Does Ball Bearing = LEGEND power and road race spooling.

[focusedrage]

well, my friend says: "dude look at this turbo it makes 500 hp" and im like "dude thats for drag racing... too much lag fo the road track" and he said "you an idiot, get it"

SOOOO i do want 500 hp like any sensible ameican so im thinking aobut just saving alot for a BB, is there one that can make provide for 500 hp with stock like lags? o meaby less than that? or is it just imposible to have a 500 hp daily driver with road corse lag?

(I hope some one is like "yeah it is and i have it")

 

[greathuskie]

it is not going to happen at all with stock lag

you will get 500hp and hit full boost at atleast 4000 rpms

 

[GSX24PSI]

500hp street car(DSM)=alot of broken EXPENSIVE parts&debt

but if you looking for an AWESOME selection of BBs...check out AGP Turbo

 

[focusedrage]

yeah totaly, i think if i were to get a bb i woudl go with the L2R.

"500hp street car(DSM)=alot of broken EXPENSIVE parts&debt" why? what would break? is it the stop and go?

there are alot of cars with 500 hp fom the factoy, is it just that the dsm drive train wasent meant to handle it?

 

[jim97gst]

there are alot of cars with 500 hp fom the factoy

I wouldn't say there are a lot of 500 HP cars from the factory. Only 1 immediately comes to my mind and that's the newest Viper. It makes exactly 500 HP using an 8.3 Liter V10 and costs $80,000! I'm sure there are other factory cars making 500+ horsepower but you're mostly talking about high dollar exotics costing well over $100,000.

is it just that the dsm drive train wasent meant to handle it?

No team of engineers at Mitsubishi ever got together and said "what would happen if someone modified our engine to make more than twice the factory horsepower?" It's pretty damn impresive that you can do it. You're talking about making Viper horsepower with less than 1/4 the displacement. Try and get 400 horsepower out of a 2.2 Liter GM motor on stock internals. It's not gonna happen.

 

[greathuskie]

those ecotecs are pretty strong engines...

 

[GSX24PSI]

cars built for 500hp from the factory are totally different...were talking about all wheel drive sport compact cars...unless you are the safest driver you will break something eventually...John Shepard for example...has a 9 sec car/still a very streetable car/won the street class in the Import Drag Racing Circuit/and through out the WHOLE SEASON never broke one part!alot of it is how he launches it...he babies it off the line the punches it...he is an awsome driver

 

[Bohrn]

also check out SlowBoy racing, Mike has some sweet ball bearings there. Or for less he can build you a real nice ported 16g.

As well, you need more than a turbo to make 500hp. Maybe you are not ready for a turbo that big??

No dis, just askin

 

[focusedrage]

actualy... yeah well i dont plan on drag racing it... so no launches...

i know at some point people will stat makign fun of me for being a "i need a 10 second car" kid... im not, F and the F is dirt, i like road racing more than drag racing, and i know that i will need more than a turbo: the space shuttle needs more than those boosters, but with out them its not getting off the ground.

Currently i am assemblaign a real plan to bing my ca to this 500 hp goal, so that i dont wast money... people have said to start small but i would rather have a full plan so i can stat with the cheeper mods and work my way up, every part towards the geater goal.

Ill post the plan at some point, but im eally thinking of going with buscher stage 3 block and head cause i want relability. this is definaly long term. but i think the ideal situation will be so slowly get evey suppoting mod, so when my t25 craps out, i replace it with a bb and rebuild the engine
and then with tuning there should be 500 horse

and wait does the evo use the 4g63? how much hp does the rally car have?

 

[TRBOTSI]

Keep dreaming little boy

 

[Karim]

A 500hp road raceable dsm? you must be a very rich man. 500hp usually equals a good amount of lag, lag on road course very bad. A 500hp DSM setup for the road course wouldn't be cheap and probably not streetable.

my question to you is why the 500hp number? I mean a well tuned car running an L1R (BB turbo by AGP great for the autocrossers and road racers) would be great for the road course. You may not hit your 500 hp number but it'll be better setup to put down fast times. Also if you really want to see your car move around a road course I can promise you no mod will help you more than a good driving school. Seat time is a must! Tighten the nut behind the wheel then rethink your plans for the car.

Your goals for the car need to be a little more in-depth, are you actually gonna road race this car and take it off the street or by road race do you mean track days. I'm not tyring to flame you here but there's a big differnce between building an actual race car and building a street car that'll be good for track days. Let us know what you want and how crazy your willing to go with cash and if you have a 2nd car etc and we'd probably be able to help you out better.

