the acc. belt off and try to move the outer portion of the balancer back and forth while bolted up. Looks like seperation to me in the 4th pic above the numbers on the pulley. Inbetween the rubber and outer part of the balancer. If it moves seperatly from the bolted on part of the pulley, its bad. Look for that "gap" to change.

EDIT: I was actually referring to the 5th picture, not the 4th.

 

[turbosax2]

Take the acc. belt off and try to move the outer portion of the balancer back and forth while bolted up. Looks like seperation to me in the 4th pic above the numbers on the pulley. Inbetween the rubber and outer part of the balancer. If it moves seperatly from the bolted on part of the pulley, its bad. Look for that "gap" to change.

The 4th picture is my dampener, aka the "good" one, so please don't say it looks bad The pictures on the car are my brothers dampener, the one off the car is mine. I'll go check his out now.

 

[turbosax2]

I couldn't get it to separate at all. I just don't get how the timing mark is at 8 o'clock instead of 10 o'clock

 

[Auto RS T]

The 4th picture is my dampener, aka the "good" one, so please don't say it looks bad The pictures on the car are my brothers dampener, the one off the car is mine. I'll go check his out now.

Ya, I meant the last pic, my fault. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. There I did it so don't say I can't.

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[turbosax2]

Ya, I meant the last pic, my fault. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. There I did it so don't say I can't.

Very good. Now all the way to 10


I'm getting antsy so I'm just gonna change the dampener.