a lot of white smoke?

[91-gsx]

i think i might have a blown head gasket... i was driving the car to lunch and gunned it. came to go back to work and the car was making a little white smoke and then it just got worse and worse. when i first started the car right now to come back home from work, the car did not let any smoke out. after i revved it to see if it would happen again and let the car warm up, the smoke came right back. it is really bad you guys, not just a puff or 2, i mean a lot of smoke.
might it be the 14b? or something else? anyway, please help.
thanks

 

[eclipsegsxccca]

Whithe smoke = coolant burning. Sounds like either head gasket or turbo, most likley head gasket.

 

[Echo5Zulu]

Head gaskets blown. Hobble or push it to your garage and rebuild it. Might as well replace the seals and everything in the turbo while your at it. THink of it as a learning experience, not a problem.

 

[FWD98GST]

pray that its turbo.. not head gasket...

 

[oldman]

White smoke can mean either HG or turbo.

1. Is the car over heating?

2. Check coolant level and whether you see oil in coolant.

3. Check oil level and coolant in oil.

4. Perform a compression test.

5. Perform a boost leak test, open the oil cap and listen for crankcase leaks.

6. How are your pcv and breather routed? Stock locations?

 

[91-gsx]

White smoke can mean either HG or turbo.

1. Is the car over heating?

no, drove it to work and back, even let it dile until warmed up and revved it. the needle never went past less then half way. or 11 o'clock position.

2.Check coolant level and whether you see oil in coolant.

ill check that, i did notice it was down sense last time, but last time i accidently poured to much and filled it to the brim, so it could have just leveled out sense then.

3. Check oil level and coolant in oil.

this morning i checked it before i drove it and it was right at the second notch so perfect. when i parked the car at work and let it cool down for about 1 1/2 to 2 hours, and came out of work to check it, it was slightly above the second notch, but that could be because the oil did not all come down yet. the oil did not seem contaminated. i always run low on oil, i have replaced the valve cover gasket, oil cap, turbo crush washers, it also has a leak next to the filter housing that i need to tighten with an allen key, but it always seems to drop in oil level.

4. Perform a compression test.

need to do this again, i did it when i bought the car and it was actually above spec by a small amount and every cylinder was almost exactly the same. the car drives and runs well still, it idles the same and when you drive it unless you see or smell the smoke you would never know anything happened.

5. Perform a boost leak test, open the oil cap and listen for crankcase leaks.

i do not have any of the valve cover breathers rerouted, they share one fuel filter that is attached to the tube from the top of the valve cover and another tube spliced in from the side of the valve cover. no way for leaks into the crankcase. only reason i did this is because it use to leak boost into the valve cover then out of the breather because the pcv valve was not working.

6. How are your pcv and breather routed? Stock locations?

same as top.

thanks for all of your guy's help, especially oldman for being so detailed.

 

[oldman]

i have replaced the valve cover gasket, oil cap, turbo crush washers, it also has a leak next to the filter housing that i need to tighten with an allen key, but it always seems to drop in oil level.

Were they all leaking before? Was the dipstick popping out?

only reason i did this is because it use to leak boost into the valve cover then out of the breather because the pcv valve was not working

How long ago did you do this?

i do not have any of the valve cover breathers rerouted, they share one fuel filter that is attached to the tube from the top of the valve cover and another tube spliced in from the side of the valve cover. no way for leaks into the crankcase. .

Hold up, I think we found the problem.

1. Is the fuel filter vented to the atmosphere? Are you basically rerouting the pcv back to the breather valve with a fuel filter in between?

2. Did you boost leak test again after you rerouted the pcv to check if the crankcase is still being pressurized? You can still pressurize the crankcase through worn valves seals/guides and piston rings.

3. Did you hollow out the pcv valve or replace it with a npt straight fitting when you rerouted it?

 

[91-gsx]

Quote:
Originally Posted by 91-gsx
i have replaced the valve cover gasket, oil cap, turbo crush washers, it also has a leak next to the filter housing that i need to tighten with an allen key, but it always seems to drop in oil level.

Were they all leaking before? Was the dipstick popping out?
yes when i bought the car, and yes the dipstick use to pop out and i bought a new one and it does not anymore. the cruch washers were taken out before and put back on using the same ones, this is before i knew i was supposed to replace them all of the time.

