Bronze coating on FP race manifold

[We're on Boost]

All you guys with the FP DSM race manifold with Bronze coating - How's the coating holding up? What does it look like after a couple thousand miles of driving and some hard running? Does it discolor? Rust? Chip, crack, scratch, peel?

Thanks,
Gary

 

[crimsondragon]

If you mean the nickel coating from group buy #3, read my post here:
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/ven...-manifold-group-buy-3-a-12.html#post151512204

It's up for you to decide.

 

[We're on Boost]

If you mean the nickel coating from group buy #3, read my post here

Thanks, hmm, yeah the rust is what I don't want. Don't want a manifold you have to cover up, I want it to look good. The coating they use now is called Bronze and I don't know if it is a completely different coating or if it is just like a different color of the same stuff they used in GB3.

Gary

 

[fwdeclipse]

Yeah the bronze is what they used in the gb3. Mine just has some of the heat color to it but no rust or anything. Although I have only put 200 miles on it.

 

[TuRBoTaLooN]

I have this manifold but didn't get the bronze coating. I sent my manifold to JNZ Finishing (JNZ Tuning) for black ceramic coating. You can actually see a picture of it on JNZ Finishing's website. It looks pretty bad ass ans after a couple hundred miles and a few pulls it's holding out quite nicely.

Another option is to just get the heat shield from JMFab. Although the manifold by itself tends to rust pretty easily without any coatings. So the heatshield will be pretty, but the manifold underneath will be rusty.

 

[tsiboosted]

Gary - I run the FP Race Manifold on my car and have been very pleased with it. Now I do not daily driver my car by any means, but I do race it allot and put it through the ringer. The only colour change I have seen in it is after I heat it up nice and good it turned a slight greenish colour. But nothing all that noticable. And I would venture a guess that my motor is getting hotter than most daily driven cars would ever even think about getting. No scratches, no cracks or anything like that. It is a great product. Here is a picture of it recently. It may not be the best example of it, but you can clearly see there is no major colourization change to the peice at all. I hope this helps.

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[chavez408]

A little faded color should not hold you back from this manifold, imo.

 

[LaserAWD]

I've got a good 4000+ miles of daily driving conditions on my bronze coated manifold and have yet to see any peeling or rusting. Other than the initial rainbow colors and then the rainbow colors dulling to a slight grey look there has been no change to the outside. It has held up perfect and I've driven it in snow and rain.

I highly recommend the bronze coating and I feel you won't ever have a problem with it.

 

[We're on Boost]

Jerry, your fade to gray, does it look pretty much like the picture from TsiBoosted up in post #6? Kind of a silver gray?
The dyno in your profile looks great. What was different on the red and blue runs?

TurboTaloon, the pics on the JNZ site do look really good. I remember some guys complaining a while back that their black Tial wastegate bodies turned white! Some dealer told them the color to get was silver. I wonder if all these coatings turn to silver/gray/whitish after they've been up near their temperature limit a few times? If you have time to take a picture of your JNZ coating one of these days it would be cool.

 

[LaserAWD]

Yes it looks like his but even the flange on mine has lost the rainbow tint. Other than that it pretty much looks just like his picture.

Here's mine after about 1000 miles:

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After more miles the flange that meets the head has just become the same color as the rest of it.

About the dyno graphs, the blue run is a flat 24 psi on race gas where the red run is 30psi but it tapers down to 24psi in the upper rpms. As far as myself and the tuner, Brad Brooks, could figure out I'm maxing out the FP3052. Anything we did to try and get it to hold boost just wouldn't work. Both of those graphs are uncorrected and the dyno was registering above 92 deg F for both of those runs I guess that means it's time for a bigger turbo

I just got it dyno'd yesterday so the time in my sig is on my personal tune which only made 416 on the dyno. Brad got me up to 468awhp on pump gas so I can't wait to go back to the track.

