Questions about build up (2.4L)

[Jhoe]

I've been working on this project for a little while now. Block and crank out of a Hyundai Sonata (91). I have gone with Ross 9:1 pistons and am going to go with Manley connecting rods.

While talking to my machinist he asked me if there is an oil pump that flows more volume than a stock oil pump.
-Is there a pump out there that I haven't found?

Another question I asked him was if he could do some head work for me, and said he could, but needs to know the angles (5 angle valve job) that are done on the head (he's used to working on v8s). I also asked about +1mm valves and he said he would have to know how big the valves are to begin with, then add the 1mm to check for clearance.
-What are the angles that are used and will +1mm valves fit if I am using Ross 9:1 pistons (from Magnus, 2.4L 9:1)? I will also be using the crank out of the old engine, but it must be ground down on the mains .010 of an inch, is this acceptable with out being nitrited again?
-Do the angles vary by application?

I was going to give the 'revised' lifters a shot.
-Has anyone tried these out yet?

After doing a bit of reading on springs and retainers, I think I am going to go with the Crower spring and retainer kit, and eventually HKS cams.
-Would the kit be over kill on insurance if I wanted to rev 7500-8000, hearing that the stock head will do just under 8000 safely?

Thanks

 

[1fast97gsx]

Our heads have stock 3 angle valve jobs. The more angles the better though IMO. 1mm oversized valves are an excellent mod, but not neccesary unless you plan to make TONS of power, and also not the cheapest thing for a machine shop to set up for you. Not sure about the oil pump. The revised lifters are supposedly worth it ... but I never had any problems with my stock ones even.

 

[Jhoe]

Ya, from the factory came the 3 angle, but I would like to have him do a 5 angle. The machinist cost isn't a problem, he's a friend and is doing it at 'no cost' but of course I wouldn't let him do all of what he is for nothing in return. I was curious about the valves fitting because I've read (what we read isn't always true though as we know) about the pistons having to be made on the top for bigger valves to allow for clearance.
-Is the clearance an issue with the oversized valves with those pistons?

Thanks again

 

[Jhoe]

Alright, got all the questions answered except for the valve job angles.
-Anyone know these 'top secret' angles to use?

 

[Suparata]

Do you really expect somebody who ACTUALLY KNOWS the answer to your question to tell you that “secret”?

 

[Jhoe]

Well I figured if someone has already gone through the trouble of doing this themself they could help everyone else out and at least specify some good numbers to start out with. If not I guess I'm going to have to just start trying different numbers and when I'm finished I plan on posting them to at least give everyone something to start off with and improve upon.

 

[DarthBulk]

You said you got all your questions answered already, but I didn't see any mention of the high volume oil pump. Here is one
http://www.importperformanceparts.net/imports/mitsu_index.html
Just click on oil pumps, then "Toga High Volume Oil Pumps"
I just installed that one on my 2.4L G4CS engine, but haven't run it yet.

 

[Jhoe]

Thanks a lot. I'm using the same block, if you get that running, drop me a line and tell me how it does for you if you remember.

Thanks

 

[NDgsx]

High volume oil pumps are a complete waste. Think about an engine and how the oiling system works and you'll realize that as well.
Watch your oil pressure gauge (aftermarket) and you'll see that (depending on bearing clearances) over 3,500 the oil pressure valve in the filter housing assembly is bypassing excess oil back to the pan. Keep in mind oil pressure is a inderect indaction of flow, larger clearances on your bearing journals/rod side clearance will lower the pressure number, despite the same volume of oil flowing through the system for a given RPM of the pump.
Also keep in mind that bearings don't need oil *pressure in their supply sytem* to run, they need a constant oil supply on the bearing surface. If there is oil there a hydrodynamic wedge will form, regardless of whether the supply of oil is under pressure or not. Anybody ever plaid with two strokes? Hell some old four stroke automotive engines had paddles on the crank and used splash oiling to supply all the oil for the motor, that's right no pump.
So where the hell is this leading? In your engines operating range, 3-9k, you will (in the case of most engines) be at 75psi of oil pressure. What determines that oil pressure? The flow rate of oil throughout the system. All clearances equal, a oil pump that flows 50gpm will actually be pumping the SAME amount of oil through the engine as a 100gpm pump (totally arbritary numbers).
So the 100gpm pump would be flowing more oil, through the bypass valve and back into the oil pan. Complete waste.
You can't get something for nothing, that higher flow pump is an increased parasitic loss over the standard pump. Not only that but since your are compressing the liquid you are also heating it up, remember why we run intercoolers.
In your case remember as well that you are decreasing the required oil supply to the system by blocking of your balance shaft bearings and you may also not be running oil squirters.

So in the end all your "high performance" oil pump is doing is robbing HP and adding heat to your oil. It is a "high performance" pump throuhg, it does flow more. Where that oil goes is another story entirely.
The only time I see a need for a high volume pump is if you are running large bearing clearances and have a large rod side clearance because you are building a endurance engine and require more oil flow accross the journal/bearing to keep oil temperatures down.

I would never run a turned down crank without nitriding it before polishing. Many shops will screw up the fillet radius on the journals as well, if it's to small say hello to a broken crank in no time.

Aside from the increased surface area of the valve allowing for more flow with 1mm over valves you can also cut the seat very high in head. The downside is that you will have to grind the compustion chamber to fully unshourd the valve. As for the valve to piston clearance call up Magnus and talk to them and make sure you know what head gasket you plan on running.

The springs are overkill. The retainers are a good idea.