Quote:
only reason i did this is because it use to leak boost into the valve cover then out of the breather because the pcv valve was not working

How long ago did you do this?
probably a month or two, i just did the same thing everybody else does, only i do not reroute it so that i do not get oil inside the intake tract.

Quote:
i do not have any of the valve cover breathers rerouted, they share one fuel filter that is attached to the tube from the top of the valve cover and another tube spliced in from the side of the valve cover. no way for leaks into the crankcase. .

Hold up, I think we found the problem.

1. Is the fuel filter vented to the atmosphere? Are you basically rerouting the pcv back to the breather valve with a fuel filter in between?
no no, 2 tubes become 1 through splicing, and then attached to a non-recirculated fuel filter.

2. Did you boost leak test again after you rerouted the pcv to check if the crankcase is still being pressurized? You can still pressurize the crankcase through worn valves seals/guides and piston rings.
i do not think anything i wrong there because the injector seals use to leak a lot and i fixed that, and last time i checked, there was a leak somewhere around the throttle body.

3. Did you hollow out the pcv valve or replace it with a npt straight fitting when you rerouted it?
i just replaced it with a tube thats spliced to the other tube that comes from the left side of the valve cover and then into the non-rerouted fuel filter.

i did not make any stupid mistakes dont worry , but thanks for checking.

 

[Benag]

This just happened to me and it was the turbo. Pull off the intake hose and the ic hose and see if there is a lot of oil in either. Also check the play in the compressor wheel.

 

[91-gsx]

i will definately check today because i have the same mechanic that helped put my clutch in check out the car. if it is the turbo, can it be rebuild or do i have to trash it if the oil and compressor are that messed up?

 

[larsrya8]

if it is the turbo, can it be rebuild or do i have to trash it if the oil and compressor are that messed up?

Personally I would use it as an excuse to get an Evo3 16G. But that's me...

Turbochargers.com has them on sale for $459. For that price you can't afford not to get one. You already have the supporting mods too.

 

[91-gsx]

OK, opened up the intake and there was hell of oil in the intake, this is without a breather rerouted. there was also smoke coming out of the turbine housing. my mechanic said that the turbo is definitely blown. what turbo do you think i should get, a simple EVO 3 or should i go all out and get the 60 trim i wanted? any other suggestions open, but remember that i need this by this weekend.
thanks for the help

 

[oldman]

91-gsx, this is what I was trying to get at before but you were not patient enough to let me finish. Smoking turbo can mean two things.

1. Bad seal caused by excessive shaft play, check for shaft play on the turbo now that you have the intake off. If in fact you have excessive shaft play, you have a bad turbo.

2. Excessive crankcase pressure or clogged/kinked return line, this problem is usually temporary as long as you fixed the problem IN TIME.

Just want to give you a heads up so you don't slap on another turbo to find the same results. Good luck.

 

[91-gsx]

that is what i found kind of weird, the turbo has no shaft play at all. i thought that it had to have a bad turbo. i do have a lot of crank case pressure, the mechanic was pointing this out to me. there would be a release of pressure everytime he unscrewed the oil cap. he also took the line off of the breather nipple and put his finger so that it would cover the hole and let pressure build up. everytime he took his finger off you could hear a hiss or release of pressure. if i have a lot of pressure, what should i do or what is the first step? by the way, there was no coolant in the oil and no oil in the coolant, so it is not a blown head gasket.
please help me figure this out, later.

 

[91-gsx]

the only thing is that do i have to have shaft play to have a blown turbo? there was a lot of oil in the entrance of the turbo, the only way it would do something like that is either through the turbo or being blown out of the exhaust ports. i really just dont know what to do next...

 

[mirkoelek]

dirty-oil intercooler piping wil cause white smoke. that is oil burning

 

[oldman]

There are two major factors involved when it comes to crankcase pressure, the pressurization and ventilation, I think you have both.

1. Ventilation : Dirty intake aside, the stock pcv and breather routing locations are the best, you get a pull from the turbo during boost and a pull from the manifold off boost. Yes, you can re-route it to vent or to a catch can but you must make the path as easy flowing as you possibly can. First, you must either hollow out the existing pcv valve or replace it with a 1/8 npt straight fitting, the pcv valve is designed to be pulled open by vacuum from intake, not by pressure from the crankcase. Secondly, I suggest using the largest hose size possible and run them individually to its own fuel filter instead of merging both into one. Also to keep in mind is that you must pay attention to the fuel filters at all times, if they get clogged, you have problems.