Karim

 

[DSMJim]

To make 500hp your going to need a serious turbo. The AGP and 2LR etc probablly are not gonig to cut it.

Your going to need a 60-1 or a 62-1 which are monster turbos that support large flow numbers even down low and all the way to redline. However if you want major top end HP your going to end up with a slow spool no matter what you do.

You can raise your compression to 10:1 in your car if you run a Electromotive or Haltech and C16 all the time on the street and get a pair of HKS 272/272 cams that will help with the spooling of a large turbo sooner however your still going to end up with some lag and a lot of top end HP. However it can be done, just don't expect to do it on 94 octance or with a Super AFC

 

[talonted_one]

In my opinion you do not really want 500hp this is why...

it will ocost a boat load for parts.

it will take a very experienced tuner to get everything working right

it will cost a boat load for repairs ...you WILL BE BREAKING PARTS

it will not be a very streetable car...all luxuries will have to go AC.PS etc

it will take a long time for it to happen there for you WILL need a second car.



this is just from what I know to be true.

 

[SOURCE1064]

Originally posted by talonted_one
In my opinion you do not really want 500hp this is why...

it will ocost a boat load for parts.

it will take a very experienced tuner to get everything working right

it will cost a boat load for repairs ...you WILL BE BREAKING PARTS

it will not be a very streetable car...all luxuries will have to go AC.PS etc

it will take a long time for it to happen there for you WILL need a second car.



this is just from what I know to be true.

In total agreement. Don't know about parts breaking yet. Over 26k invested so far in my rebuild.

 

[focusedrage]

yeah yeah ok sheesh... i would think people would be in suport of rediculus hp. I siad 500 because agp claimed that the L2R could suppot that much. The road racing im thinking of would be a daily driver for weekend races... I would like to get as much power as i can from that turbo. i was under the impression that bb turbos would have only slightly worse lag. originaly i was planig on a big 28 killer but i figured i would rather save for what i really want. Meaby the L1R is a happy medium.

 

[red clipse]

AGP says the L2R will support 550 hp at the enigne. That is completely different from wheel hp. Aiming for a 500 hp engine is somewhat more realistic and much easier to achieve.

 

[mclaren55]

Jesus Christ, some of these responses are just plane stupid. How many people here can say they have a 500+WHP Street Driven DSM? Alright, now ask yourself what you are basing all of these "you will break lots of parts, blablabla" on? Here, I have a 525+WHP DSM, that IS driven on the street, and has no less then 450WHP when I take it out. It is RELIABLE, it is EASY to drive. Lag is all relative, and no it doesn't really factor into road racing. My car has been on Mosport, etc. What, are you going to drive around the whole course in fifth? Jesus people, you usually are downshifting in turns, and unless it is a hairpin or something your rev's aren't going to drop substantially enough, lag isn't going to factor in. You are keeping the car above 6000RPM anyways most of the time.

Oh and guess what, I still have power steering, power brakes, power door locks, etc etc etc, the only thing I dumped was A/C because at 9000RPM I shredded belts, and was tired of replacing them. So yes it can be done, but I would go with something larger then an L2R.

My car took 13K to build, that was with my rollcage, gauges, haltech, pistons, etc etc etc. So yes it is going to be expensive, but not 26k expensive.

 

[Pappy]

You should definately look at the L1R if you want very streetable good horsepower. Lets say 350 to the wheels with good tuning.

As for the evo WRC car. Due to air intake restrictions for the class, it makes about 300hp, and 500lb/ft of torque. Without the restrictions it would get upwards around 500hp. But then again they completely dissasemble and rebuild the entire car and engine after each race.

 

[SOURCE1064]

Originally posted by mclaren55
My car took 13K to build, that was with my rollcage, gauges, haltech, pistons, etc etc etc. So yes it is going to be expensive, but not 26k expensive.

I guess that's a perk of being a Vendor, discounted parts and work. That is including alarm, stereo, rims, brakes. Some other guys spent similar amounts.

Brakes= $1300
Rims&tires=$1800
Pistons=$540
60-1 Turbo=$1,250
Rods=$400
HKS Camshafts-$525
FMIC=$900

That's barley anything and it's at $6,715 no engine work, trans work, gauges, boost of fuel computer, injectors, or anything else that I have into it. Trust me if I could pull off 13K with a stand alone, and roll cage I would. Busting my balls because I have to pay full price on everything is foul.

 

[2-0turbo]

Originally posted by mclaren55
What, are you going to drive around the whole course in fifth? Jesus people, you usually are downshifting in turns, and unless it is a hairpin or something your rev's aren't going to drop substantially enough, lag isn't going to factor in. You are keeping the car above 6000RPM anyways most of the time.