 

[We're on Boost]

Here's mine after about 1000 miles:

Whoa - that is a nice looking engine bay! Good photo too.
What would you say you have for minimum clearance between the wastegate and the nearest object, like PS pump or alternator or whatever? (Not the dipstick - I imagine that is right there).

Yeah I'd say you are maxing out the FP3052, unless you want to go wild with fully ported race head, or stroker, or crazier cams, or something like that. But the FP4R's are crazy enough I think, and you already have some head work (valves) done. The FP web page shows some pretty amazing dynos for the FP3052 but Robert told me those are all stroker motors and they had "everything else" done to them too.

Let's see, if your car is geared like mine, wait a minute - what gear were you in on those dyno pulls? Better yet, what mph would be 4000 rpm normally for your car on the road? I'm trying to see where 4000 rpm would be on your dynos.

Gary

 

[LaserAWD]

The absolute closest thing is the banjo on the top of the wastegate next to the PS pump. It clears by about 1/8" but is tight to get in there and seat the v-band. You also can't have the heat shield on the PS pump anymore or it would hit that for sure.

The second closest thing is the bolt that goes through the mount into the PS pump on the wastegate side. I'd say it's about 3/16" gap there.

The dipstick had to be tweaked to miss the wastegate but it's still bolted to the block and I did it by hand with just a little pressure.

As for the 3052 I remember hearing it was a 2.3L as well and I think at one point they had them labeled with pump, race and one with a 50shot. I believe the 595 was race gas and a 50 shot on a 2.3L, but I could be wrong. I've got just about "everything else" I could have other than higher compression and a stroker of some sort. That or some fancy cnc'd head as you mentioned.

The dyno pulls were all in 3rd gear. I'm not sure what 4k rpms is in 3rd but in 5th it's pushing upwards of 80 if not closer to 90mph. The trans in my car is all stock 1g AWD gearing, in fact it's a stock transmission. I'm also still running stock sized wheels and tires, 205/55R16. I'm sure there's a way to back out the rpm from the mph knowing all that but I can't find the old DSM specific webpage that used to do that for you and I'm feeling lazy right now.

BTW, I posted a thread in the Hangout with more dyno graphs and info on my trip to the dyno including some pump gas numbers. On the pump gas graph he only rev'd my tune out to about 7800 and I believe his tune out to about 86 or 8700. So 100 mph looks to be about 7800-ish rpms in 3rd gear. Does that sound right?

 

[chavez408]

Wouldn't using exhaust wrap around the manifold work just as good as the coating?

 

[kittay]

I had mine ceramic coated locally. It has held up marvelously and the manifold is such a great manifold!
It was alot cheaper to have it done locally- just a thought to consider, maybe call up some powdercoating places and ask if they do ceramic coating and a price quote. (and let them know it is only 1 manifold for a 4 cylinder)

 

[wishihadatalon]

Wouldn't using exhaust wrap around the manifold work just as good as the coating?

Probably better, but it does trap moisture and the manifold isn't tubular so it would probably look fugly as hell. From what I have read, only the Swain Tech coating is a real insulator. The other stuff is applied far too thin for it to keep any heat in. I went with the Swain tech for my girls FP manifold. It should be here in a couple of days in all of its white glory . They say you can paint right over it though, so we will probably pick something other than white.

 

[We're on Boost]

From what I have read, only the Swain Tech coating is a real insulator. The other stuff is applied far too thin for it to keep any heat in. I went with the Swain tech for my girls FP manifold. It should be here in a couple of days in all of its white glory . They say you can paint right over it though, so we will probably pick something other than white.