2. Pressurization : Pressure can leak into the crankcase in several ways, pcv valve, valve seal/guide and blow by from piston rings, you can rule out pcv since it's disabled. Tell me what have you done and the results, in detail, concerning compression test and boost leak test so far?

 

[oldman]

BTW the first step is to remove IC and IC pipes and clean them out with gasoline, make sure you check for boost leaks after that. Also remove the oil return line and check for kinks and clogs.

 

[91-gsx]

i really have not done a boost leak test in a while and have not done a compression check sense i bought the car. this might be of some interest to you oldman, when i made a little catch can and ran one hose from the breather to it and another tube from the pcv valve to it, the catch can did collect oil quickly and it was like sludge. i think that is pretty free flowing sense the catch can had a breather on top of it. i also have the pcv valve still in place but it is just routed to the fuel filter now instead of the intake manifold. compression read perfect when i bought the car less then 8 months ago. boost leaks do not exist in the piping, the turbo hisses a little bit, and that leads me to believe that the housing is leaking a little bit, but if you blow some more air in the bov opens on its own so i think that small leak will not make the biggest difference. no matter what i tried, when i pressurized the intake manifold, it would not hold any pressure. i heard a hissing from around the throttle body but left it alone. man i am almost ready to sell this car, i do not have the time for this shit anymore, I'm trying to fix things but one thing after another just goes wrong.

 

[91-gsx]

intercooler pipes were just put back in, and there was a leak form my return line not to long ago and i replaced the gaskets and everthing seemed to be just fine when i checked it while cleaning it.

 

[oldman]

I know that you're frustrated, most of us have been there. Don't think about it too much, time like this is best to just go through the basics, I'll help you lay it out again and you can come back and ask questions through out the process.

1. Hollow out the pcv or replace with a 1/8 npt straight fitting.

2. Reroute both to its own setup or to the catch can like you had it, much better than your current setup.

3. Compression test, both dry and wet.

4. Reapeat the boost leak test, this time start from the TB elbow so you can work on smaller areas at a time. If your last attempt was a complete failure, you have got some serious leaks and I would not be surprised if it has some to do with your possible bad turbo.

Turbo failures mostly comes with causes, swapping the turbo is the easy part, finding out why is the hard part. Have fun troubleshooting.

 

[91-gsx]

thanks for the list, but can i still have a bad turbo even though there is no shaft play? another thing is this, the white smoke is caused be oil burning, that can be either attributed to to much crankcase pressure or a bad turbo right? well when my mechanic was here he wanted to test if the smoke was due to the high pressure by taking off the oil cap while i revved the engine, but that did not make a difference, white smoke still came out, this is what mostly leads me to believe that the white smoke is not due to the crankcase pressure, but i do not know.
thanks for all your help oldman and everybody on this thread, but it is obvious to me that i got ripped when i bought this car, yes it was fun, and was is the main word. it is really taking too much time from me now, i wanted a fast car and that is why i bought this car, but it spends more time parked then it does being fast. i will try because i do not give up easily, and believe me most would have given up on this car already.
thanks for your help oldman and everybody.

 

[oldman]

Are you sure the smoke is pure white without any hint of blue? Even just a little bit? With the amount of oil already leaked into the intake and exhaust system, it will take a lot more than opening the oil cap to clear it up, usually it takes couple days of normal driving. Go through the steps I listed, they are things you should do anyway even if it turns out to be just the turbo at the end.

 

[91-gsx]

yes no blue, and the mechanic even saw it and said that it should not be the head gasket that went out. he concluded that it was the turbo due to the fact that there was oil in the intake and the only other thing wrong, other then the high pressure. i have no problem replacing the turbo, i would rather not but if i have to.... then so be it. but i do not want to replace the turbo and then go through the same stuff because there is so much smoke coming out i cannot drive this in front of people, especially the police.

 

[91-gsx]

another thing oldman, i understand about the boost leaks i was really looking forward to my Christmas break coming up to get rid of all the other problems like the boost leak and over rich mixture that i always have, i think it is due to the fact that the o2 sensor might be out, and now the burning oil cannot be good for the o2 sensor either. i just want the car to run now because like i said i need a car to drive, chose the wrong one for my needs but o well.