Oh and guess what, I still have power steering, power brakes, power door locks, etc etc etc, the only thing I dumped was A/C because at 9000RPM I shredded belts, and was tired of replacing them. So yes it can be done, but I would go with something larger then an L2R.

You open track your car and run it to 9000 RPM all the time? I could see doing that for the 1/4, but road racing is going to take its toll running that thing to 9K all the time. I think a lot of the lag factor would depend on the course. I don't think you would want to run one of these turbos that comes on-line at 5K around the road course. My last track event I did a 14B. This February will be my 50-trim. I'll find out for myself how it is going to be.

 

[mclaren55]

I'm not a vendor. I am not including brakes, suspension, etc. Because that has nothing to do with 500+hp or the creation of. My motor, rollcage (needed for 11.99 or quicker passes), monitoring equipment, etc was included, because that is necessary stuff for 500+WHP. I didn't have any tranny work done until this October, so I also didn't factor that in. You said your rebuild alone has cost 26k, I just don't understand that, and no I am not busting your balls.

Yes the affect of lag is course dependant. I am not talking about solo 1 though, most track guys with 4cyl's do run large turbo's. At least GT30's and up. My friend runs a larger turbo then me, and he is a road course only guy. A real road course and parking lot racing is a whole lot different. And no I am not bashing either one. Yes I do run it at around 8500-9000rpm quite often, and no it hasn't broken. Call it a fluke, etc, but its doing pretty well.

People, I am not busting anyones balls, I am throwing in my opinion on the subject. I have run my car at various places, and am quite pleased with it. I am just stating that it is realistic to have a 500+WHP car that is street driven, if you have the cake.

 

[Bohrn]

I figured that, being the type of vehicle they are, 500+ hp in a street driven car would be possible, just rather expensive.

Glad to see a Canadian doing it, even if you are from Ontario

 

[DSMJim]

Originally posted by mclaren55
I'm not a vendor. I am not including brakes, suspension, etc. Because that has nothing to do with 500+hp or the creation of. My motor, rollcage (needed for 11.99 or quicker passes), monitoring equipment, etc was included, because that is necessary stuff for 500+WHP. I didn't have any tranny work done until this October, so I also didn't factor that in. You said your rebuild alone has cost 26k, I just don't understand that, and no I am not busting your balls.

Yes the affect of lag is course dependant. I am not talking about solo 1 though, most track guys with 4cyl's do run large turbo's. At least GT30's and up. My friend runs a larger turbo then me, and he is a road course only guy. A real road course and parking lot racing is a whole lot different. And no I am not bashing either one. Yes I do run it at around 8500-9000rpm quite often, and no it hasn't broken. Call it a fluke, etc, but its doing pretty well.

People, I am not busting anyones balls, I am throwing in my opinion on the subject. I have run my car at various places, and am quite pleased with it. I am just stating that it is realistic to have a 500+WHP car that is street driven, if you have the cake.

Ian, it's totally different when you have somebody like Marco right around the corner from us. Remember a lot of these guys don't have an experienced tuner or the shops/parts available to them like we do. Yeah you made huge HP, but didn't really drive your car on the street that often, not like a daily driver or anything. I know it got lots of street duty but not like a regular guys car would taking them to work and back etc...

Did you ever sell your car? I saw it in the trader for 37,500 just wondering what going on there. I was hopin you would be back to give marc a hard time next year. He's doin a lot more #### this year and he says he wants to go real fast. Other than my Talon wich were going to build this winter there's not going to be much happenin in the steet class with you gone.

What the deal anyways?

 

[mclaren55]

Well I put 10000km's on it this year in 4 months basically. That is a lot of street duty for a car with that much power, but I understand what you are saying. As for the selling of my car, I tried but no one wanted it. So I am throwing on the GT35R when I get my damn manifold, along with my new fuel system, seats, CF hood, and coil overs. I am aiming for 700WHP when it is all said and done.

All in all, my car saw over 50 passes at the strip, 2 track days, and 10000km's on the street, all abused on regularily. So I would say a 500+WHP DSM can be reliable if done properly.

So Jim I will be competing in Pro Street this year again, I have to defend my title right?

 

[focusedrage]

wow... some one is pasionate... i wasnt really talkign aobut 500 whp... althougth that woudl be nice. the 4g62 has what? 220 bhp? so if i had 500 bhp then i would certaily be happy. hahahah i guess its really a decision between an L2R o an L1R... but as i began to think realisticaly, i would like not to complealty build the bottom end and tranny unless i have too