Take a picture of that puppy if you can, I'd like to see it. If it is really thick it would probably smooth over a lot of the rough grainy look you normally get on a casting.
You know if somebody wanted to really go wild with a cast manifold, you could start out by sanding the casting smooth, then coating it, then friggin polishing the coating. Whew. Or maybe you would put a glaze layer over the coating, like they do with other ceramics. It could even be a metallic glaze - because - it doesn't have to be microwaveable -

Gary

 

[We're on Boost]

The absolute closest thing is the banjo on the top of the wastegate next to the PS pump. It clears by about 1/8" but is tight to get in there and seat the v-band. You also can't have the heat shield on the PS pump anymore or it would hit that for sure.

The second closest thing is the bolt that goes through the mount into the PS pump on the wastegate side. I'd say it's about 3/16" gap there.

The dipstick had to be tweaked to miss the wastegate but it's still bolted to the block and I did it by hand with just a little pressure.
................................
On the pump gas graph he only rev'd my tune out to about 7800 and I believe his tune out to about 86 or 8700. So 100 mph looks to be about 7800-ish rpms in 3rd gear. Does that sound right?

Man that is some really good info on the clearances, thanks!
Those revs & mph sound about right. I looked at one of my logs (1990 talon) and I've got 4000 rpm at about 50 mph in 3rd gear. Calculator can tell me the rest, and it agrees with your 8700 rpm on the big hp run.

Gary

 

[BoostedTalonTS]

I haven't had any issues with my FP manifold's coating... So far, I have about 5k & a few dyno runs on it. No signs of the coating flaking off and/or any rust forming .

I am seeing some discoloration on the runners as they meet the flange. I am running it with a JNZ heat shield, if that makes any difference.


...out of curiosity, are any of you guys running into the same problem I am with melting the lower timing cover next to the exh cam gear, on #1?


Here's some pix:

 

[chavez408]

No melting here, I love the rip glove classic.

 

[We're on Boost]

I haven't had any issues with my FP manifold's coating... So far, I have about 5k & a few dyno runs on it. No signs of the coating flaking off and/or any rust forming .

That's a really good photo. Coating looks thick and very good, very silvery, I don't see any bronze color. The silver looks good. Was that the "bronze" coating?

Gary

 

[BoostedTalonTS]

No melting here, I love the rip glove classic.

Hah hah! -Happens ALL of the time man -Gatta love Costco's bulk disposable gloves for the wrench days

That's a really good photo. Coating looks thick and very good, very silvery, I don't see any bronze color. The silver looks good. Was that the "bronze" coating?

Gary

Thanks man! -It's whatever FP coated them with in the GB#3... It kinda looks like a flat silver with a greeen hue to it up close.

 

[crimsondragon]

I haven't had any issues with my FP manifold's coating... So far, I have about 5k & a few dyno runs on it. No signs of the coating flaking off and/or any rust forming .

I am seeing some discoloration on the runners as they meet the flange. I am running it with a JNZ heat shield, if that makes any difference.


...out of curiosity, are any of you guys running into the same problem I am with melting the lower timing cover next to the exh cam gear, on #1?


Here's some pix:

I haven't looked but I'll check. I honestly doubt it since I go over my engine bay every week or so to make sure everything is in order and I haven't caught sight of melted stuff or the smell of it.

 

[LaserAWD]

My timing cover is fine but I'm not running the heat shield. I wonder if the shield is directing hot air down more and causing your problem?

 

[wishihadatalon]

Take a picture of that puppy if you can, I'd like to see it. If it is really thick it would probably smooth over a lot of the rough grainy look you normally get on a casting.
You know if somebody wanted to really go wild with a cast manifold, you could start out by sanding the casting smooth, then coating it, then friggin polishing the coating. Whew. Or maybe you would put a glaze layer over the coating, like they do with other ceramics. It could even be a metallic glaze - because - it doesn't have to be microwaveable -

Gary

Just received it last night. It is actually very very rough (probably comparable to 80 grit sand paper) It is very very strong from what I can tell so far. I will do my best to snap some pics when I get home, I need some before I paint over the white.

 

[wishihadatalon]

sorry it took so long
These are painted gray. Yes you can paint over the white if you want.

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These are before the gray paint.

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